Proposed weight cut solution

I thinks that's way too vague and takes way too much effort. Just let them weigh in on the day of the fight, the closer to entering the octagon the better.

Too vague in what way? What would you recommend to make the suggestion more clear or concrete? I think day of fight weigh-in is something to try out, but wondering if we still face the dehydration issue and the McKenzie Dern issue where the complying fighter has to fight at catch-weight (or lose opportunity) and endures an unnecessary dehydration cut as a major disadvantage.
 
That makes sense. Simple enough.

So do you fine people who would/have otherwise make/made weight when they aren't in an arbitrarily acceptable range?
I'm guessing you mean, they "could have" made the weight with dehydration cut. Yes, I think the current missed weight fine needs to part of the random training camp weight regardless or become useless for compliance, IMO.
 
as for the fluctuation bit.. thats got fuck all to do with being in the right weight class

if i eat a large meal and have a couple of pints with it, im 2-3lb heavier

if i go for a big shit, im a 1lb lighter...

you dont make someone move up a weight class just because they had a meal, just as someone isnt suddenly a flyweight because they had a good old dump

The weight fluctuations during training camp are well understood and measured by fighters and staff. Conducting random training camp weigh-ins could change the evaluation that coaches\staff\fighters use to decide which weight class is best long term and then work towards a class that is more in line with their training camp range. This is the essence that we can trial-and-error our way through together to create a safer env for fighters. It truly is a life or death issue, imo.
 
yes, I'm suggesting that for the small subset of fighters, currently signed for an upcoming fight in the UFC, an independent body be positioned world-wide to conduct the random 'training-camp' weigh-in. This is not difficult, since the business model of an independent testing group already exists in most countries. We are talking about preventing actual deaths here potentially. Much more dangerous than PED use, IMO. There is no requirement that it be the same company, only that the weigh-in be conducted by a reputable independent body preferably located near major cities. These facilities already exist to some degree.

So an independant weighing body, worldwide, so you are talking:

an organisation in hundreds of countries, around the world, thousands of staff, all equipped with scales, to go around weighing ufc fighters.

you realise how utterly unrealistic that is
 
Just have them weigh-in octagon side, minutes before they start to fight.

If they make weight & fight extremely dehydrated and risk their life doing so, its their fucking bad.

If a fighter jumps from a rooftop and commits suicide its their fucking bad too, does that mean the commission or the UFC needs to take responsibility of it?
 
I'm guessing you mean, they "could have" made the weight with dehydration cut. Yes, I think the current missed weight fine needs to part of the random training camp weight regardless or become useless for compliance, IMO.
No, I was saying that somebody that otherwise makes weight as historically demonstrated.

Let's just take a welterweight and say he walks around at 190 and cuts to 170 starting eight days or so out from weigh-ins. He's never missed weight in his 15 or so fight career. He now has to be at an arbitrary weight days or weeks earlier or be penalized due to a small pretty small minority of people who don't make weight?

That just seems like a bit much to me. People are getting fined and ridiculed as is, and forced to move up when they do it frequently. I don't see more oversight being necessary here.
 
So an independant weighing body, worldwide, so you are talking:

an organisation in hundreds of countries, around the world, thousands of staff, all equipped with scales, to go around weighing ufc fighters.

you realise how utterly unrealistic that is

No, as I qualified, there is no restriction on the number of reputable organizations co-located in major cities that can perform the tests. These facilities already exist in some fashion. Its a matter of the UFC coming up with the protocol and farming out the testing in a way that is effective and efficient. The UFC as a business can find an economic way to make this happen, given the small number of fighters signed for specific fight dates at one time.
 
I think if fight day weigh ins were introduced fighters would be more careful about missing weight. If the public honestly knew what the fighters weighed before stepping in the ring, there would be more backlash and more pressure for fighters to fight in the appropriate weight class. Saying Till is just 170 in the tale of the tape in other fights covers his weight advantage.
 
Pretty fascist system devised by a 14 year old.

Because you are a 14 year old.

