Punching solar plexus in clinch?

[freaky]

If they can hit you or uppercut you then you are doing it wrong. It also doesn't require as much energy as you described. Head to head on your toes resting all your weight on their shoulders. You have to make them carry your weight. The moment they make a little space you knee them. Or you make space and knee them. You should be controlling their head the whole time.

Clinch is made for knees. If they have space to hit you, then you should have kneed them a few times already. knee/elbow > any uppercut. I would trade those blows all day long. Let's see who lasts longer. My abs/solar plexus against your fists or your abs/solar plexus against my knees or your head against my elbows.

Basically, you should've kneed the guy instead of taking body shots.

 

[j123]

I agree, that's the counter, but if you have good footwork you can follow their pulls in the clinch. And like I said a bunch of times, they can block knees and land an uppercut faster than you can throw your second.

I don't advise blocking knees, one of our fighter's opponent tried that, and had a fractured forearm, then the ref called it.

Usually, after the first knee, I like turning them to pull, etc, and repeat. The idea to keep them off balance, and not to let them have a breather. Its not supposed to be relax period.

Just curious, the scenario this happened, was it with mma gloves or boxing gloves (12-16oz)? If its the earlier I guess it could be understandable, if its the latter, you need to work on the form.

 

[Fire of Youth]

If they can hit you or uppercut you then you are doing it wrong. It also doesn't require as much energy as you described. Head to head on your toes resting all your weight on their shoulders. You have to make them carry your weight. The moment they make a little space you knee them. Or you make space and knee them. You should be controlling their head the whole time.

Clinch is made for knees. If they have space to hit you, then you should have kneed them a few times already. knee/elbow > any uppercut. I would trade those blows all day long. Let's see who lasts longer. My abs/solar plexus against your fists or your abs/solar plexus against my knees or your head against my elbows.

Basically, you should've kneed the guy instead of taking body shots.

Unless they spike your knee with their elbow and counter-launch into the uppercut. There is always a counter.

 

[TheyAllFloat]

If you are clinching them and they are throwing body punches all you have to do it wrap you hands around their neck, squeeze your elbows together, step back with one foot and pull their head down. This breaks their posture and allows you to knee their face in. Obviously dont knee them in the face in sparring but if they start body punching they will have one less hand on you so this is where you break their posture and start tossing them around and they will quickly understand who's getting the upper hand.

 

[TheyAllFloat]

Found this- looks like it might help-

 

[fluffball]

If you are clinching them and they are throwing body punches all you have to do it wrap you hands around their neck, squeeze your elbows together, step back with one foot and pull their head down. This breaks their posture and allows you to knee their face in. Obviously dont knee them in the face in sparring but if they start body punching they will have one less hand on you so this is where you break their posture and start tossing them around and they will quickly understand who's getting the upper hand.

Not enough people do this nonstop. You don't just hang out in the clinch, you constantly move people off balance. That's the default "resting" position is flinging them around by the neck or potentially arms/shoulders depending on your position, so they can't get themselves settled. That's why when Anderson Silva was still using the clinch he was so effective with it, he was 100% nonstop pressuring the other guy even if he wasn't actively throwing knees. (Or at least that's the way I remember it, maybe I'm giving him too much credit.)

Edit: I would also advice OP to be careful about breaking his own posture. Stepping back like in that video works if you're disrupting the other guy, but if his back is locked and yours isn't, you're in the worse position. That's where the cock to cock mantra comes in, keeping your back locked to prevent your posture from being broken.

 

[ssullivan80]

I'm talking about the guy getting clinched throwing the uppercut, not the guy doing the clinching.

If that's the case, then you're already in a defensive position in the clinch and if you've got the space to throw an UC into the chest you'd be much better served to use that space to break your opponents clinch and transition into an improved position vs. attacking from a compromised position. It's like being stuck in the corner on the ropes, staying there slipping and blocking shots, while looking for counters. Sure, you can and sometimes it works. But nonetheless, your still the one in the defensively compromised position and far more often than not, it's not going to work in your favor. Particularly against a skilled opponent. I'd gladly take an UC in the chest to gain/keep dominant position in the clinch, and I assure you any relatively competent clinch practitioner would say the same.

Here's a fantastic example and technical breakdown from LK



Here ya go, pay attention to what happens to the guys throwing punches with a disadvantage in the clinch....... Sure, they land some shots but clearly the risk vs reward is evident!

 

[Cyclone Mike]

You have to break his posture and off balance him. If you have the "dominant" double collar tie but you haven't broken him down and left enough space, he can drop his hips and punish you to the body. You're not safe in the clinch until you've controlled his position relative to yours.

 

[Azam]

I thought I'd chime in.

Generally speaking I agree with the overall consensus - clinching/knee at that range gives a much better risk/reward ratio than someone opting to throw bodyshots.

That said though I don't think the same applies with someone that knows how to throw good bodyshots - especially someone who knows how to throw nasty short hooks to the liver/spleen and someone who understands the mechanics behind the clinch.

The reward/risk ratio evens out at about the same - when you know the mechanics of clinching & know how to throw short hooks and know where/when to throw them. Then again it depends on the format/rules of your sparring to a significant degree.

I don't think anyone should discount a short hook to the liver/spleen - it has a different kind of stopping power compared to a knee to the face - but all it takes is one well placed short hook to put you on the ground reeling in pain. I've been on the end of few myself.

