Rizin's Mayweather Gambit May be a Bad Sign

Discussion in 'Worldwide MMA Discussion' started by MilesAbove, Nov 5, 2018.

  1. MilesAbove

    MilesAbove Gold Belt

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    So I'm not sure how known it is in here, but I worked in the industry for 10 years (just left last year to start my teaching career). I've been to 4 Rizin events, two of which to accompany Aliakbari as a handler for his managers. I worked with WSOF GC as a talent coordinator and handler, and before that Tuff-N-Uff as the matchmaker for fighters like Jamie Moyle, Khalil Roundtree, Aspen Ladd, etc... I also helped design a handful of the custom shirts and posters for the UFC, Lionfight, Rizin, etc... And I have to say that the Mayweather deal has me very concerned for the future of Rizin.

    Usually in MMA you are losing money for the first couple/few years. It is just the way the whole deal operates. Yes, it may be easier if you had an entity prior... however if that entity was tainted by shady business, it kinda negates the positives. So operating at a loss is essentially expected, but there are good and bad ways to run in the red. I've watched many companies go down the tubes or be grinded into oblivion due to rash or incompetent decision making at the top... and one thing always stood true: If a big deal came out of nowhere that seemed astounding, it means the company felt it was time to swing for the fences rather than die a slow death.

    Now, I'm not in the know about all things Rizin because I'm a Gaijin; however, I have been around enough to hear the inside rumors. One thing I know isn't a rumor is that Rizin has a backlog of pay that hasn't been given to fighters who already served on the show. It's not a crazy amount and it isn't exactly unheard of for how JMMA operates. But when you then consider Mayweather isn't bragging about the money he signed for, and couple it with the lack of payment to previous fighters you begin to wonder.

    So how can Rizin afford to pay Money Mayweather when they are owing basic fistfuls to average fighters? There's two likely options.
    (1) They signed him for an absurd amount of money and are hoping to pay it off via the sponsorship money that comes in after the fact. They don't want their investors to know the amount because it will scare the crap out of them and are holding their cards close to their chest.
    (2) They gave up ownership to Mayweather OR he's taking essentially all the money up to a certain dollar amount, as Rizin puts an essential lean on themselves against the possibility the money isn't recouped and they owe him the expected return difference. Rizin is then hoping that his being on the show propels sales for future events that will recoup the losses they have to take in order to pay off Mayweather.


    Either way it is worrisome. And maybe there's simply a third option I am not privy to. Maybe Mayweather decided to be a Angel Investor and just help them out.... you can certainly move some money around in Japan to help your books here when you know guys like Takada and Sakakibara. But I've got the notion there's a reason to be concerned for the future of Rizin unless the Mayweather gambit pays off huge. And to those who say "Of course it will pay off huge".... remember he isn't going to be fighting in the US or on US time. So the Rizin heads are essentially gambling on the fact that Asia and Europe will care as much about Mayweather in Japan against a Japan-famous 20yr old prodigy while the US will simply wake up to the results the next day. That's quite the gamble. It's like if the UFC paid $20,000,000 for the best Muay Thai fighter in the world to fight his debut against Stylebender (if stylebender had 10x the fans).



    TL;DR: I am old and have been around the sport long enough to be concerned about this deal given the information we have now.
     
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  2. Ultimate Cuck

    Ultimate Cuck Orange Belt

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    so you're saying it's swing for the fences or die a slow death.. then fuck yeah swing for the fences
    none of this is news anyway, it's no secret Rizin isn't doing amazing
     
  3. skylolow

    skylolow Silver Belt

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    I agree with you, its a head scratcher. But you look at the history in Japan with MMA and its these freak matches that usually out draw anything else they do. But is one good night really going to save the company long term, I doubt it. Not too mention many of these freak matches costed them massive amounts of money at the time to do.

    I believe recently I read on here that Sak was doing some interview very recently and saying more or less things need to turn for the better soon or we could be seeing the end of Rizin soon. If your publically saying things like that it has to be a lot worse behind the scenes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2018
  4. Only Here for Attachments

    Only Here for Attachments Free from yellow thanks to my state's congress

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    They could've just gone on Shark Tank instead of signing Floyd
     
  5. moreorless87

    moreorless87 Listening In

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    What kind of TV coverage does Rizin currently have? I'm wondering if this is perhaps an effort to shift fightsport back to where it was in the 90's and 00's in Japan by drawing a lot of interest to a NYE event, get a big network involved more directly the way Fuji were with Pride.

    Mayweather actually becoming involved in the business himself is an interesting idea. I mean I can somewhat see the logic to it if he was looking to get into MMA promotion as I think you can argue Japan is if not as big a market anymore at least a more open one where as a new startup in the US like Goldenboys upcoming effort is a very difficult proposition.
     
