SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: Week 128 - Five Element Ninjas

[europe1]

NOTE to NON-MEMBERS: Interested in joining the SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB? Shoot me a PM for more info!

Here's a quick list of all movies watched by the SMC. Or if you prefer, here's a more detailed examination.

What the hell kind of element is Gold anyways? Wood is one thing... but Gold, freaking Gold?

Our Director

Chang Cheh

​

Chang Cheh was the leading Martial Arts director in Hong Kong in the 1970s, now with close to 100 films to his name. His has influenced other directors such as John Woo and Liu Chiau Liang, and made famous such Hong Kong stars as Phillip Chung-Fung Kwok, Fu Sheng and Lung Ti. Chang has declared that he will stop working after he has made his 101st film. During the 1970s, Chang was the most prolific of the directors for the now legendary Shaw Brothers Studios, and most revered works include Ci Ma (1973) (aka Blood Brothers) and the awesome film which is Wu du (1978) (aka Five Venoms).

Our Star

Tien-Chi Cheng (aka: Ricky Cheng)

​

Premise: A young martial artist seeks revenge on the Ninja who kills his martial arts brothers and teacher. He finds help in the form of a new teacher (who knows Ninjitsu) and new brothers. Together the four pupils face the Five Element Ninja challenge: Wood, Earth, Gold, Water, and Fire.

Budget: $???

Box Office: Almost 2 Million HK$

Trivia
(Courtesy of the Audio Commentary)
​

* The actors were a mix of Hong Kongers and Taiwanese. Both spoke their native language during filming and the movie was later dubbed into Cantonese.

* None of the Japanese actors were played by actual Japanese.

* The female ninja played by Pei Hsi Chen was entirely a creation of producer Mona Fong. Mona had taken a liking to the actress and instructed director Chang Cheh to create a role for her.

* Most of the fight scenes required only one or two takes to get right due to the experience of the actors.

Members: @europe1 @MusterX @Scott Parker 27 @the muntjac @Cubo de Sangre @sickc0d3r @FrontNakedChoke @AndersonsFoot @Tufts @Coolthulu @Yotsuya @jei @LHWBelt @moreorless87 @ArtemV @Bullitt68 @GSPSAKU @HenryFlower @Rimbaud82 @Deus Ex Machina

 

[Captain Davis]

Oops, I thought this was about basketball.

 

[LHWBelt]

Alright i watched the movie but ill be honest somewhere in the middle i lost interest. It's complete nonsense for the most part. I did like the tree people though that was a silly touch.

 

[LHWBelt]

Shit my bad the best part actually is when the kungfu master gets poisoned and he tells his crew he can't do kungfu for like 3 months. Then in another scene the ninja head master says they should attack now cuz he cant do kungfu for 3 months. Evidently the 3 month rule was very well known.

 

[FrontNakedChoke]

Did anyone else not get the notification for the tiebreak winner?

I could have just missed it.

 

[punky brewster]

Oops, I thought this was about basketball.

 

[LHWBelt]

Did anyone else not get the notification for the tiebreak winner?

I could have just missed it.

U screwed us

 

[europe1]

Yeah I... wasn't that high on this movie. It's alright and all... but it was definitively on the lower end of all Chang Cheh movies I've seen. I think it's easiest to talk about this movie squarely in relation to other martial arts movies (and especially in relation to Chang Cheh's own oeuvre). So that's what I'll do.


I know that it's almost a joke at this point about how "the plot doesn't matter in Kung Fu movies", but this movie just made me wish Chang still gave a damn about the story. The dramatic underpinning in his early stuff like One-Armed Swordsman, Five Deadly Venom or Golden Swallow made those movies so much better than his later stuff when he really just ran headlong to the punch-y, kick-y. I mean, this movie has such lazy plotting that when our protagonists get tied-up we have a previously unheralded flashback to when he learned by accident how to undo such a move!

Speaking of Golden Swallow, holy suicides batman! Chang Cheh definitively has a major fetish for his virtue boys falling on their own swords. Also speaking of Golden Swallow -- for those who don't know -- Chang Cheh was not really a fan of the fairer gender (dude loved himself some martial brotherly love though, dying in battle and all that). The female ninja part was basically mandated by producer Mona Fong who had taken a liking to the actress. She just straight-up told Chang to write her into the movie, somehow (and so we have female ninjas!). Honestly, I think her presence uplifts the movie, a needy chance of pace, basically.

