The Magical Jabs:

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by Sinister, Nov 19, 2008.

  1. Sinister Doctor of Doom

    Sinister
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    Alright, so at the request of those who frequent my log, here's a thread that cover all different types of jabs I know of. I've done my best to find footage of Fighters using each one, so at least there will also be a sense of visual application. Most of these guys just happen to be Champions, too, and one future Champ for visual reference as well, heh heh.

    First there's the "King All" of jabs. "Bazooka" Ike Quartey. Most of youse have seen this before, but it doesn't get much better than this when it comes to the standard jab:

    YouTube - Ike Quartey Prepares For Vernon Forrest

    It's just perfect. Shuck of the shoulder, flex of the knees, a tiny step when he wants to add power, and the cross follows beautifully. Ike's basic jab was hardly ever matched in the Sport. So when you practice your basic jab, that's what you're aiming for.

    It took me FOREVER to think of someone who used the trip-hammer jab, but finally I figured it out. Gentleman (and any ladies who might be looking), Felix "Tito" Trinidad, keep your eye on HOW he throws his jab:

    Trinidad vs. Barnes.

    Notice it's stiff, but there's not a whole lot of bodyweight behind it. He keeps his knuckles close to his cheeks, and the jab falls from there without warning, nice and short usually, but with more range than people think. It's not meant to hurt but it could smash a nose. What it's meant to do is get you looking at it, so you don't see anything else that might come. The trip-hammer style jab is great for making a guy jumpy.

    The slapping jab. When Aaron Pryor went into Boxing mode, he preferred a style of jab that was also meant to merely occupy the opponent's eyes:

    Pryor vs. Arguello.

    Notice how Aaron's jab is almost a back-hand in some cases. He had perfected following it with his cross and left hook. The key to doing this jab right is to throw it off-beat, and/or while moving, and/or while your opponent is setting up his punches. You have to be prepared to fire a combination at any moment, because this style of jab will be countered by a good counter-puncher if you just throw it arbitrarily. But if you throw it anticipating that, you can counter the counter.

    The power-jab. Seemingly out of nowhere Miguel Cotto developed this sickening power-jab. He used it to initiate exchanges against speedster Zab Judah, and get inside where he could damage Zab:

    Miguel Cotto vs Zab Judah

    You can really see Miguel take those almost fencer-esque lunges at Zab with his jab. It kept throwing off Zab's rhythm all night, and busted up his face a bit. This jab is great if you're heavy-handed.

    The pawing jab. This one is almost never done right. But here's the man himself, my own trainer Mike McCallum using it to perfection against Michael Watson (it's tough to notice but what you're looking for is every time Mike sticks his left hand out straight):

    YouTube - MIKE McCALLUM KO'S MICHAEL WATSON

    What the pawing jab can do is turn a normally methodical guy into an accurate volume puncher. Mike was no volume guy, but he'd start cranking that pawing jab and everything else would flow off of it quite easily. It's another distraction, but it's slower to give you a chance to work angles. Your opponent is occupied with repetitious fists coming at him, sure they aren't hard, but that's why you throw in a hard hook or right hand, or uppercut in with them. When done right it, he shouldn't be able to tell where the hard punches are coming from, like poor Watson couldn't.

    Here's also a good little vid where Teddy Atlas speaks about the pawing jab and how it's used to lull an opponent to sleep for the power-punch:



    The flip-jab. It also took me forever to figure out who used a flip-jab, because the guys who use it used it sparingly that you'd be familiar with. Guys like Mayweather, Malignaggi sometimes, guys with very fast hands. But I finally remembered a guy who used it a lot, now watch close because both these guys are two of the fastest guys to grace the ring, so it's going to be hard to see, but here's Buddy McGirt, and what you're looking for is every time he jabs while leaning forward with his left hand low:

    YouTube - Pernell Whitaker vs Buddy McGirt.

    The key of the flip-jab is that it comes up underneath an opponent's guard or chin. It's not very hard, but it can split a guard very well or surprise an opponent who uses a lot of movement the way McGirt neutralized Taylor's movement with it, because Taylor was just a hair faster than the lickety-split McGirt. Plus, it's tough to tell if a guy's going to throw a hook, uppercut, or flip-jab from the correct starting position.

