SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: Week 80 Discussion - Drugstore Cowboy

Even more impressed that you got it.


<Gordonhat>


You can take us both on and here's how it'll go for you. @nostradumbass will beat your ass with some slick Muay Thai and I'll drink more than you. You'll lose on both fronts. But if you put up a good fight I'll still respect you.


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Love it. Bring it on boys. My liver is ready, and muay thai is good for the soul. Even better for keeping my ever devolving dad-bod in check. :D I have a fight coming up on 12/16, matter of fact, so if you're in Denver hit me up for a ticket.
 
Love it. Bring it on boys. My liver is ready, and muay thai is good for the soul. Even better for keeping my ever devolving dad-bod in check. :D I have a fight coming up on 12/16, matter of fact, so if you're in Denver hit me up for a ticket.


I'll probably live up to my end of your (liver's) ass-kicking sooner than you might think. The front range is my home. 2018 looms.


{<redford}
 
I regret taking so long to see this film.
I'm trying to think of anything from time period (between Blade Runner and Reservoir Dogs) with the same level of exposure/notoriety that did film noir so classically well:
The self-aware and maybe a little self-deprecating narration of our morally ambiguous (at best) protagonist.
Kelly Lynch as the femme fatale, stunningly gorgeous as well as unapologetically and unmitigatingly self-serving.
James Remar as the asshole cop who cares just enough stay within his own code.
William Burroughs dropping in to be the tragic and unexpected sage, giving exposition on societal ills.
The cynicism that doesn't go away once Bob gets clean.
The beat/jazz score in many places.
Bob even quips to Gentry about "reading too much Mickey Spillane."

I've always been a fan of Matt Dillon, seeing him as a darker John Cusack.
 
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I've always been a fan of Matt Dillon, seeing him as a darker John Cusack.

I think Matt Dillon's all right, but when I really sat down to look at his filmography I realized that he just hasn't been in a whole lot of stuff that I loved.

I did really like the first season of Wayward Pines a couple of years ago. If you haven't seen that, I really recommend that you check it out.

But Wayward Pines is the first thing he's been in that I really cared about since Singles way back in 1992.
 
I think Matt Dillon's all right, but when I really sat down to look at his filmography I realized that he just hasn't been in a whole lot of stuff that I loved.

I did really like the first season of Wayward Pines a couple of years ago. If you haven't seen that, I really recommend that you check it out.

But Wayward Pines is the first thing he's been in that I really cared about since Singles way back in 1992.

Did you see Ted Demme's Beautiful Girls? Thoroughly quotable and packed with talent and feels.
 
Did you see Ted Demme's Beautiful Girls? Thoroughly quotable and packed with talent and feels.

No, I can't say I'm even familiar that one. And frankly, looking over Matt Dillon's filmography, that's one thing I really noticed: He's been in several films that I've never even heard of.

There very well could be some gems in there that I just haven't discovered yet. But I do think it's interesting that so much of his career has been spent either doing smaller, independent films or doing shit like Herbie Fully Loaded and You, Me and Dupree.
 
Hmm, I’m once again finding myself not liking this week’s movie as much as everyone else it seems. That doesn’t mean I thought it was bad, it’s just that I guess I’m not seeing something in it that’s striking hot with others.

In short, we have a tale of a man and his posse knocking off drugstores to get their next fix and keep their delinquent lifestyle afloat. Eventually, one ODs, and Bob, the leader, steps away from the life after this which not only separates him from the drug-riddled life, but also from his lifelong lover. Despite his efforts to live a normal life, Bob is attacked from a past associate of the drug world, and now he’s off to the hospital where they’re most likely going to dose him up with pain meds and probably cause him to relapse and fall back into the life.

The thing I probably liked the most from this is how we saw addicts put their addiction above everything else. Dianne keeps wanting sex from Bob, but Bob is too wrapped up on thinking about the next score. When Bob leaves the life, Dianne straight up refuses to join him because the drugs are more important than him. She goes to be with Rick even though she most likely doesn’t love him like she did Bob, but Rick’s the one with the drugs, so the choice is easy. Tom the priest places a bottle of pills on top of a bible symbolizing that his love for the drug is higher than his love for the Lord.

So the themes of the film are good and all, but at times the film was a little dull for me. There’s never really a point of mounting tension because they get out of situations in a stoic sort of way. I felt the transferring of the dead body past dozens of cops could have been more thrilling, but it was as simple as putting her in a bag and then in the trunk. I can see the amusement of laughing at the cops for this happening right under their nose, but the scene was still drab.