That fishnet outfit though...

It's interesting how much they promote ninja techniques and equipment in this film. They even write the names on the screen when they're used. It's sort of garish how over-the-top the film is and how meticulous they are in trying to appear accurate with their use of ninja paraphernalia.

However, if one would want to watch an "accurate" ninja movie, the Japanese just did it way, waaay better with the Raizô Ichikawa Ninja Trilogy from the 60's.

Furthermore, As a Japan vs China movie, 5 Element Ninjas is just nowhere near as good as say Heroes of the East or Duel to the Death, which were superior both on a martial and dramatic angle (as well as just communicating the difference in style between the two nations).

But even on a pure action-level, this movie doesn't compare to some of Chang Cheh contemporary films. It falls way below Kid with the Golden Fist in terms of creating interesting combatants and then having them square-off like a kid playing with his action toys. Neither does the movie have the sheer mean-spirited intensity and perverse cruelty of Masked Avengers (on the plus side it's nowhere near as confusing). Nor does it have the crafty camera-trickery of Sword Stained With Royal Blood to make the fighting more engaging (but again, the plus side is that it's nowhere near as silly as that movie).

This isn't the worst Chang Cheh movie out there though. It's about on par with Shaolin Temple and a bit better than said movies sequel 5 Shaolin Masters (which is basically a bunch of guys running around a forest getting into fights) and it's waaay better than the worst stuff Cheh ever did like Death Ring.

 

[Yotsuya]

Good times! It was my second viewing of this movie and my favorite SMC experience so far. I used to hate Chang Cheh’s wooden style when I got into this genre years back, but looks like I’m getting over my hang-ups, as Five Element Ninjas really hit the spot this time.

On HD mastered bluray this kind of delirious macho pop psychedelia comes on it’s own keeping me entertained and towards the end I really got into main characters groove. Gimmicks were campy and neat on both sides. Kung fu was pretty clunky mostly, but so fast paced and varied, that I didn’t mind at all and Cheh outdid himself on gore department. Nasty fun and one of the best Shaw Bros movies I’ve seen in years!

Ps. Poor last wood ninja who got quartered! I felt sorry for the guy.

 

[LHWBelt]

Yeah I... wasn't that high on this movie. It's alright and all... but it was definitively on the lower end of all Chang Cheh movies I've seen. I think it's easiest to talk about this movie squarely in relation to other martial arts movies (and especially in relation to Chang Cheh's own oeuvre). So that's what I'll do.


I know that it's almost a joke at this point about how "the plot doesn't matter in Kung Fu movies", but this movie just made me wish Chang still gave a damn about the story. The dramatic underpinning in his early stuff like One-Armed Swordsman, Five Deadly Venom or Golden Swallow made those movies so much better than his later stuff when he really just ran headlong to the punch-y, kick-y. I mean, this movie has such lazy plotting that when our protagonists get tied-up we have a previously unheralded flashback to when he learned by accident how to undo such a move!

Speaking of Golden Swallow, holy suicides batman! Chang Cheh definitively has a major fetish for his virtue boys falling on their own swords. Also speaking of Golden Swallow -- for those who don't know -- Chang Cheh was not really a fan of the fairer gender (dude loved himself some martial brotherly love though, dying in battle and all that). The female ninja part was basically mandated by producer Mona Fong who had taken a liking to the actress. She just straight-up told Chang to write her into the movie, somehow (and so we have female ninjas!). Honestly, I think her presence uplifts the movie, a needy chance of pace, basically.

That fishnet outfit though...

It's interesting how much they promote ninja techniques and equipment in this film. They even write the names on the screen when they're used. It's sort of garish how over-the-top the film is and how meticulous they are in trying to appear accurate with their use of ninja paraphernalia.

However, if one would want to watch an "accurate" ninja movie, the Japanese just did it way, waaay better with the Raizô Ichikawa Ninja Trilogy from the 60's.

