Star Wars Rebels on DisneyXD

[usmctanker242]

No. Vader becomes stronger post Mustafar. Not at first. He changes his movements obviously but he grows to become better in the force and dueling. Had he not been burned and maimed he would have been far stronger sure. But his appearance in ROTJ is him at the peak of what he can reach. Meaning ROTJ Vader would easily kill ROTS Vader. Hypothetical a non suited injury free Vader in the same time frame of ROTJ owns his suited self.

I think it's obvious that Vader has grown old and is less inline with the dark side by the time we hit ROTJ. He is surviving only due to the efforts of Palpatine keeping him alive, and as someone else said, Palpatine is only allowing him to become so powerful. You can look to the duel in Empire when Vader is chooses to switch locations, he lunges at Luke from out of nowhere. It's not hard to infer that he was out of breath and was needing time to recover. He then foregoes a physical battle and chooses to use his stronger force powers to attack Luke. No way in hell would Mustafar Vader have made that choice or have needed to make that choice. Remember, this is a Luke who had very little training in the force, let alone in saber combat.

Reading what I've typed here I find it hilarious that I'm actually having a discussion about this on an MMA forum at 3am. LMAO

 

[sverre054]

Can someone give me the rundown on which animated series it's best to start with? Are The Clone Wars and Rebels the only two?

I have watched Rebels since its come out and have enjoyed it. I decided to finally watch clone wars, since many characters are in both. Clone wars is really great. George Lucas personally funded it, to make sure it was made to his high standard. I really respect him for telling his story, and making sure it got made.

Watch Clone war, then Rebels. It adds so much to the whole star wars story, and even some stuff that will affect the new movies.

 

[Lavitz]

I think it's obvious that Vader has grown old and is less inline with the dark side by the time we hit ROTJ. He is surviving only due to the efforts of Palpatine keeping him alive, and as someone else said, Palpatine is only allowing him to become so powerful. You can look to the duel in Empire when Vader is chooses to switch locations, he lunges at Luke from out of nowhere. It's not hard to infer that he was out of breath and was needing time to recover. He then foregoes a physical battle and chooses to use his stronger force powers to attack Luke. No way in hell would Mustafar Vader have made that choice or have needed to make that choice. Remember, this is a Luke who had very little training in the force, let alone in saber combat.

Reading what I've typed here I find it hilarious that I'm actually having a discussion about this on an MMA forum at 3am. LMAO

No dude this is serious business. Vader by canonical novel statements is at his strongest in ROTJ.

RoTJ exert
Lord Vader did not mind waiting, though, nor was even aware of it. For it was an honor, and a noble activity, to kneel at his ruler's feet. He kept his eyes inward, seeking reflection in his own bottomless core. His power was great, now, greater than it had ever been. It shimmered from within, and resonated with the waves of darkness that flowed from the Emperor. He felt engorged with this power, it surged like black fire, demon electrons looking for ground...but he would wait.

In TESB Vader is toying with Luke. It isn't until Luke lands a glancing blow is that he gets pissed and cuts his arm off.

Luke beat ROTJ of Vader. Luke would make short work of ROTS Vader. Vader held his own until Luke tapped into the dark side.

It's 3AM in the morning and I'm arguing on the canonical prime of Vader with grown men. What am I doing with my life?

 

[GSP_37]

How does he die in the cartoon if he already died in episode 1

Somehow someone attached some sort of cyborg legs to him and he ended up a hermit in a cave. Actually, if I remember correctly, before the witches gave him cyborg legs, he had cyborg spider legs in the cave.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

I don't get it I thought Anikin was the chosen one and how would he avenge "us". Is "us" Sith or Jedi? Also what a lame last battle for Maul. I don't know why Obiwan catches him and holds him in his arms like they're best friends.

 

[Lavitz]

Listen to this guy. Rebels is way inferior to Clone Wars by a country mile. Everything about it is worse: animation, production, writing, everything.

Everything Clone Wars ever did eclipses Rebels except maybe Twilight of the Apprentice which is damn near movie tier.

I agree.

 

[usmctanker242]

No dude this is serious business. Vader by canonical novel statements is at his strongest in ROTJ.

RoTJ exert
Lord Vader did not mind waiting, though, nor was even aware of it. For it was an honor, and a noble activity, to kneel at his ruler's feet. He kept his eyes inward, seeking reflection in his own bottomless core. His power was great, now, greater than it had ever been. It shimmered from within, and resonated with the waves of darkness that flowed from the Emperor. He felt engorged with this power, it surged like black fire, demon electrons looking for ground...but he would wait.

In TESB Vader is toying with Luke. It isn't until Luke lands a glancing blow is that he gets pissed and cuts his arm off.

Luke beat ROTJ of Vader. Luke would make short work of ROTS Vader. Vader held his own until Luke tapped into the dark side.

