SHERDOG MOVIE CLUB: WEEK 114: Coherence

Discussion in 'Mayberry Lounge' started by europe1, Jul 11, 2018.

  1. sickc0d3r

    sickc0d3r Black Belt

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    There were so many quotes like that in the movie, but I missed this one.

    I noted that Laurie says "I'm crossing all kinds of boundaries". And Lee says about Mike "he's not the man I married". There were tons more but I didn't write them down.

    That's what I loved about it. You rewatch it and see an almost completely different movie.

    Yep. I don't see how you can explain it without the science, it's woven into the plot and it is the basis for everything that happens. Hell, Hugh is probably named after Hugh Everett, the guy who came up with the many worlds theory.

    I kind of thought the same thing, but Mike said at one point "this only started tonight, if there are a million realities I banged your wife in all of them".
    I think it means people don't stray that far from who they really are. And anyway, what's available in THIS BOX would only be the branches created by decisions made during the comet. Or something.
     
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  2. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    The film would need to be lengthened considerably to try to explain the things I'm trying to explain in this thread. The way that the quantum world operates is so nonsensical that ever getting someone to understand it is a fools errand. I've spent a fairly large chunk of time just trying to get a layman's grasp.

    Richard Feynman, who was one of the smartest men who ever lived, said this about the quantum world.

    [​IMG]

    Here is another from Roger Penrose, these are big brained men.

    [​IMG]

    The difference is that quantum possibility clouds are not the same as a multi-verse. A multi-verse is a situation where there is an actual infinite number of material universes and since they are infinite, then every conceivable possibility has and is happening. With quantum mechanics, all those universes only exist within a cloud of possibility. Each one of those possibilities only becomes real in the material world when we act on it, when we interfere with it, when we study it, when we measure it, and only THEN do those possibilities becomes real in the macro world.

    I'm telling you that all those "other people" were not from other planets, they were only possible outcomes from a quantum cloud, an infinite number of them. If they chose not to interfere like Hugh told them to then they would have been fine but it was their interference with the cloud that caused all the shit to happen. Basically we learned about this stuff starting with the Double Slit experiment. That in in itself would be a task to explain.

    Basically boiled down, we fire protons through a metal sheet with two slits in it. On the wall behind the sheet a wave or cloud appears as the protons pass through the two slits in the metal sheet. Basically the pattern looks like this.

    [​IMG]

    The protons flow through the slits like a wave of water.

    [​IMG]

    BUT, we got too smart for our own good and decided we wanted to know just which slit the protons were passing through, left or right? So we set up detectors to see which slit the protons were passing through and all of a sudden, as if the particles knew they were being measured they stopped going through like a wave, or a cloud, and they become particles passing through in the material plain, and looked like this on the back wall.

    [​IMG]

    Well, this baffled really smart people because how did it change from a wave, to a particle? Those are two different things. The fact it only changed when we tried to measure it was also quite strange. The second mind blower that happened was they still were trying to figure out which slit the protons were traveling through and they found out that each proton was actually going through both slits, simultaneously, exhibiting Superposition, or being in two places at the same time.

    This is the reality we are dealing with and the one that was being addressed in the film. All of the people were that wave above but when our characters started interacting with them, they stopped being a wave of possibility and changed to particles, or realities in the material plane. It was their interference that Hugh warned them not to do that caused chaos.
     
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  3. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre Steel Belt

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    So bottom line, right now, are any of us real? :eek::D


    If it all started that night then why the confusion over Laurie's profession and actor-boy being on the tv show or not?
     
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  4. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Its always funny to see something like that appear in an animated series. You can be guaranteed 99% of people that saw it had no idea wtf was being said. That quiet environment is what has to be achieved for quantum computing. D-Wave discovered that they could only compute wit entangled atoms if the environment was cooled almost to absolute zero and the environment was highly shielded, or quiet.

    No, I'm saying all of reality is the possibility "bubble" or "cloud." I'm saying that at the quantum level, all the atoms and particles that make up the universe that you know, behave in this way. They appear immaterial, they are neither here nor there, they are here and there, they are both still and moving at the same time, they are in Superposition, they are entangled, and all sorts of other strangeness. It is only when we observe them, or they are interfered with, that they come into focus as the reality you know and understand. Otherwise they remain in a cloud of strangeness unlike anything ever conceived of in a novel or movie because they are nothing, and everything, at the same time.

    When you fire a proton through a metal sheet with 2 slits on it, that 1 proton goes through both slits, simultaneously, it is in both places at once.

