The Official Dragon Ball (Z, GT, S, etc.) Franchise Discussion Thread v3

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I also don't like how Goku accidentally got stronger. The reason why people love him more than Superman is because Goku had to start from the bottom and work his way up with discipline and hard work, while Superman is gifted with being born OP. Another reason is because Goku actually knows how to fight while Superman just brawls.
 
of course goku always gets given new forms/power-ups... isn't it his show? those hoping the other saiyans will close the gap on him or get new forms are just setting themselves up for a let down.
 
Emporio Alnino said:
of course goku always gets given new forms/power-ups... isn't it his show? those hoping the other saiyans will close the gap on him or get new forms are just setting themselves up for a let down.
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I don't think anyone is complaining that the main character is the strongest among his friends and getting new power ups. The problem is how he obtain them. In Dragon Ball Z, Goku reach new levels with training and self discipline. In Dragon Ball Super, he reached Super Saiyan God over a rediscovered ancient spiritual Saiyan ritual. IMO, that was fucking lame. He reached Ultra Instinct by total accident by absorbing the sprit bomb explosion, which is fucking lame. However, Ultra Instinct Goku is a beast. I just wish he was able to transform into that form with hard work and training.
 
MMouse said:
you really think jiren could take zamasu?

vegito, and trunks couldn't finish him off, it took zeno to wipe him out.

jiren vs fused zamasu would be a good match up
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That's cause merged Zamasu was part immortal. In terms of sheer power, Vegito was above him.
 
TheRuthlessOne said:
In the anime Zamasu took a Final Kamehameha and it didnt even phase him

I think people are sleeping on him

Sure he has some questionable moments...Losing a beam struggle vs Goku for example is pretty stupid. But he looked pretty great vs Vegito
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I think the Final Kamehameha hurt him a lot actually. Before that blast, Merged Zamasu had the voice of Black and Zamasu. After that, it was only Zamasu's voice iirc. So that attack basically killed the Black part entirely.

Someone pointed that out to me. Not sure where though.

It is pretty stupid that he lost that battle vs Goku. Not sure how that's even possible. Potara fusion increases the power by a few hundred times. So unless he was giving 1%, it makes zero sense. He should have easily blown Goku away.
 
7even said:
I don't think anyone is complaining that the main character is the strongest among his friends and getting new power ups. The problem is how he obtain them. In Dragon Ball Z, Goku reach new levels with training and self discipline. In Dragon Ball Super, he reached Super Saiyan God over a rediscovered ancient spiritual Saiyan ritual. IMO, that was fucking lame. He reached Ultra Instinct by total accident by absorbing the sprit bomb explosion, which is fucking lame. However, Ultra Instinct Goku is a beast. I just wish he was able to transform into that form with hard work and training.
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Almost all Goku does is hard work and training. It's just a lot more off screen on super.

Goku has been busting his ass training with vegeta and Whis most of the series and has received multiple boosts in strength from getting rekt by Beerus, freeze, Hit, and Zamasu... all of which I would consider hard work.

I understand where your coming from but Goku in super is a massive far cry from being worthy of comparison to superman as far as not earning your power goes.
 
zamas/black was the shit (especially merged); easily my favorite villain in the franchise. i still hate how the saga ended though.
 
GrizzlyTitan said:
I think the Final Kamehameha hurt him a lot actually. Before that blast, Merged Zamasu had the voice of Black and Zamasu. After that, it was only Zamasu's voice iirc. So that attack basically killed the Black part entirely.

.
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Interesting

I'd have to go back and examine that scene in detail
 
I just thought of something that we have seemingly missed.

When Goku starts testing Jiren and tries his different forms and he goes SSJ God, Jiren doesn't even move and stop every attack with one finger, one fucking finger..

But that is the form that Goku used to put up a good fight again Beerus.. So using this comparison, what the fuck have they got planned for Jiren?

Yeah I know Beerus still won but that is insane how powerful Jiren is and by that feat you could argue he surpasses or atleast rivals Beerus.
 
bigdaddythunder said:
Wow i guess i'm the only one who didn't like that ridiculous power up. UI is cool? No...no its not. Just a different color scheme for Goku. It is always the same damn thing. Goku gets beaten up, receives a fucking handjob power up , and beats the opponent. Doesn't help that all the fights look the same as they did in z. How is it any better?
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SSJ God was a little lame.
Blue was bullshit.
Future Trunks whatever the stupid form he used to kill Zamasu was just plain fuked up poo.
Vegito Blue was just Zz.... speechless.