    Courtesy of ambertch: http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f11/long-range-jab-much-win-1237992/#post39412262

    And finally, the up-jab. This is another one that's done from the lead-hand low position, but unlike the flip-jab it doesn't flip the elbow or smack with the top-side of the glove (or at least it shouldn't). This next visual aid is a still photo, but there's a cool ghosting effect from when it was taken that shows the extended arm position when the jab lands:

    [​IMG]

    And of course, that's me.

    Hope this helps fellas. Jabbing is fun, especially if you can pull off more than one of these. For you pressure guys, I advise learning the trip-hammer and power jabs. Interchanging them can get you inside pretty well and bust tight guards. For you speedsters, everything but those two.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 5, 2011
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  2. PivotPunch Red Belt

    PivotPunch
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    So with pushing forward you mean always making a step with the lead foot?

    And how did Quartey get his power into his jabs even without taking steps? Simply hip rotation almost as with a hook? But no foot rotation though, right?

    And from what I understand Cotto's jab is basically about using it with really long steps to cover a lot of siatcne at once and getting the bodyweight into the jab by moving the whole body forward? So basically just a really long jab?
     
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  3. Sinister Doctor of Doom

    Sinister
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    When was Foreman with Futch?
     
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  4. deluxeMT Orange Belt

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    <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 Mr. Sinister <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3
     
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  5. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    Yes, and Quartey did always "step." No matter how small of a step it's still a step. Meaning moving weight into the front foot at the moment of impact of the hand, but without bringing the head down/forward.

    Cotto's power-jab uses an exaggerated step to close distance quickly. It's a way he compensated for having slow feet. But it worked to make his jab very destructive.
     
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  6. PivotPunch Red Belt

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    right, yeah it was Archie Moore not Futch, Foreman had Dundee in his corner, i meant Dundee. I got confused because I was thinking of an old black guy and Foreman adopting that crossed arm guard and apparently Futch was the first guy I linked with that :icon_lol:
     
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  7. Rawn_MT Blue Belt

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    You are my idol king kabuki
     
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  8. PivotPunch Red Belt

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    Doesn't it make the predictable if you always move your lead foot when jabbing? i think those fighters are in the minority but I think Donaire said he watches his opponents feet and that he timed i think Darchinyan because he noticed Darchinyan would always take a step when jabbing.
    And would you advocate hip rotation or only shoulder rotation?

    Tbf I think though Darchinyan didn't do a Quartey step just for power but a real step to cover distance so is that mostly an issue with a Cotto long jab and only a small enough liability to ignore if you do only Quartey like small steps?
     
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  9. Sinister Doctor of Doom

    Sinister
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    Ahh, gotcha. But yes he eventually had Dundee. Dundee also cornered against Ali for Jimmy Ellis.
     
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  10. fightingrabbit Banned

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    this was l33t. and here i thought youd forgotten all about us.
     
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  11. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    No, the hand and foot move at the same time. So if Donaire looked down at the foot, he'd get popped in the mouth. Darchinyan was timed because he's slow and only has one tempo.

    If this "step" motion is done (even without the foot actually moving), then the jab will have a lot of weight without a whole lot of need for much rotation.
     
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  12. bulldetector Banned

    bulldetector
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    What about the Klitschko paying distracting jab?
     
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  13. DocLikeEm Yellow Belt

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    Interesting thread.
     
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  14. bulldetector Banned

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    What about the Klitschko pawing distracting jab?
     
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  15. clashnat Double Yellow Card

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    I know which video you're talking about, watched it a long time ago, I think it's called "In this corner". And I think Donaire was talking bullshit to some extent. When you watch him fight, you'll see that he looks into his opponents eyes like everybody. Chest up, chin down.

    Of course you can methodically pick time slots where you monitor your opponent as a whole, from his feet up, watch if you can pick up some movement patterns that you can capitalize on and have your own defensive measures in mind when you go on to attack.
     
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  16. millasur Blue Belt

    millasur
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    Thanks Mr King. Or Mr. S. Ike's jab is actaully UNREAL.:icon_twis
     
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  17. RightHandLead Yellow Belt

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  18. paolo27th Black Belt

    paolo27th
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    This should be stickied.
     
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  19. shpboris Blue Belt

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    Interesting to see how effortlessly Frazier got past Foster's jab.

