Recent fights/results/news from China

[Kanka]

I'd rank him top 10 in 70 kg GOAT ranking, but nowhere near #1 in 70 kg or ATG P4P ranking.

 

[SuperLuigi]

If RvR tornado kick KOs Pet I will forever swear he is #1 ATG.

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

I don't like his style at all but he's easily top ten all time at 70kg IMO. right around #9 or 10 spot. He's totally unremarkable but at the same time very consistent.

 

[Mafanofe]

top 10 70kg by resume(consistence on fighting the best guys,in their best form, at the highest level)

1- Buakaw

2-Souwer

3- Petrosyan

4- Masato

5- Sitthichai

6- Kraus

7- Kyshenko

8-RVR

9- Sato

10- Zambidis

------------------------------------------------------------

top 10 70kg by prime(how good they are-were at their peak)


1-Buakaw

2-Petrosyan

3-Souwer

4-Kyshenko

5-Masato-Sitthichai

6-Sato

7- Zambidis

8- RVR

9- Grigorian

10- Allazov

Obs:Not considering Yod on the skill Ranking because he was mostly a western MT guy that fought kickboxing,even being amazing on KB rules.

 

[Kanka]

Haven't followed Masato closely but i've been hearing he got a lot of gift decisions. Any comment on that?

 

[Mafanofe]

Haven't followed Masato closely but i've been hearing he got a lot of gift decisions. Any comment on that?

as long as i like him he got

-in 2003 he got a super gift decision against Zambidis

- 2004 the wtf extra round against Buakaw

- in 2008 he lost to kyshenko and Sato in normal time and was gave extra round and was the champ for that

Amazing fighter,but basically K-1 max was created because of him,so they made these robberies..

 

[DastardlyMass]

Souwer benefited the most from dubious decisions. Every big win he had except for one over mastato you could argue should have never been for him.

 

[Julius_Caesar]

Haven't followed Masato closely but i've been hearing he got a lot of gift decisions. Any comment on that?

Same goes with souwer. Not sure how people can put souwer and masato ahead of sittichai but to each their own I guess. I think we all know deep down sittichai would beat both of them in their primes. Prime souwer imo lost to yodsanklai and yod had never fought kb rules before that.

 

[Kanka]

Same goes with souwer. Not sure how people can put souwer and masato ahead of sittichai but to each their own I guess. I think we all know deep down sittichai would beat both of them in their primes. Prime souwer imo lost to yodsanklai and yod had never fought kb rules before that.

Yeah i agree. For me the absolute best are Buakaw, Petrosyan and Sittichai.

I feel like Souwer, Masato, Kyshenko, RvR, Marat, Zambidis, Kraus etc are about the same. Really difficult to do a ranking because some of them fought at different eras and they could probably all beat each others in their prime. I think Marat is as good as any of these guys but he hasn't accomplished as much imo.

Allazov, Superbon and Gogokhia are probably good candidates but haven't accomplished enough imo.

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

Souwer benefited the most from dubious decisions. Every big win he had except for one over mastato you could argue should have never been for him.

@Mafanofe is going to rip you apart.

Also Marat the thai slayer could KTFO most of these guys on a good night. That physical style is likely to wear off big time at some point - same with RvR - but while he's at his peak he's always game to fuck people up.

 

[Mafanofe]

Souwer benefited the most from dubious decisions. Every big win he had except for one over mastato you could argue should have never been for him.

well he received some dubious decisions but his victories over Joerie Mes, Kraus,Sato, Holzken(a close fight but he inflicted more damage), Zambidis(first real KO loss of zambidis career, the previous are all because of cut´s) were all legit


on 2008 i thought he should had won against Kyshenko and in 2009 he should had lost against Kyshenko.

 

[Mafanofe]

Not being Nostalgic but I would favor prime masato and Kyshenko over all these current guys.

Masato was too fast and good on scoring with combos, Marat is a good fighter but he would get smartly outworked

I would also favor both of them to beat a prime Sitthichai but not a prime petrosyan, petro on his prime was a near to perfect counter striker with an out of this world defense,while Sitthichai tends to have more holes on his defense when he is willing to attack, a room for masato uppercut-hook+ lowkicks fast combos because he was very good in change the pace with closing and opening the distance to outscore opponents

 

[Julius_Caesar]

Not being Nostalgic but I would favor prime masato and Kyshenko over all these current guys.