Bob was annoying, controlling, and superstitious, and I was never really rooting for him and wasn’t too invested for how things would play out for him. His fear of hexes is actually a scapegoat of his real fear of seeing himself and the life he’s living. He blames the bad stuff happening to him on something as dumb as a hat in a bed because it deflects from him having to admit it’s his bad choices in life that is netting bad stuff happening to him. We see even after he’s going through his detoxing and after he gets shot, he warns Gentry to tell Dianne to watch out for the “hat”. Even while living the clean life, he’s still blaming his downfalls on hexes without ever taking responsibility that he’s reaping what he sowed by living the criminal drug life. This shows his attempt to change is futile, and he’s most likely going to fall back into the life. So while the Bob character is the most fleshed out, I found myself still being indifferent about him. I don’t know, something just didn’t click with me. The rest of the posse was just kinda there.

The way the film looks stands out to me because it looks like it came out in the late 90s/early 2000s with the way it’s shot because it looked more modern than its release year with exception of how dated the cars and phones looked. I didn’t even realize this was supposed to be taking place in the 70s.

To wrap up, this is a competently directed and acted film that potrays a notable theme, and there are some scattered laughs here and there, such as dropping the corpse from the crawl space, but its central characters are a bit ho-hum, and the story coasts along without becoming too entralling. I found this to be just okay.
 
Another thing I noted was that the time period was hard to lock down. Since the movie was made in 1989, I went into it assuming the story took place in the 80s. Then after a while of looking at the cars and cop uniforms and the inside of that hospital in Act II, I started to think that it's supposed to be the 1950s. But looking at the plot summary on Wikipedia, I now see that it's supposed to be 1971.

I find it interesting that both of us had a problem trying to lock down the time period for this movie. This film has a look that I would say was ahead of its time being that it came out in the late 80’s, yet I would have never pegged this as an 80s film if I didn’t know beforehand.
 
I find it interesting that both of us had a problem trying to lock down the time period for this movie. This film has a look that I would say was ahead of its time being that it came out in the late 80’s, yet I would have never pegged this as an 80s film if I didn’t know beforehand.

It did start out by saying "Portland 1971". :cool:
 
The thing I probably liked the most from this is how we saw addicts put their addiction above everything else.

Yeah, I thought it did a good job of showing that at this level doing drugs really is a lifestyle. It's not like people who smoke some weed at the end of a long day. It's what everything they do revolves around.

Just a constant cycle of getting drugs, doing drugs, and trying not to get caught.

Tom the priest places a bottle of pills on top of a bible symbolizing that his love for the drug is higher than his love for the Lord.

That's an interesting interpretation. Considering some of the comments he made, such as telling MD's character that he should "go to heaven" for hooking him up there near the end, I took putting the pills on the Bible as a symbol that he thinks that his faith and his drug habit can peacefully co-exist.
 
Haha, really? I must have missed that.

Yep. Since both you and Shadow seemed to, I figured it was a good opportunity for me to bust balls. Really this could be set any time anywhere in America without affecting the script at all, except for changing methods of security they might encounter (eg. video cameras being commonplace).

That sorta touches on one of a couple places I could nit-pick. One is Bob getting out of the hospital. Seemed like he hunkering down to wait it out. I'd think the longer he waited the less his chances of escape.

The other thing would be that I kinda felt like the supporting cast put in the better performances.
 
That sorta touches on one of a couple places I could nit-pick. One is Bob getting out of the hospital. Seemed like he hunkering down to wait it out. I'd think the longer he waited the less his chances of escape.

This scene was also an example of my gripes about the characters getting out of high-stakes scenarios in sort of a dull way. Him fighting with the two dudes and running from them was fine and all, but after he's hiding in the stall and we later cut to the next day and he just walks into the apartment with his head bandaged, this left me yearning to see him go through a more exciting escape process.
 
This scene was also an example of my gripes about the characters getting out of high-stakes scenarios in sort of a dull way. Him fighting with the two dudes and running from them was fine and all, but after he's hiding in the stall and we later cut to the next day and he just walks into the apartment with his head bandaged, this left me yearning to see him go through a more exciting escape process.


I hear you. Maybe Gus was leery of making too much of a cops & robbers movie or was tying to avoid it being an obvious cautionary tale. Or maybe he just thought it would conflict with the overall subdued tone and mood of the film.
 