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  6. CDF47

    CDF47 Gold Belt

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    I think Floyd saw a good move to get his TMT promotion into Japan with a big time JMMA company. I think he plans to be profitable off this show. I am sure RIZIN plans the same. I think this fight will draw in Japan. Tenshin/Horiguchi brought 27,000 to Saitama Super Arena. I wonder what Mayweather/Tenshin will bring. I think Mayweather is getting a percentage of gate and PPV.
     
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  7. JimGunn

    JimGunn Silver Belt

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    What PPV? Isn't the Rizin NYE show free on tv in Japan? The peanuts they surely make from the English stream on Fite.tv can't possibly cover the huge payday Floyd requires.
     
  8. Ling Ling

    Ling Ling Green Belt

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    Interesting post. Thanks for the insight.
     
  9. CDF47

    CDF47 Gold Belt

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    Not sure how the TV deal in the states will work. I use the word PPV loosely since they haven't announced a television plan yet.
     
  10. JimGunn

    JimGunn Silver Belt

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    Who says there will be a tv deal in the U.S.? These Rizin cards start at 1 am or 2 am ET with the main events happening in the wee hours of the morning sometimes as the sun is coming up.
     
  11. CDF47

    CDF47 Gold Belt

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    Like I said, not sure what they are going to do regarding TV or if there will be TV for it in the US. I would imagine so for the Mayweather fight and maybe some main card MMA.
     
  12. moreorless87

    moreorless87 Listening In

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    I'm quessing selling advertising slots will be the main income stream from the event but it could potentially be that part of Floyds pay is taking part ownership?
     
  13. RTL

    RTL NostraMMAus™ Platinum Member

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    I'll just give you an A+ on that paper because I don't feel like reading it.
     
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  14. capo245

    capo245 Orange Belt

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    In boxing forums there is the rumor that it has to do with floyds manager and that he has large debts in asia.
    Also hbo just threw him out of buisness hes bleeding money at the moment and especially even worse than that reach and power in boxing.
    And al haymon is getting pushed in the us and europe.
    Eddie hearn and dazn are taking more and more spots of his empire and hes definetly shady and has mafia connections.
    Dont forget that one entertaiments boss was also there said this will lever theyre reach into asia and beyond, and hes right this will get streamed/televised all over asia especially china, far east russia, signapore etc all in that time zone even north and east europe would be possible(eurosport televised all k1 and pridefc events live in the past).
    Also as i understand it rizin will be the plattform for asia thats what ones boss is essentially saying and new stuff is in the making.
    I dont know what s going on but i wouldnt be suprised if rizins staff didnt have anything to do with, it even mayweather looked like he has no clue what was going on same goes for the rizin bosses.
    I would say some rizin investor made this happen.
     
  15. Yrat

    Yrat Purple Belt

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    It seems that you are a Ufc shill who don't want other promotion to succeed and to be honest who cares about how Rizin got Floyd, they got him and Ufc did not!
     
  16. leto1776

    leto1776 Sherdog Wet Shaver Platinum Member

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    It seems you are making assumptions, and thus making an ass of yourself.
     
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  17. MMALOPEZ

    MMALOPEZ Silver Belt

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    Al Haymon just signed with showtime and fox for 3-4 years each tv station: they haven’t lost a single big fighter to Hearn. What are you talking about ?
     
  18. bocajarro

    bocajarro Orange Belt

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    Excellent post. I also think that move is high risk. Let's see how it goes for them.
     
  19. TeamFedor

    TeamFedor White Belt

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    Rizin is not paying Floyd $10 million, 20 million or 30 million lol. Mayweather is looking to expand his business in Japan and takes this fight as an investment, not for a paycheck.

    Rizin hit the jackpot here. It will all be by Floyd's rules and they are more than happy to play by them. It's gonna be huge for Rizin. The fight itself will probably be 3,4 or 5 rounds of boxing, barefoot with smaller gloves. Floyd will win of course, but will make Tenshin look good and let him do some of his stuff.

    Sakakibara has been very smart with finances so far. He is focused on creating homegrown stars like Tenshin and Rena which is less expensive and more profitable. Juju Auclair and Miyu Yamamoto also have been doing very good in terms of ratings. Kanna Asakura and Horiguchi are already decent too. Sakakibara doesn't pay big money to get a lot of former international Pride stars, only gets 1 at a time. First he had Fedor for 1 show, then signed Cro Cop and if Cro Cop really retires at NYE, he will probably sign Josh Barnett. Even Aliakbari wasn't resigned, because they didn't agree on money. Kron Gracie and Gabi Garcia have not fought recently, because they are asking for too much.
     
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  20. killakillakilla

    killakillakilla Brown Belt

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    Hmmmm this is all so odd. It’s hard for me to believe that Rizin would have Mayweather for a fight and not market it to the US nor make it easily accessible from the US. And why isn’t Floyd cross promoting? This is so weird twilight zone shit for real.
     

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