I think the effectiveness of bodyshots vs clinch - swings way more to bodyshots when you forego gloves or have gloves with less oz and or get punched with knuckles or whatever format your sparring. That said though I don't know why you'd throw an uppercut to the solar plexus when a short hook is much more effective.

I think you also have to think about the rules of sparring. If you bodyshot someone in a clinch in MMA - it gives you a great position to sweep or single leg if someone tries to lift that knee up.

 

[dat1978]

I agree, that's the counter, but if you have good footwork you can follow their pulls in the clinch. And like I said a bunch of times, they can block knees and land an uppercut faster than you can throw your second.

i don't necessarily agree. also, you are telling me that they can throw a harder uppercut from that position than you can a knee? if so, then you really need to just work on your clinch more. if a guy is ducking his head down constantly, backing his hips out, etc then you should be punishing him for it. very doubtful somebody is gonna trade uppercuts for knees for very long IMO.

however, that's not to necessarily disagree with Azam above as a person that understands the clinch better than their opponent AND knows how to throw good body shots can have the clear advantage.

 

[Pope Leo VII]

In traditional MT, in the clinch an uppercut isn't as practical as an elbow IMO (upward or forward) as it's a shorter attack and makes for a quicker transition to re-engage in the clinch. In Amateur rule MT (EU, UK, US) elbow strikes to the head and reinforced knees (or knees period) to the head are typically not allowed, so a short sharp elbow in the solar plexus or top of the collarbone is a very viable option when working in the clinch. Same said for the UC in ammy rules, you can't pull the head down into your knee (reinforced knee), but you can pull it down into an UC.

While technically you are prohibited from pulling the head down... if the opponent happens to drop their head as you throw a knee.. well that's on them

Will gladly trade eating an uppercut if that means I can dish out a clean knee.

 

[Frode Falch]

I believe the expression used to describe a Thai clinch is "cock to cock". Get all up on them like you're making sweet love.

Thanks man. I have clinch sparring today..

 

[aries]

With a locked on double collar tie where you have broken their posture they can try and punch you all night long in the solar plexus and it will have no power. You aren't controlling them sufficiently in the clinch if they can still get enough power into their strikes to hurt you i.e. you are shit at clinching

 

[BigInJapan]

Is clinching a lie?

my favorite part of this thread

 

[barnowl]

Really, it sounds like serr, just missed how the clinch works. Was this MT or MMA? It sounds like serr was confusing the clinch with an overbear and got pasted for it.

 

[cakemuncher]

When you're clinching someone you're elbows should normally be close to each other as well as close to him.

In that case I would find it hard to imagine it would be easy for him to uppercut you in such a way that goes just between your tight elbows and also hits you just on the right spot of the solar plexus that hurts.

 

[Paradigm]

If you're letting them have enough space to punch you properly, you're doing it wrong. Keep close, make space when you want to attack.

And yes, you might wind up trading blows, but that's the nature of a fight. And at that range, knees and elbows trump boxing more often than not.

This...TS is probably giving up too much space as the dominant clincher.

I believe the expression used to describe a Thai clinch is "cock to cock". Get all up on them like you're making sweet love.

I've always heard "cup to cup" but "cock to cock" works as well.

Well it would be nice if you say how to do it properly. When you clinch you're supposed to keep your weight on them. They can crouch or back up still and can uppercut you.

If they can back up and uppercut, why aren't you kneeing them at that point?

I agree, that's the counter, but if you have good footwork you can follow their pulls in the clinch. And like I said a bunch of times, they can block knees and land an uppercut faster than you can throw your second.

People shouldn't be blocking knees with their forearms, if that's what you're implying. It's usually a good tell that shows someone inexperienced in the clinch. Rich had enough space to throw uppercuts to the solar plexus...consequently, he also had enough space to get kneed:

 

[UWanaPlayDaGame]

so TS got his answers. if you still think getting arm punched while on a dominant clinch position is bad then you suck at the clinch.

 

[rmongler]

Watch demetrious Johnson fights; noone uses knees better than him in mma.

Also watch Barnett vs Nelson; one of the best displays of dirty boxing ive seen to date.

Both are successful in the clinch because they get hand/arm control.

Always be first when throwing knees, that puts the other guy on the defensive.

 

[j123]

This...TS is probably giving up too much space as the dominant clincher.



I've always heard "cup to cup" but "cock to cock" works as well.

thats funny actually, we've always went with "jock to jock", same thing as "cup to cup" actually. Its a bit tricky in an mma context though, that close in space, is asking for double leg city.

If they can back up and uppercut, why aren't you kneeing them at that point?

and when they escape like that (I'm guessing ducking out), even if they eat a knee to the head, you won't be at fualt (if TS is a fighter that's below A-class)

People shouldn't be blocking knees with their forearms, if that's what you're implying. It's usually a good tell that shows someone inexperienced in the clinch. Rich had enough space to throw uppercuts to the solar plexus...consequently, he also had enough space to get kneed:

You;d be surprised, it seems there's a lack of thai-clinching being taught at MMA gyms (not knocking the style -- I train at a MMA gym myself, but its what I've noticed competing and viewing in ammy fights). I've seen countless guys out of instinct block knees with forearms. As I mentioned in this thread, one of our fighter's fractured his opponent's forearms like this.
The clinching they do is mostly wrestling styled clinch work. Honestly, even if its banned, it would be better to double leg, than to fracture your forearm, given they don't know the method of it.[/quote][/quote]