Furthermore, As a Japan vs China movie, 5 Element Ninjas is just nowhere near as good as say Heroes of the East or Duel to the Death, which were superior both on a martial and dramatic angle (as well as just communicating the difference in style between the two nations).

But even on a pure action-level, this movie doesn't compare to some of Chang Cheh contemporary films. It falls way below Kid with the Golden Fist in terms of creating interesting combatants and then having them square-off like a kid playing with his action toys. Neither does the movie have the sheer mean-spirited intensity and perverse cruelty of Masked Avengers (on the plus side it's nowhere near as confusing). Nor does it have the crafty camera-trickery of Sword Stained With Royal Blood to make the fighting more engaging (but again, the plus side is that it's nowhere near as silly as that movie).

This isn't the worst Chang Cheh movie out there though. It's about on par with Shaolin Temple and a bit better than said movies sequel 5 Shaolin Masters (which is basically a bunch of guys running around a forest getting into fights) and it's waaay better than the worst stuff Cheh ever did like Death Ring.

Your review was a little more thorough than mine. I guess i dont like kung fu idk. No plot and crap action doesn't really do it for me.

 

[MusterX]

Shit my bad the best part actually is when the kungfu master gets poisoned and he tells his crew he can't do kungfu for like 3 months. Then in another scene the ninja head master says they should attack now cuz he cant do kungfu for 3 months. Evidently the 3 month rule was very well known.

LOL, I actually got a good chuckle from that. He was like, "don't touch that! It could be poisoned. The other one was poisoned and now I can't do Kung Fu for three months." I was thinking, what kind of poison prevents you from doing Kung Fu for three months?!

Edit: I almost forgot, I also laughed pretty hard when the Fire guys in red used a smoke bomb and the guy they were fighting goes, "Ahhh, secret weapons!"

 

[LHWBelt]

LOL, I actually got a good chuckle from that. He was like, "don't touch that! It could be poisoned. The other one was poisoned and now I can't do Kung Fu for three months." I was thinking, what kind of poison prevents you from doing Kung Fu for three months?!

Edit: I almost forgot, I also laughed pretty hard when the Fire guys in red used a smoke bomb and the guy they were fighting goes, "Ahhh, secret weapons!"

I missed the secret weapons part lol. Perhaps this was a comedy we just didn't know it.

 

[Yotsuya]

* None of the Japanese actors were played by actual Japanese.

Good to know that no actual Japanese were harmed during the filming.

I mean, this movie has such lazy plotting that when our protagonists get tied-up we have a previously unheralded flashback to when he learned by accident how to undo such a move!

I though that the film started kicking in when he got the flashback about the Chinese ninjamaster. That was really out-of-the-blue and his original master was a bit boring.

It's interesting how much they promote ninja techniques and equipment in this film. They even write the names on the screen when they're used. It's sort of garish how over-the-top the film is and how meticulous they are in trying to appear accurate with their use of ninja paraphernalia.

Well, they were of old Chinese taoist origin, so surely it was worth spreading awareness of this stuff for the Chinese audiences.

Furthermore, As a Japan vs China movie, 5 Element Ninjas is just nowhere near as good as say Heroes of the East or Duel to the Death, which were superior both on a martial and dramatic angle (as well as just communicating the difference in style between the two nations).

This is very true! 5 Element Ninjas is campy fun where as those two are actually good movies.

 

[MusterX]

I know that it's almost a joke at this point about how "the plot doesn't matter in Kung Fu movies", but this movie just made me wish Chang still gave a damn about the story. The dramatic underpinning in his early stuff like One-Armed Swordsman, Five Deadly Venom or Golden Swallow made those movies so much better than his later stuff when he really just ran headlong to the punch-y, kick-y. I mean, this movie has such lazy plotting that when our protagonists get tied-up we have a previously unheralded flashback to when he learned by accident how to undo such a move!

I'm not going to say its a Kung Fu masterpiece but I think you are being too hard on Five Element Ninjas. It contains classic use of varied weaponry and the story itself really is Japanese vs. Chinese martial arts. That particular "storyline" plays out in many martial arts movies. Even in IP man we get some of that sentiment with "Your southern style is better than my northern style" line, or however it went. Even when its just this dojo vs. that dojo which we see in movies like Karate Kid and countless others, its almost always got a flavor of nationality or a conflict of style. That was the entire point of the first UFC's was style vs. style to see which was better. In addition to that the use of the five elements is classic in Kung Fu movies.