Masato was too fast and good on scoring with combos, Marat is a good fighter but he would get smartly outworked

I would also favor both of them to beat a prime Sitthichai but not a prime petrosyan, petro on his prime was a near to perfect counter striker with an out of this world defense,while Sitthichai tends to have more holes on his defense when he is willing to attack, a room for masato uppercut-hook+ lowkicks fast combos because he was very good in change the pace with closing and opening the distance to outscore opponents

I think both would get southpawed (the moment a kickboxer with not much experience against thai's goes up against a thai southpaw and freezes). Like Sittichai vs Roosmalen 1, Petch vs Roosmalen, Yod vs Marat to name examples. Sittichai vs Baya is a good example. Sittichai vs most orthodox fighters for that matter. They can't work him out and sometimes they freeze bringing them down to sittichais pace. In short sittichai has more experience against styles like Masato and Kyshenko than they have against styles like sittichai. You guys act surprised when guys like Baya look lost in there against sittichai. You're underrating how complicated it can be to fight a good thai southpaw for the first time.

The only guys from the past who could maybe beat sittichai and all the best of today are buakaw and petro but for me that's still a big IF. Who knows how they would cope against Chingiz skills or marats pressure. What about Yodwicha? Are we forgetting that he's a part time kickboxer? But as usual you guys underrate the level of some of these kickboxers today but this happens in every combat sport. Fans always rank fighters from the past over fighters from the present. Its almost like a natural instinct.

 

[Mafanofe]

I think both would get southpawed (the moment a kickboxer with not much experience against thai's goes up against a thai southpaw and freezes). Like Sittichai vs Roosmalen 1, Petch vs Roosmalen, Yod vs Marat to name examples. Sittichai vs Baya is a good example. Sittichai vs most orthodox fighters for that matter. They can't work him out and sometimes they freeze bringing them down to sittichais pace. In short sittichai has more experience against styles like Masato and Kyshenko than they have against styles like sittichai. You guys act surprised when guys like Baya look lost in there against sittichai. You're underrating how complicated it can be to fight a good thai southpaw for the first time.

The only guys from the past who could maybe beat sittichai and all the best of today are buakaw and petro but for me that's still a big IF. Who knows how they would cope against Chingiz skills or marats pressure. What about Yodwicha? Are we forgetting that he's a part time kickboxer? But as usual you guys underrate the level of some of these kickboxers today but this happens in every combat sport. Fans always rank fighters from the past over fighters from the present. Its almost like a natural instinct.

no, 70kg was better because the competition was better, thats obvious

Sitthichai never faced anyone like Masato and Kyshenko,watch their fights and you will see it

Like for example an kyshenko(out of his prime) beat Yod up

Marat grigorian is a good fighter but having the skill, power and iron chin that he haves is far from the speed,accurance,fight IQ and the experience competing against the best 70kg generation on the sport.

I like Allazov and he still evolving as a fighter,but lets not forget that an 9-10 year out of prime kido went head to head with him in some moments,of course he still young and evolving as a fighter but i cant really compare the skill that masato and kyshneko had with both of them


Yodwicha is a beast at western mt and good on kb,lets not forget the a mid lvl Baitar gave him a good challenge, too early and out of proofs to put him into the mix


Just look how skilled they are:

 

[tru3f4n]

no, 70kg was better because the competition was better, thats obvious

Sitthichai never faced anyone like Masato and Kyshenko,watch their fights and you will see it

Like for example an kyshenko(out of his prime) beat Yod up

Marat grigorian is a good fighter but having the skill, power and iron chin that he haves is far from the speed,accurance,fight IQ and the experience competing against the best 70kg generation on the sport.

I like Allazov and he still evolving as a fighter,but lets not forget that an 9-10 year out of prime kido went head to head with him in some moments,of course he still young and evolving as a fighter but i cant really compare the skill that masato and kyshneko had with both of them


Yodwicha is a beast at western mt and good on kb,lets not forget the a mid lvl Baitar gave him a good challenge, too early and out of proofs to put him into the mix


Just look how skilled they are:

"Fat Yod" and that wasn't out of his prime plus he didn't need to kill himself making 70kg in that fight.