Ultra Instinct form is explained. And the explanation is almost as good/legit as SSJ2 from SSJ. Not some lame ass random powerup we seen in Black Saga. I could see why many long time fans accepted this power up.

snootylol said:
As for Belmod and Jiren.. Whis made it pretty clear this is probably the mortal stronger then a god of destruction. Its kinda odd.. Jiren has the power of a god but Toppo was in training to take over from Belmod.. Jiren can't be a former god cause the other gods/angels would recognise him
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Just because you are strong doesn't mean you have to be GoD. Jiren could have declined the position, just like Goku will.

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Also to people saying Ultra Instinct Goku almost beat Jiren if not for the defused form.
How about a NO? He landed a double knee.. that's it.
He gets rekt by Jiren even if he pull off another Ultra Instinct during this tournament, which I doubt will happen.

I'm doubting Shirtless Goku will appear. But would love to be proven wrong.
 
SSJ god was really lame.. they just got in a circle and gave power to Goku

Blue was never really explained either especially how Vegeta got it without having SSJ god (this really pissed me off)

Ultra instinct was at least somewhat explained in comparison i give you that..

But SSJ2 was way way better and made sense.. they pushed and pushed to try reach that level.. staying in SSJ 24/7 and the final push was Gohan feeling helpless and raging just like the original SSJ
 
7even said:
I also don't like how Goku accidentally got stronger. The reason why people love him more than Superman is because Goku had to start from the bottom and work his way up with discipline and hard work, while Superman is gifted with being born OP. Another reason is because Goku actually knows how to fight while Superman just brawls.
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stout fellow
 
Was anyone else rooting for Jiren?

This whole thing is Goku's fault and Goku was fighting for his ego while Jiren fault for universe and his comrades.

The thing where Goku swallowed the spirit bomb and turned around and gave Jiren the look he gave Frieza when Frieza killed Krillin was lame. Frieza had just killed his buddy so the pissed off over the shoulder look was warranted. This time he is pissed cause he lost and his ego was bruised.
 
7even said:
I don't think anyone is complaining that the main character is the strongest among his friends and getting new power ups. The problem is how he obtain them. In Dragon Ball Z, Goku reach new levels with training and self discipline. In Dragon Ball Super, he reached Super Saiyan God over a rediscovered ancient spiritual Saiyan ritual. IMO, that was fucking lame. He reached Ultra Instinct by total accident by absorbing the sprit bomb explosion, which is fucking lame. However, Ultra Instinct Goku is a beast. I just wish he was able to transform into that form with hard work and training.
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Seems like him and Vegeta have reach a point were they need a trigger to go further.. just training more ain't gonna do it.. i just wish maybe Roshi had died and triggered it.. as Goku blamed the Gods/zenos for using mortals as playthings

skysolo said:
Was anyone else rooting for Jiren?

This whole thing is Goku's fault and Goku was fighting for his ego while Jiren fault for universe and his comrades.

The thing where Goku swallowed the spirit bomb and turned around and gave Jiren the look he gave Frieza when Frieza killed Krillin was lame. Frieza had just killed his buddy so the pissed off over the shoulder look was warranted. This time he is pissed cause he lost and his ego was bruised.
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It's not his fault though.. Zenos were gonna destroy all the universes in the tournament anyway.. Goku reminded them about the tournament so rather then just straight up blowing them all up.. they gave one universe a chance to be saved
 
That was definitely at bad ass 1 hour special. Frieza's calm and collective mischievous self is also interesting. IMO it looks like he'll help heal goku, but I wonder how strong he will be when it's time to step up his game. Same with Vegeta too.

What's even better is the Hit vs Jiren fight coming up. Looks like Hit is able to get in some blows too, but regardless I hope he doesn't get eliminatd quite yet.
 
I think my favorite part of Goku in UI was treating Toppo and Dyspo like prime Yamcha. I also had a feeling like Vegeta had something up his sleeve for Ribrianne that he wanted to do in front of Goku.
 
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