Sparring video of me . Any advice

[DynamiteHands]

Today I tried a new style. The philly shell or also known as the shoulder roll famously used by Floyd Mayweather. I sparred the best guy in our gym and got fuckedup...BUT I had more fun using this style and also felt more comfortable and confident. Will definitely be using this style for awhile.
I'm the shorter guy in the blue shorts and grey shirt with the face bar head gear

First video :


Second video:

 

[cheesus]

This belongs in training discussion

 

[eternaldarkness]

counter with a right cross left hook when he comes at you blazing then circle out, don't be scared of throwing a decent punch as he is obviously already throwing them fairly hard.

 

[ikareteru]

Today I tried a new style. The philly shell or also known as the shoulder roll famously used by Floyd Mayweather. I sparred the best guy in our gym and got fuckedup...BUT I had more fun using this style and also felt more comfortable and confident. Will definitely be using this style for awhile.
I'm the shorter guy in the blue shorts and grey shirt with the face bar head gear

First video :


Second video:

Slow it down. You are not really practicing here. Just playfighting.

Mayweather style is more than making a shell and going from there. There are many small nuances. Should work on that first.

 

[Uchi Mata]

Balance is the biggest thing I notice. You're trying to roll under the punches, but you're trying to do it while moving and it's throwing you off balance. Another thing is that when he's rushing you, don't be afraid to counter and clinch. A huge part of what Mayweather does to avoid damage is he rolls and parries, but when his opponent rushes in if he can't angle out he'll close the distance and clinch. Just running away makes it to easy for your opponent to tee off, you have to either angle out, throw something back to throw him down, or clinch up to reset. Or some combination of those. Backing up that quickly while trying to slip every punch is going to end up with you getting hit hard while off balance which is how knockdowns happen.

 

[a guy]

From that stance you're effectively a one-handed puncher. Your jab and counter left hook are nice and all, but you're getting stuck on your back foot. Not only does that mean your counter right hands aren't there, it means when he works his way in behind multiple jabs you end up bent over looking at the floor without the ability to fire back with anything. You've gotta work on shifting weight foot to foot both offensively and defensively.

 

[j123]

I don't know much about the shell, but as with most stances in fighting, when avoiding, you should still have good posture. Your body should not be so leaned back giving up your base. avoid forward rather than backwards. So kinda of like lateral slipping I guess.

Also on your straights, your chin is getting pretty high, I know he's taller, but try not to do that.

 

[DoctorTaco]

NOTE: All of this is for boxing only. MMA changes everything.

Get your left up AND KEEP IT UP!!! That left has no business being so low.

If you have the speed of Camacho, Leonard, or Ali you can get away with holding your lead low. Us mortals need to keep it up. Of course, you can always drop it to draw an opponent which all three of those greats often did.

If you watch fights by those three you will notice that their opponents (typically the slower fighters) usually kept their lead up. They had to or they would eat fast jabs all day long. Only the very fast fighter could get away with holding the lead low.

Leaving that left low:
1. Exposes your head. Did you notice that your're taking a lot of shots to the left side of your head?
2. To avoid being hit you are bending at the waist and moving your entire torso and head. This is a wast of time and energy. If your sparring partner wanted to he could rush you at that time (which he did, just not as much as he could have) and land multiple shots while you struggle against your rearward momentum.
3. Bending so severely at the torso is eliminating your ability to counter. At the least it increases the time required to counter which effectively reduces your speed.
4. That low hand his killing the speed of your jab because it greatly increases the travel distance. It is also easier to perceive because it is taking an angular path (which is easier for binocular vision to perceive) to its target.
5. That low hand is also killing the body mechanics of your jab. While it is not a power punch the shoulder does play a role at the end of the punch. Delivering it from that low position makes it an arm only punch.

If you;'re concerned about body shots, use your elbows and forearms to protect that area. This is extremely fast and leaves your gloved hand in position to protect your head. This also lets you stand more erect. Both of you are bending awkwardly at the waist.

You've also got a lot of weight on your back foot. That eats a lot of speed because you have to transition much more weight to effect a forward action. Watch some Ali film and stare at his feet. Look closely at your film and notice how much time you are being driven backward. Get some of that weight off of that back foot and this won't be happening.

Try delivering that jab as a straight punch from a position similar to how you are holding your right. It will definitely score more often. It will be much faster and, when you want to, you can add a little shoulder behind it. You will cut the travel distance in half, it won't be nearly as telegraphic, and you will be in position to counter behind it.

The only times that lead should be held low:
1. When you are the faster fighter and can get away with it.
2. When you have a distance advantage and can get away with it.
3. When drawing your opponent.
4. When you put yourself in position to rest your lead.