    No rushing forward, no attempts to counter with big punches - just methodical cutting of the ring (especially escape to Foster's left), slowly eating up the space while catching and slipping the jabs.

    Frazier had mad skill in this area.

    [YT]JZtRpq1t0xg[/YT]
     
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  20. bradlee180 Banned

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    Awesome.
     
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  21. PivotPunch Red Belt

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    One thing to consider though is that everything becomes lower quality if a fighter is intimidated and thinking twice about each punch he throws in fear of getting hit himself and Foster wasn't only fighting at HW where he didn't have that crazy
    Thomas hearns esque size advantage he had at LHW but he was fighting frazier who his entire life fought not only taller but bigger man than himself and Foster and he had an intimidating style (that on top of everything was made for guys like that) and reputation and could punch.

    In comparison when he fought Dick Tiger even Foster wasnt as comfortable jabbing but he took single punches from Tiger and was fine but with frazier it was Dick Tiger times 10

    Maybe Foster wasnt even afraid of frazier but looking at the Tiger fight maybe he had the tendency to fight with his opponent and fought at a hectic and wild pace when his opponent did so.

    I think the thing with jabbing is for a huge part also mentally Wlad is a prime example since he sometimes panics under pressure and despite having the skills at points hesitates to jab and instead clinches or Thomas Hearns after getting rocked by Hagler starting to run but without setting his feet and jabbing almost scared
     
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  22. Yanoush Guest

    Yanoush
    What about the jab to the body?

    were there any fighters known for them.
     
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  23. clashnat Double Yellow Card

    clashnat
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    Damn was Foster crossing his feet a lot.
     
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  24. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    Bend your knees, and any of those jabs goes to the body. And in most of those videos I posted, each Fighter shows their version of the jab to the body. The up-jab is never thrown to the body because it would then no longer be an up-jab.
     
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  25. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    Foster was also up against Futch, the man who essentially built him.
     
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  26. stickmassacre White Belt

    stickmassacre
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    Thanks for this thread. I love jabbing.
     
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  27. PivotPunch Red Belt

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    I find it so weird but in a good way when fighters train with a trainer who once stood in the opposite corner.

    Duran with Dundee, Foreman with Futch, Roach with Cotto and kinda if it counts Wladimir with Emmanuel Steward.

    I wonder if a trainer who once had to create a gameplan AGAINST his new fighter has a different perspective and if it may even be an advantage and how a trainer changes his mind about a fighter and sees positive things or flaws he didn#t see before.
     
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  28. stickmassacre White Belt

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    Thanks for this thread. I love jabbing.
     
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  29. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    Was that a double-jab of a post?
     
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  30. Marvin Covar Amateur Fighter

    Marvin Covar
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    It's funny how MMA fans discounted the jab until BJ Penn utilized it in the Sherk fight. Nowadays, everybody says it's indispensable (which it is). Nonetheless, very informative post. Thanks for sharing!
     
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  31. ambertch Purple Belt

    ambertch
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    What's your thought on throwing upjab variations, thumbup and thumbdown?

    My coach is a big proponent of upjabs and mandates them be thrown simultaneously with a defense (for orthodox, thumbup - slip left, thumbdown - slip right) He also recommends throwing these upjab variations as combos themselves to integrate offense and defense. He uses the thumbdown one to counter an incoming jab, and the thumbup one to counterjab after parrying a jab downwards.


    However I have not really seen many pros do this in the recent fights I've watched (or perhaps I'm not watching closely enough).
     
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  32. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    The Art of using the up-jab efficiently is a lost one. I've never seen it done thumb up enough myself to really have any basis of comparison. The trip-hammer style jab is the only one I know of that's great when thrown thumb up because it makes it even more quick and surprising if you don't take the time to turn over the wrist and elbow, but can still be stiff. I'd love to see your coach using that technique though, because I'm sure he uses it well.
     
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  33. Tropics1020 Brown Belt

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    Whitaker also had an amazing jab.
     
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  34. Sinister Doctor of Doom

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    He did, but he threw a standard jab, and not better than Ike. He is a picture of how to throw 3's and 4's though.
     
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  35. Jubacat Rope Belt

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    Great write up KK.

    Thanks.
     
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