    [​IMG]

    The reason you could see both Emily's and other characters at the same time is illustrated by the picture above. The proton, or in this case the Emily, can be in more than one place at once. This is the reality we are living in. The proton doesn't split, causing half to go through slit A and half through slit B, it simply is in both places at the same time. This is kinda what you are dealing with in the film. All those Emily's are essentially possible her's, they can be is an infinite number of positions within the cloud.
     
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  5. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    I may regret nominating this film because its very difficult to explain even in layman's terms. When the two become entangled it doesn't mean they meld into 1 person.

    Quantum entanglement
    Quantum entanglement is a physical phenomenon that occurs when pairs or groups of particles are generated or interact in ways such that the quantum state of each particle cannot be described independently — instead, a quantum state must be described for the system as a whole.

    [​IMG]

    Emily though that the cloud would collapse into a single coherent reality with her being the only one remaining but she managed to get entangled with the other Emily. This is what Hugh warned them about when Mike wanted to go kill all of the "others." You can attribute it to the switching of the ring possibly but you also can't rely on the director to get it perfect do to the fact only a few men on the planet truly have a grasp of quantum theory.

    Emily was thinking Schrodinger's Cat and when the box was opened, in this case the comet was gone, that she would be the only one left in that reality but she got entangled through her own interference. This is why she passed out after coming out of the bathroom. She was entangled with the Emily that she just clobbered and stole the ring from. Once they were entangled what happens to one affects the other as well.
     
  6. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Well, physics and quantum physics are two very different things but I would be interested to know what he thinks about the film. Its tough to nail it down without multiple viewings plus other research.
     
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  7. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Its god awful hard to sort out. I don't know if the ring was the deciding factor that entangled the two together but after she hit Emily #2 in the head and stole her ring she walked out of the bathroom and collapsed, just like Emily #2 was collapsed in the tub.

    We know Emily was not the only one that got Twilight Zoned here. I timestamped this and it shows 2 Mike's tied to chairs. They were most certainly entangled and when things went back to normal those two Mike's were trapped together. Once again, it was the people that interfered that this happened to.

     
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  8. sickc0d3r

    sickc0d3r Black Belt

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    Good question. I guess that dinner conversation inference could be wrong. Or, maybe there's some wiggle room as Mike's statement is only a message that the characters don't change much. I think by that time the Kevins had been roaming around trying to erase their past and assume the life of good Kevin, but found out it doesn't exist.
     
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  9. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Laurie was pretty damn seductive in that hallway scene. She was all, "some people just.....fit....you know what I mean."

    After 3 viewings I can tell you I get a different feel each time, learn more, notice more.

    That is awesome, I had no idea. You've just added something more to a film I thought I wrung dry.

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. sickc0d3r

    sickc0d3r Black Belt

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    Another thing... like muster is saying, they aren't realities, they are possible realities. So the choices they make spawn probable outcomes within character and inside the existing framework.
     
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  11. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Basically they were were all mixed up from different places by the end. Are any of us real? What is real? The only reason you don't fall right through the chair your sitting on right now is because of its electric charge of energy. There is almost no matter there at all. In fact, there is almost no matter in the entire universe. How do you think the entire universe was compacted into a space the size of a bowling ball or what it was before the Big Bang?

    You think I'm making this shit up?

    Some days, you might feel like a pretty substantial person. Maybe you have a lot of friends, or an important job, or a really big car.

    But it might humble you to know that all of those things – your friends, your office, your really big car, you yourself, and even everything in this incredible, vast Universe – are almost entirely, 99.9999999 percent empty space.


    Here’s the deal. As I previously wrote in a story for the particle physics publication Symmetry, the size of an atom is governed by the average location of its electrons: how much space there is between the nucleus and the atom’s amorphous outer shell.

    Nuclei are around 100,000 times smaller than the atoms they’re housed in.

    If the nucleus were the size of a peanut, the atom would be about the size of a baseball stadium. If we lost all the dead space inside our atoms, we would each be able to fit into a particle of dust, and the entire human species would fit into the volume of a sugar cube.
    https://www.sciencealert.com/99-9999999-of-your-body-is-empty-space


    If we removed all the empty space in your bodies atoms you would be the size of a particle of dust. The entire human race would fit in a sugar cube.

    [​IMG]

    That goes for the entire universe. There is almost nothing there at all. As I said, if not for the electrical charge of the atoms in the chair you are sitting on, pushing back against the electrical charge of the atoms in your body, you would fall right through that chair, the planet as well.