It's 3AM in the morning and I'm arguing on the canonical prime of Vader with grown men. What am I doing with my life?

That's funny, I don't think I've ever actually read ROTJ... might be fun to give it a read and get some more subtext. I also think this passage might be more of Vaders thoughts, and not necessarily the truth. He is weak and Palpatine is siphoning his power to allow Luke to win and destroy Vader to make that final step along the path to the dark side. Luke is already arrogant ("So I am a Jedi"), wearing all black, and horribly scarred by battle... he murders with no hesitation, and he has no issues with using his powers to deceive (floating C-3PO). He is well on his way to becoming a Sith, all he needed was that final push, a bloodlust murder, to tip the scales and forever be consumed by the dark side.

My big point here is that Vader is weak in the ROTJ battle specifically because Palpatine is choosing to sacrifice Vader, as he did Tyranus, to lure his new apprentice down the path of the dark side. RoTS Vader would have won that duel even without Palpatine manipulating the events.

I do like that you mentioned Luke tapping into the dark side... very few people make that connection.

 

[usmctanker242]

I don't get it I thought Anikin was the chosen one and how would he avenge "us". Is "us" Sith or Jedi? Also what a lame last battle for Maul. I don't know why Obiwan catches him and holds him in his arms like they're best friends.

I think the "us" he's referring to is everybody who has been betrayed by Palpatine.

As for the chosen one business, Anakin was created by Plageus (Palpatine's Master), through manipulation of midi-chlorians and the force. He was created to purposefully fulfill the Jedi legend of a chosen one. I remember Palpatine saying something like "Why train a Sith to hate the Jedi when the Jedi can do it for you?" Can't recall where he said it, but it was probably somewhere in his dark side compendium in the Jedi vs Sith : A Guide to the Force.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

I think the "us" he's referring to is everybody who has been betrayed by Palpatine.

As for the chosen one business, Anakin was created by Plageus (Palpatine's Master), through manipulation of midi-chlorians and the force. He was created to purposefully fulfill the Jedi legend of a chosen one. I remember Palpatine saying something like "Why train a Sith to hate the Jedi when the Jedi can do it for you?" Can't recall where he said it, but it was probably somewhere in his dark side compendium in the Jedi vs Sith : A Guide to the Force.

The "us" thing being Palpatine did cross my minds but the Plageus thing I did not know about. I guess it makes sense because I thought I read some where that Anikin had no father.

 

[jefferz]

Well, that was disappointing.

 

[whougonnacall]

No. Vader becomes stronger post Mustafar. Not at first. He changes his movements obviously but he grows to become better in the force and dueling. Had he not been burned and maimed he would have been far stronger sure. But his appearance in ROTJ is him at the peak of what he can reach. Meaning ROTJ Vader would easily kill ROTS Vader. Hypothetical a non suited injury free Vader in the same time frame of ROTJ owns his suited self.

Agree with this one i do
Yeah theres novels dedicated to it
Vader is full of self loathing at first and knows hel prob never live up to his vast potential , slow and clumsy he almost loses a duel with a post order 66 no name jedi

Then later he focuses on the sheer anger he feels and can connect to the dark side as never before
While 'fleshy' anakin prob had more raw power and potential he was still a noob to the dark side....off balance obi wan bested him
By contrast vader has had years to focus on the force itself, mastering the lesser but still vast reserves of power he still has
Meanwhile hes adjusted to the suit....its slow and clumsy but freakishly strong and durable
His style changes to less movement more subtle angles and skill...more importanly its intimidating as fuck and he can bask in peoples fear and become stronger.

 

[Mike]

Getting maimed was a tradeoff for Vader. He lost his speed and agility, but gained even more force power. In shadow of the empire, which is probably not canon anymore I guess, he is even training to regenerate himself. He hadn't mastered the technique yet, but presumable he would eventually be able to regain his original speed and agility.


Being maimed was like a handicap in the eu that allowed anyone else to even have a chance against him. I do think ROTJ Vader would beat ROTS Vader, as he had much more force power and was more calculating and strategic after being maimed. Also, I don't think the slow clunky duels in the original trilogy were really meant to portray that he was incredibly disabled. It was just that the suit was really clunky, and Lucas has mentioned this before.

In pretty much all other fictional portrayals of Vader, he is an excellent duelist and not portrayed as being a zombie with force powers.

 

[Fedorgasm]

RIP Maul, the GOAT star wars character.

I was really happy that they brought him back in the animated series, he was a great character for both shows that he appeared in.

It's a fitting end that he should die at the hands of Kenobi, though I wish Kenobi didn't dispatch him so easily. I would've liked an epic battle first, but whatev. Can't have it all I guess. I suppose it can be explained by saying Kenobi has become ridiculously powerful. I mean this is the oldest version of Kenobi that we ever get to see in an actual fight (a new hope doesn't count, he just let vader win so he could become one with the force)

 

[jefferz]

RIP Maul, the GOAT star wars character.