 

[MusterX]

@europe1 its kinda bugging me you didn't like this movie. What about the way Senji was killed? She is a deceitful wench and she used her feminine charms to have all of Tien-hao's friends killed but then in the scene she is killed she was sent to spy on Tien-hao but she acted like she really wanted to help him. Was this another trick? It seemed she was genuinely shocked when Tien-hao skewered her and then after Tien Hao kills the four ninjas he says, "ha, I made the right choice. Didn't I?" He questions the decision he made to kill her.

 

[europe1]

Shit my bad the best part actually is when the kungfu master gets poisoned and he tells his crew he can't do kungfu for like 3 months. Then in another scene the ninja head master says they should attack now cuz he cant do kungfu for 3 months.

Personally, what I wonder is, if they have already poisoned him and rendered him defenseless for 3 months... why do they have to poison him again afterward? The dude is so helpless a mook could cut him down. Is he really such a high priority target when he can't even use his Kung Fu.

Oh well, probably just something they wrote in when the girl ninja got injected into the story -- having to come up with things for her to do.

Your review was a little more thorough than mine.

Well 90% of what I did was just compare it to other martial arts films.

I used to hate Chang Cheh’s wooden

Hate Chang Cheh?

You are more loathsome than Iron Feet!

delirious macho pop psychedelia

Those colored ninjas sure did work a lot better than the colored ninjas in Godfrey Ho films!

Gimmicks were campy and neat on both sides. Kung fu was pretty clunky mostly

Sort of strange that they never went down into the styles-vs-styles route like they usually do. Here it was more about gadgets and trickery. No one ever told Ricky Cheng to "Use the Southern-Fist STYLE!!!1"

that I didn’t mind at all and Cheh outdid himself on gore department

Was pretty freaky when the guy's guts were supposed to hang out (and poorly done).

Personally, I think the gore worked a lot more effective in Masked Avengers, just due to how sadistic and mean-spirited it was delivered there. Here it seemed almost more incidental.

Got to laugh at the ending though, when they pull the bad guy apart by the waist. His legs are pulled several meters away from his torso but blood keeps spurting out of them! And blood just geysers out of the ground where he could have no discernable body-parts. That's not how it's supposed to work... is it?

I though that the film started kicking in when he got the flashback about the Chinese ninjamaster. That was really out-of-the-blue and his original master was a bit boring.

Mostly I think it's funny how he gets 3 new brothers and he's all "Kewl! You are all now my blood-brothers!" Talk about an ease of adopting familiar relations.

Well, they were of old Chinese taoist origin, so surely it was worth spreading awareness of this stuff for the Chinese audiences.

Yeah, I thought the Taoist-origin stuff was sort of interesting. Why did it inject that? Was it something they found in a purported old document? Or was it to white-wash the fact that you have Chinese people using Japanese martial arts in order to win? Or was it just a general China > Japan thing?

I was thinking, what kind of poison prevents you from doing Kung Fu for three months?!

He was using his Chi to repress the poison, fighting it back with body-energies until it dilapidates inside his system. Or that's what I suppose he's doing, knowing martial arts lore.

Even in IP man we get some of that sentiment with "Your southern style is better than my northern style" line, or however it went.

The dude that Ip Man fought when the Northen martial artist came to town and started thrashing the place was none-other than Ricky-Oh himself! it was bullshit that Ip Man won that bout. Ricky-Oh could have killed him with one blow!

Spoiler

@europe1 its kinda bugging me you didn't like this movie

Well... my basic issue that I've seen a whole slew of Chang Cheh films and this really was one of the lower-end ones. His other stuff is generally just better.

She is a deceitful wench and she used her feminine charms

Which is why she was my favorite character

She might not get to lay with the guy but she still end ups playing his flute!

Tien-hao but she acted like she really wanted to help him. Was this another trick?

I think she was supposed to be genuine. She did spare him the first time because she was still into him. Plus... it's just genre conventions. HK films are big on doomed, tragic romances. It seems pretty in-line with conventions.