Lastly, rechamber all of your punches in the most direct path possible.

Hope that helps.

Edit: When you combine your faster jab with better weight distribution, and less concern for protecting the left side of your head, you're going to be driving your sparring partner back. He's going to be fending off your jab and you are going to be in position to take advantage of it. At the very least you're going to meet him in the middle instead of being driven backward.

not sure if serious...

 

[DoctorTaco]

Like any other stance or guard, you need to drill specific responses to various punches and combinations from your opponent. Build a foundation of understanding and muscle memory and then apply it to sparring

 

[BringBackTRTforFairness]

you see those 2 girls in the back gorund one in the grey? You see how they punch? Do that go ask them for pointers.

The guy seems to be really going for you, good job at not taking any punishment, but you didnt fire back much with any power shots, am I right in thinking you havent got your hips down? If not you should be sparring yet its pointless

 

[eternaldarkness]

NOTE: All of this is for boxing only. MMA changes everything.

Get your left up AND KEEP IT UP!!! That left has no business being so low.

If you have the speed of Camacho, Leonard, or Ali you can get away with holding your lead low. Us mortals need to keep it up. Of course, you can always drop it to draw an opponent which all three of those greats often did.

If you watch fights by those three you will notice that their opponents (typically the slower fighters) usually kept their lead up. They had to or they would eat fast jabs all day long. Only the very fast fighter could get away with holding the lead low.

Leaving that left low:
1. Exposes your head. Did you notice that your're taking a lot of shots to the left side of your head?
2. To avoid being hit you are bending at the waist and moving your entire torso and head. This is a wast of time and energy. If your sparring partner wanted to he could rush you at that time (which he did, just not as much as he could have) and land multiple shots while you struggle against your rearward momentum.
3. Bending so severely at the torso is eliminating your ability to counter. At the least it increases the time required to counter which effectively reduces your speed.
4. That low hand his killing the speed of your jab because it greatly increases the travel distance. It is also easier to perceive because it is taking an angular path (which is easier for binocular vision to perceive) to its target.
5. That low hand is also killing the body mechanics of your jab. While it is not a power punch the shoulder does play a role at the end of the punch. Delivering it from that low position makes it an arm only punch.

If you;'re concerned about body shots, use your elbows and forearms to protect that area. This is extremely fast and leaves your gloved hand in position to protect your head. This also lets you stand more erect. Both of you are bending awkwardly at the waist.

You've also got a lot of weight on your back foot. That eats a lot of speed because you have to transition much more weight to effect a forward action. Watch some Ali film and stare at his feet. Look closely at your film and notice how much time you are being driven backward. Get some of that weight off of that back foot and this won't be happening.

Try delivering that jab as a straight punch from a position similar to how you are holding your right. It will definitely score more often. It will be much faster and, when you want to, you can add a little shoulder behind it. You will cut the travel distance in half, it won't be nearly as telegraphic, and you will be in position to counter behind it.

The only times that lead should be held low:
1. When you are the faster fighter and can get away with it.
2. When you have a distance advantage and can get away with it.
3. When drawing your opponent.
4. When you put yourself in position to rest your lead.

Lastly, rechamber all of your punches in the most direct path possible.

Hope that helps.

Edit: When you combine your faster jab with better weight distribution, and less concern for protecting the left side of your head, you're going to be driving your sparring partner back. He's going to be fending off your jab and you are going to be in position to take advantage of it. At the very least you're going to meet him in the middle instead of being driven backward.

ever heard of the philly shell? i take it your not a fan?

 

[eternaldarkness]

Yes, very.



Couldn't agree more that he needs to build a good foundation. Agree even more about working responses to various punches and combinations. But, he's got to start with a stance that works. A left hand at the knee and sitting on his back foot while get him more of the same even with practice. That low left hand is slow for offense and useless for defense. Eating rights constantly makes for a bad day.

Get him into a good stance with that left up and everything improves. Sure, there's still a lot to work on but at least he will be in position to start.

shoulder roll and throw a hard right off the back foot. i not trying to be rude but i take it your experience has all been amateur boxing and you don't watch much professional boxing. i highly recommend you watch charley burley the guy had an amazing philly shell defence.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Yes, very.



Couldn't agree more that he needs to build a good foundation. Agree even more about working responses to various punches and combinations. But, he's got to start with a stance that works. A left hand at the knee and sitting on his back foot while get him more of the same even with practice. That low left hand is slow for offense and useless for defense. Eating rights constantly makes for a bad day.