 

[Julius_Caesar]

no, 70kg was better because the competition was better, thats obvious

I feel like im in the twilight zone. How is it obvious? Am I missing something? Kyshenko was KOd by Roosmalen, lost to Mohamed Khamal and a few other unknown names. Masato and souwer got a lot of gifts. Going through all their records I dont see anything special and dont see any consistency. Only Petro and buakaw showed me that. Not sure how its logical to assume souwer and masato would beat every kickboxer today. Whether you believe the competition was better or not saying its obvious shows you're bias.

Sitthichai never faced anyone like Masato and Kyshenko,watch their fights and you will see it

And they have never faced someone like sittichai. Sittichai however has fought fighters close to their styles whilst they have never fought someone of sittichai style.

Like for example an kyshenko(out of his prime) beat Yod up

Bad example. Yod had lost to Yasuhito Shirasu under muaythai rules 3 months before that fight. Yod was at a bad stage of his career and had a few losses. Yod didn't have much experience under those rules and was a lot smaller (naturally). Thai's sometimes go through bad stages of their career mainly due to loss of interest and drive.

Marat grigorian is a good fighter but having the skill, power and iron chin that he haves is far from the speed,accurance,fight IQ and the experience competing against the best 70kg generation on the sport.

Hope you're not confusing the most popular generation in the sport with the best generation in the sport?

 

[Julius_Caesar]

"Fat Yod" and that wasn't out of his prime plus he didn't need to kill himself making 70kg in that fight.

The fight was at 160 and I remember no one was picking Yod to win before the fight because of his previous performances. Everyone expected him to lose.

 

[Snubnoze707]

Don't really want to get wrapped up in this debate but their is no doubt that the fights in K-1 MAX were consistently competitive technical wars and every event delivered. I'm just not seeing that these days. The division was way more competitive and I won't listen to anyone arguing otherwise.

 

[tru3f4n]

The fight was at 160 and I remember no one was picking Yod to win before the fight because of his previous performances. Everyone expected him to lose.

I picked Yod I thought his fight with Shirasu was a fluke and his loss to Prakaysaeng was questionable. He got hurt in his fight with Karim Ghajji and fought injured in his next couple fights. Me being a fanboy always found it hard to pick against him even whan he was fighting above his weight.

 

[Mafanofe]

I feel like im in the twilight zone. How is it obvious? Am I missing something? Kyshenko was KOd by Roosmalen, lost to Mohamed Khamal and a few other unknown names. Masato and souwer got a lot of gifts. Going through all their records I dont see anything special and dont see any consistency. Only Petro and buakaw showed me that. Not sure how its logical to assume souwer and masato would beat every kickboxer today. Whether you believe the competition was better or not saying its obvious shows you're bias.

And they have never faced someone like sittichai. Sittichai however has fought fighters close to their styles whilst they have never fought someone of sittichai style.

Bad example. Yod had lost to Yasuhito Shirasu under muaythai rules 3 months before that fight. Yod was at a bad stage of his career and had a few losses. Yod didn't have much experience under those rules and was a lot smaller (naturally). Thai's sometimes go through bad stages of their career mainly due to loss of interest and drive.

Hope you're not confusing the most popular generation in the sport with the best generation in the sport?

Kyshenko was KO´ed by Roosmalen more than 3 years after he was out of his prime and to Mohammed Khamal

Kyshenko entered into Yod fight after he was KO´ed by RVR,so...

Khamal also lost to journeyman El Hadj and Gago Drago,im talking about quality on fighters skills and it is clear that K-1 max era had better fighters

you try to convince that this era(way more difused,with less 70kg high caliber names with consistent experience against top opponents) is better than the top of the sport...To make Sitthichai look like he is the best kickboxer that ever fought because you like him

i like all fighters listed, im not being biased because of the old generation introduced me into the sport,but because they are technically better and tougher than nowadays competition,i bet most of the people 70kg division til nowadays would see the same

70kg fighters were best in the past because of the competition,and not because nostalgy...