But I think her being killed of like that was just a way for Chang Cheh to end her plotline. She was artificially injected into the movie due to a producer. The director had to write her in and then write her out in such a way that it didn't disrutbe the major plotpoints he had going.

"ha, I made the right choice. Didn't I?" He questions the decision he made to kill her.

He also said in the ending, after being mortally wounded, "Maybe it was Senji's spirit that still haunted me", in response to why he performed his suicide attack. So it appears her death did affect him greatly.

 

[MusterX]

I think she was supposed to be genuine. She did spare him the first time because she was still into him. Plus... it's just genre conventions. HK films are big on doomed, tragic romances. It seems pretty in-line with conventions.

But I think her being killed of like that was just a way for Chang Cheh to end her plotline. She was artificially injected into the movie due to a producer. The director had to write her in and then write her out in such a way that it didn't disrutbe the major plotpoints he had going.

He also said in the ending, after being mortally wounded, "Maybe it was Senji's spirit that still haunted me", in response to why he performed his suicide attack. So it appears her death did affect him greatly.

Yea there was something about her character that had me interested. I think if it was forced, she was introduced and then killed in a good way. She kept saying, don't you like me while partially disrobing and I'm like, yes...I like you....

I also want to point out I loved how the final four ninjas took out each set of the Five Element Ninjas. The water especially because they scooped them all up in a big net and they kinda flopped around like fish before being slaughtered. I'm sorry but that is good shit. Fighting the Fire Ninjas they used black banners to fan the smoke away. They carefully selected which weapons to use for each of the Five Elements. Gold they had to fight with their eyes shut, wood was sweet because they quartered the last guy, and for Earth they used stilts.

Question though: Tien-hao goes to his all pro ninja trainer after all his friends are slaughtered. Local pro-ninja says I was taught by this cat named Ninja Supreme and he gave me this key, maybe you will need it.

1. Who is this Ninja Supreme and why didn't we get to meet him?!
2. How did Ninja Supreme know the key would later be needed by people he didn't even know?!

I bet Ninja Supreme could have killed everyone in the movie and we didn't get to see him.

 

[LHWBelt]

Why cant we do just weird ass movies? Why does it have to be shit I have never even heard of. Look, I consider myself a cinophile, but Europe/Dragon, you are pulling some shit out of your ass. C in Hong Kong does not mean B in America.

What does it mean in America?

 

[Yotsuya]

Hate Chang Cheh?

You are more loathsome than Iron Feet!

I can get like that sometimes...

Sort of strange that they never went down into the styles-vs-styles route like they usually do. Here it was more about gadgets and trickery.

It was pretty unfair round two when they knew all the gimmicks and had tools to counter them. It was like shooting fish in a barrel for the Chinese ninja crew. I like it when good guys get ruthless.

Got to laugh at the ending though, when they pull the bad guy apart by the waist. His legs are pulled several meters away from his torso but blood keeps spurting out of them! And blood just geysers out of the ground where he could have no discernable body-parts. That's not how it's supposed to work... is it?

Maybe he used some yoga technique at first to stretch his body like the Indian fighters in One-Armed Boxer movies, but eventually just could not take it anymore.

Mostly I think it's funny how he gets 3 new brothers and he's all "Kewl! You are all now my blood-brothers!" Talk about an ease of adopting familiar relations.

Hah, that went really smooth for him!

Yeah, I thought the Taoist-origin stuff was sort of interesting. Why did it inject that? Was it something they found in a purported old document? Or was it to white-wash the fact that you have Chinese people using Japanese martial arts in order to win? Or was it just a general China > Japan thing?

Yeah, I guess it would have looked bad if there had been Chinese ninja master who would have studied under the Japanese. Great revisionism anyhow. Edit. I forgot about the Ninja Supreme. Well at least the art was originally Chinese.

 

[MusterX]

It was pretty unfair round two when they knew all the gimmicks and had tools to counter them. It was like shooting fish in a barrel for the Chinese ninja crew. I like it when good guys get ruthless.

I timestamped this potato quality video of the Water ninja kills. Its one of the highlight memorable moments of the film for me because they catch the water ninja's in nets and when they haul in their catch the water ninjas flop around like fish. Timestamped for last minute of scene.