Get him into a good stance with that left up and everything improves. Sure, there's still a lot to work on but at least he will be in position to start.

carrying the left high actually telegraphs the left hook a bit, or sacrifices a bit of power that is why so many pros carry their left lower. another good one to watch is bob foster fighting at light heavyweight, he was one of the hardest punchers in boxing.

 

[eternaldarkness]

If you watch fights by those three you will notice that their opponents (typically the slower fighters) usually kept their lead up. They had to or they would eat fast jabs all day long. Only the very fast fighter could get away with holding the lead low.

you actually parry the jab with your right hand unless you what to eat 1-2 combos all day. the left guards against the right hand, or the shoulder roll if you are using the philly shell.

 

[eternaldarkness]

keep your left elbow closer to your body and keep your right slightly higher and a bit more on the left side of your face. MOST IMPORTANTLY the philly shell is a counter punching style you have to counter more. no defence works properly in boxing without punching back, otherwise your opponent just gets more aggressive and starts picking holes in your guard, you should never block or dodge more than 2 or 3 punches without returning fire. (i understand that one really well as it was always a bad habit of mine)

 

[eternaldarkness]

Not rude at all. Call it like you see it.

I cleared this up in another post above. In short, I was telling the TS to fight more like his opponent. The guy that was beating him up. The shoulder roll was doing nothing for the TS. The TS wasn't throwing hard off the back foot because he was never in position. That's because his posture was wrong and he guard wasn't up when it needed to be. His opponent was using the Philly Shell well and his opponent had his left up a lot. He had it up when it needed to be and he was into the Philly Shell when it worked for him. That's what I was saying the TS should be doing. I guess I just got off on too much detail. I'm prone to do that.

i understand where your coming from completely know. in TS's case he is probably better off staying away from the philly shell until he has better fundamentals, my comments were because he said he felt more comfortable in the shell and were about improving his philly shell style, but he would get much quicker results switching back to high guard. i didn't mean to sound like a know it all jackass.

 

[eternaldarkness]

You weren't a jackass. I went off on my dissecting of what the TS was doing instead of putting in boxing terms like the TS stated it. My mistake. I'm an engineer by trade. We tend to go off on the details and leave the big picture behind sometimes.

I appreciate the discussion and I'm all for being called out when I screw up.

Cheers

it's amazing how much more civil and intellectual conversions in the technique forums are. have a good day sir.

 

[jabelar]

The first thing I noticed in the video was the girls in the background. I couldn't quite decide if they were hot or not, but got a lot of laughs watching their slo-mo catfight and had to watch the vid again to pay attention to you. Next time please place hot girls closer to the camera.

The most obvious thing about your vids was already mentioned but you shouldn't be using the Philly Shell to avoid only the first shot then run away while the guy chases you. The Philly Shell is meant to be more of a "stand your ground" sort of strategy, where you roll just out of reach of damage and then punish the other guy with counters if he ventures in.

The second thing is I think you're doing too much to avoid being hit. In Philly Shell the idea is that it is okay to get hit (on the lead shoulder) because the rolling is just enough to take the power out of it. I don't think you need to combine a slip (or in your case you're pretty much ducking) with the roll. That is why it is called a "shell" -- you can take a hit without damage. I think this is what is contributing to what others mentioned above -- you're getting off balance and too much weight on the back foot because you're doing too much movement to try to fully avoid the hit. Try instead to just only lean back an inch while also rolling a bit so the other guys' punches are hitting the lead shoulder but with the power lost from the extra distance.

In summary I suggest you change your attitude: stand your ground to make it a proper shell that absorbs the hit and then punish the guy with counters any time he dares come in.

P.S. I know you're practicing Philly Shell so you're doing the whole sparring session in that position, but I prefer using the Philly Shell occasionally rather than all the time. It provides some good diversity, can give your lead arm a rest if you're having trouble with lactic acid buildup, and can really frustrate an opponent when used effectively. Staying in the Shell all the time makes it much easier for your opponent to adjust to it and pick it apart.

P.P.S. I'm not sure that sparring partner is good match for learning something. He's going a bit too hard. I'm all for going hard, but when you're learning something you're not going to get the subtleties down right when you're frantically trying to avoid an overhand right. By the way, if I were sparring that guy I'd be spending all my time working out a counter to his weird pawing right hand -- you gotta punish anyone who's coming at you like that otherwise he can have you on the run at will (which is pretty much what happens in your vids).

 

[Soul Rebel 2]

You're giving up ground against a taller man for no reason. Lower your elevation and launch an upper cut to his body or an overhand on the other hip, step in to clinch or pivot away but don't just bounce backwards in a straight line like that.

Also, that's not the philly shell.

 

[rmongler]

Learn to body jab.