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I hear you. Maybe Gus was leery of making to much of a cops & robbers movie or was tying to avoid it being an obvious cautionary tale. Or maybe he just thought it would conflict with the overall subdued tone and mood of the film.

Indeed.

Honestly, I was kind of glad they didn't go in that direction with it. I saw the film ultimately as being about Matt Dillon's inner conflict, not his external conflict. It was about his sense of direction in life, his goals, and his personal struggle to work toward something better.

Sure, there were some external antagonists, but those guys aren't really what the film is about and aren't the real obstacles. I think that this is clearly illustrated by the fact that in the third act James Remar becomes something of a friend and is genuinely rooting for MD to succeed.
 
Indeed.

Honestly, I was kind of glad they didn't go in that direction with it. I saw the film ultimately as being about Matt Dillon's inner conflict, not his external conflict. It was about his sense of direction in life, his goals, and his personal struggle to work toward something better.

Sure, there were some external antagonists, but those guys aren't really what the film is about and aren't the real obstacles. I think that this is clearly illustrated by the fact that in the third act James Remar becomes something of a friend and is genuinely rooting for MD to succeed.


Totally agree. Extending those sequences of peril would not be necessary for the story being told. Would also make for a more tense film and potentially undermine all the subtle comedy. It's a heavy topic painting with a light brush.
 
I hear you. Maybe Gus was leery of making too much of a cops & robbers movie or was tying to avoid it being an obvious cautionary tale. Or maybe he just thought it would conflict with the overall subdued tone and mood of the film.

Indeed.

Honestly, I was kind of glad they didn't go in that direction with it. I saw the film ultimately as being about Matt Dillon's inner conflict, not his external conflict. It was about his sense of direction in life, his goals, and his personal struggle to work toward something better.

Sure, there were some external antagonists, but those guys aren't really what the film is about and aren't the real obstacles. I think that this is clearly illustrated by the fact that in the third act James Remar becomes something of a friend and is genuinely rooting for MD to succeed.

Totally agree. Extending those sequences of peril would not be necessary for the story being told. Would also make for a more tense film and potentially undermine all the subtle comedy. It's a heavy topic painting with a light brush.

I wasn’t suggesting that Bob would be continually pursued by the cops after breaking into the hospital, just that the scene could have ended in a more interesting fashion. Same with him transferring the dead body. There’s good setups to these scenes, and then the conflict just sort of fizzles out. I’m not suggesting he actually get caught by the cops in these two instances or even give them a reason to give pursuit, but some added tension would have been nice. If I’m gonna be teased with possibly thrilling situation, then I want to be, well, thrilled.

This is a well put together film, for sure. It just didn’t grip me fully.
 
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Yeah this film wasn't made for me. Tediously unfunny and boring. I get all the themes about living-for-the-next-fix and the pitfalls of the junkie-lifestyle and all that. But lord is it just not engaging. It had this sort of drab documentary style going -- which probably helps the verisimilitude in capturing the junkie-experience -- but that just makes the movie unstimulating on a cinematic level. Remember that scene where the fat, shotgun-wielding guy shoot the policeman and then there was this montage playing with snow and coloured silhouette of revolvers -- those are some of the touches that I did like.

But yeah it's just tough watching a bunch of slobs being a bunch of slobs for 100 minutes. Once again, I agree with that RoboCop guys assessement.
 
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It had this sort of drab documentary style going -- which probably helps the verisimilitude in capturing the junkie-experience -- but that just makes the movie unstimulating on a cinematic level.

I take it then that you have no appreciation for any found footage movies?
 
I take it then that you have no appreciation for any found-footage movies?

I would not equate found-footage with documentary-style. They give different impressions. Drugstore Cowboys actually is sort of odd in that it has this documentary-style going but simulatniously contain a few montages (which I did like).

That said, I'm not really fond of found-footage movies as a whole. There are definitively movies that I'm positive towards though. Like Blair Witch, REC, Cloverfield, Frankenstein's Army, or Cannibal Holocaust (if that counts). So I'm not dismissive towards the genre as a rule. But most I don't really like, I just think the style is to limiting and inducice to bad filmmaking traits (shaky-cam, being hectic, bad visuals). Shyamalan's movie The Visit made me want to claw my eyes out -- right as that little kid started rapping I would have prefered death to having to finish it.:D

Funnily enough, I watched a 1959 movie called Caltiki The Immortal Monster which had a brief found-footage moment in it. That HAS to be the first time that the method had ever been explored on film. Can anyone think of an earlier occurance?
 
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