I was really happy that they brought him back in the animated series, he was a great character for both shows that he appeared in.

It's a fitting end that he should die at the hands of Kenobi, though I wish Kenobi didn't dispatch him so easily. I would've liked an epic battle first, but whatev. Can't have it all I guess. I suppose it can be explained by saying Kenobi has become ridiculously powerful. I mean this is the oldest version of Kenobi that we ever get to see in an actual fight (a new hope doesn't count, he just let vader win so he could become one with the force)

 

[Der Eisbär]

Getting maimed was a tradeoff for Vader. He lost his speed and agility, but gained even more force power. In shadow of the empire, which is probably not canon anymore I guess, he is even training to regenerate himself. He hadn't mastered the technique yet, but presumable he would eventually be able to regain his original speed and agility.


Being maimed was like a handicap in the eu that allowed anyone else to even have a chance against him. I do think ROTJ Vader would beat ROTS Vader, as he had much more force power and was more calculating and strategic after being maimed. Also, I don't think the slow clunky duels in the original trilogy were really meant to portray that he was incredibly disabled. It was just that the suit was really clunky, and Lucas has mentioned this before.

In pretty much all other fictional portrayals of Vader, he is an excellent duelist and not portrayed as being a zombie with force powers.

Yeah I am not saying he's a zombie with force powers. He becomes an excellent duelist post Mustafar but 4 robotic limbs are a massive hinderance regardless. He has to completely relearn how to wield a saber and develop an entirely different style around calculated strikes and overwhelming power.

 

[Fedorgasm]

Who's the GOAT star wars character if not Maul?

Vader was certainly a good candidate until the pansy Anakin portrayal by Haden Christianson ruined him.

Palpatine was pretty cool, but that battle with Windu made him into a cheesy cartoon character "Unlimited Power!!!"

Yoda was the best character until the prequels made him all serious.

The only character that comes close to Maul is probably Qui-Gon. He was more interesting than Obi Wan because Qui-Gon was his own man, where Obi Wan for the most part always did as he was told, the only time he even hinted at defiance was when it came to training Anakin.

 

[Lavitz]

Who's the GOAT star wars character if not Maul?

Vader was certainly a good candidate until the pansy Anakin portrayal by Haden Christianson ruined him.

Palpatine was pretty cool, but that battle with Windu made him into a cheesy cartoon character "Unlimited Power!!!"

Yoda was the best character until the prequels made him all serious.

The only character that comes close to Maul is probably Qui-Gon. He was more interesting than Obi Wan because Qui-Gon was his own man, where Obi Wan for the most part always did as he was told, the only time he even hinted at defiance was when it came to training Anakin.

In terms of accomplishments Sidious is up there. Tricked thousands of Jedi while he was right in front of them. Became Supreme Chancellor and then Galactic Emperor. Orchestrated a whole fake war to get what he wanted. Almost caused the jedi to go extinct. Played Dooku, Maul and Vader like puppets.

Also Yoda was always serious with a hint of humor. Prequels or not.

EU Grandmaster Luke is probably the one the greatest Star Wars characters of all time.

 

[taurus]

Don't worry, i'm sure there's another canon story that has him survive, just around the corner. All for the sake of the story, of course, not $$$. Can't wait to see what happened to Boba Fett.

Who's the GOAT star wars character if not Maul?

Vader was certainly a good candidate until the pansy Anakin portrayal by Haden Christianson ruined him.

Palpatine was pretty cool, but that battle with Windu made him into a cheesy cartoon character "Unlimited Power!!!"

Yoda was the best character until the prequels made him all serious.

The only character that comes close to Maul is probably Qui-Gon. He was more interesting than Obi Wan because Qui-Gon was his own man, where Obi Wan for the most part always did as he was told, the only time he even hinted at defiance was when it came to training Anakin.

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

 

[Anung Un Rama]

That was one of the better lightsaber fights, imo. Very samurai. Obi-Wan will always be my favorite character (Alec Guinness > Ewan McGregor).

 

[punkmother]

Who's the GOAT star wars character if not Maul?

Vader was certainly a good candidate until the pansy Anakin portrayal by Haden Christianson ruined him.

Palpatine was pretty cool, but that battle with Windu made him into a cheesy cartoon character "Unlimited Power!!!"

Yoda was the best character until the prequels made him all serious.

The only character that comes close to Maul is probably Qui-Gon. He was more interesting than Obi Wan because Qui-Gon was his own man, where Obi Wan for the most part always did as he was told, the only time he even hinted at defiance was when it came to training Anakin.

i assume you are talking force wielders only on this list? if we ignore the 2 most recent movies, han solo and chewbacca are still pretty badass. the prequels never existed my mind. the benefit of that is darth vader is still the greatest villain in movie history.