    [​IMG]

    So I would say, what is real? It appears that consciousness and energy are the only real things. Where do electrons get their charge? How do they hold their charge basically forever? Think about that some. They have a specific charge of energy, and it doesn't change, and it doesn't go dead like a battery. If not for these specific energy charges in subatomic particles, then nothing would exist at all.
     
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  12. sickc0d3r

    sickc0d3r Black Belt

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    I'm definitely going to watch it again, and when I do I think this time I'll focus on the house décor. I guarantee the houses had subtle differences and I want to figure out how many we actually saw. Also I'm sure there's an assload of illuminati symbolism to be found :cool:
     
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  13. sickc0d3r

    sickc0d3r Black Belt

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    [​IMG]
     
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  14. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    That is absurdly hard to try to understand.

    I guess bottom line is this. Really it was the characters struggling with what could have been, what might have been in another life. Only problem is, in quantum mechanics those things seem to be not only possible, but probable. The entire thing is very hard to get a handle on.
     
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  15. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Is that not fucking crazy? Remove all the dead space in the atoms and the entire human race fits in a sugar cube. The entire material universe is 99.999% empty space. What is real? I don't know. We are existing in a free standing 3 dimensional reality that appears to be mostly energy, not matter. The electrical charges of our atoms make it SEEM as if we are solid, and the chair is solid, but I'm not sure that is the case. People joke around about holographic universe theories and simulation theories, maybe its not a joke. These things seem much more plausible when you start understanding the nature of matter.

    It is the energy charges of the subatomic particles that make you THINK matter is solid. I'm telling you, its not. Your electrical field is pushing back against the chairs electrical field, so you don't fall right through it. Nobody even knows how these particles acquire their charge or how they hold on to it.
     
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  16. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    OMG, you are triggering me. The two houses matched and the two dinner parties matched because they were dealing with the possibilities from the cloud of possibilities that have to do with their lives. The other people only represented possible outcomes for each one of their lives. Its like a huge tapestry that is all about you but in the total scope you only make up one thread in that tapestry. All the other threads are made of possibilities.

    You can't say well in one realty they may not have had a dinner party at all.....there is only ONE reality. Its just that quantum mechanics says within that one reality, anything can happen. That is why I was trying to explain electron clouds and double slit experiments.
     
  17. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre Steel Belt

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    With crazy shit like this every little bit helps.


    <28>
     
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  18. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre Steel Belt

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    Not sure how that explains being totally wrong about your long-time friend's employment background. What was originally billed as memory failure turned out to be interaction with extra-dimensional semi-doppelgangers. That means different choices were made in these alternate universes prior to the comet.

    Does that include free will?
     
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  19. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    Hugh fucked up big time. He went to the other house and he and Amir brought the box back with the pictures. We don't know which Hugh that was though. Was it the oirginal Hugh or another Hugh? The timeline I posted in post #60 seems to think that it was in fact Hugh1 and Amir1 that returned with the box.

    House1-Blue-Amir1, Emily1, Kevin1, Laurie1, Beth1, Lee1, Hugh1, Mike1.

    Amir1 and Hugh1 go out exploring. Some other Hugh (as we now know) knocks violently on the side door but disappears. None of the group is aware of this, but Amir1 and Hugh1 come back soon with the first box. Box1 contains a ping pong paddle as the random object.


    Hugh may have not known what he was dealing with at that point. All he knew was his brother said if anything strange happens then call me and Hugh was going to try to use the phone. I don't think Hugh knew it was a bad idea to get involved with your "other" until he read his brothers notes about coherence and decoherence. Either way though, ironic that Hugh started the bad series of events. It wasn't even Hugh though. It was Amir who grabbed the box.

    When Hugh and Amir arrive back at the house, Hugh has a cut on his brow and Amir is carrying the box containing the pictures. The other guests ask about the box and Amir says something strange in reference to the box, "I thought I saw him (Hugh) put it down and he was running around the corner and I just followed him." Then when Hugh walks in the room they say, "Hugh did you put that down?" to which Hugh Replies, "Amir why did you take that?" Amir says, "I saw you put it down." Hugh says, "I did not touch that thing."

    Those are exact quotes. So I guess some other Hugh, we'll call him Hugh2 put the box down and Amir1 saw Hugh2 and thought it was Hugh1 which explains why Hugh acted as if he never saw or touched any box. Either way though, you are right, Amir and Hugh are the ones that originally went when they shouldn't have and got everything messed up.
     
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  20. MusterX

    MusterX Steel Belt

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    They blamed everything to do with the comet on the Finns. It was the equivalent of "Thanks Obama" but with the Finns.
     

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