Mussolini-1940.02.07.jpg
 
Step 1: First weigh-in performed by independent firm must occur the day fight contract is signed (published for transparency to the media)
Step 2: Random training camp weigh-ins done during the unannounced USADA PED tests, only for fighters signed for an upcoming fight and preferably on the same day (is this feasible?)
Step 3: Fight night weigh-in as usual
Step 4: Existing class belt champions and contender status move up one (i.,e Heavyweight champ becomes Superheavyweight), since UFC may not adjust the weights themselves.
Step 5: Contract and random weigh-ins results may never be greater than new UFC defined 'pre-fight' training camp weight limits as defined below (suggestions?)
Step 6: Failed contract weigh-ins result in ineligibility for any contract of that weight class for at least two months (no other penalties)
Step 7: Failed random weigh-in (again only for fighters under signed upcoming fights) result in normal fight week weight-in penalties (loss of purse, etc)
Step 8: If one fighter is over and the other is under, a catch-weight may be offered

This new policy (1) will allow existing champions and contenders to achieve the new limits tested randomly during training camp or decide to move up to a class they can achieve, (2) prevent 'gaming' future weigh-ins and (3) allow fighters in compliance to agree to catch-weight negotiations far in advance of fight week, preventing an unnecessary weight cut.
graphed it for you

czvDkW1.jpg
 
No, as I qualified, there is no restriction on the number of reputable organizations co-located in major cities that can perform the tests. These facilities already exist in some fashion. Its a matter of the UFC coming up with the protocol and farming out the testing in a way that is effective and efficient. The UFC as a business can find an economic way to make this happen, given the small number of fighters signed for specific fight dates at one time.

what are these pre-existing organisations in every single country in the world that have scales and are able to travel the length and the breadth of the country weighing people?

how do you propose weighing someone for instance whos on Holiday in cyprus?

who are the cypriot scale carrying, weighing people?
 
graphed it for you

czvDkW1.jpg
Nah, asking for independent testing centers that already exist in every major city is low-hanging fruit, IMO. Very easy to implement. Hammering out the protocol is what smart people at the UFC are paid to do:)
 
what are these pre-existing organisations in every single country in the world that have scales and are able to travel the length and the breadth of the country weighing people?

how do you propose weighing someone for instance whos on Holiday in cyprus?

who are the cypriot scale carrying, weighing people?

If you're asking me to personally find out, I think you're missed the essence. Weigh-ins aren't rocket science. Contracting out local companies to add this service is something anyone could arrange. I think you're making the logistics into a show-stopper, which is strange, since already know that USADA has somehow figured this out? Do you feel that strongly that no amount of brain power could figure out how to do random weigh-ins in a cost-effective way? Is driving out with a scale really so difficult and costly as you imply?
 
Just have them weigh-in octagon side, minutes before they start to fight.

If they make weight & fight extremely dehydrated and risk their life doing so, its their fucking bad.

If a fighter jumps from a rooftop and commits suicide its their fucking bad too, does that mean the commission or the UFC needs to take responsibility of it?

I think the same thing could be said of PEDs, but we test randomly to reduce the sense that it can be easily used as an advantage (at their own risk). I think having someone drive out with a scale is a pretty simple business model to achieve, by comparison to what USADA does! And really, we are talking about potentially saving lives, so I think removing the pressure of the weight cut could help if it becomes the 'norm'.
 
If you're asking me to personally find out, I think you're missed the essence. Weigh-ins aren't rocket science. Contracting out local companies to add this service is something anyone could arrange. I think you're making the logistics into a show-stopper, which is strange, since already know that USADA has somehow figured this out? Do you feel that strongly that no amount of brain power could figure out how to do random weigh-ins in a cost-effective way? Is driving out with a scale really so difficult and costly as you imply?

usada have "figured it out" because there is already a pre-existing worldwide group of national anti doping agencies operating in partnership with usada under wada

but they dont all have sets of scales, nor are they likely too anytime soon



you claim there are pre-existing companies worldwide that can weigh people, so im asking for examples..

and yes, driving out with a scale can be costly..

as I say, how would you go about weighing someone who is in Cyprus?
 
usada have "figured it out" because there is already a pre-existing worldwide group of national anti doping agencies operating in partnership with usada under wada

but they dont all have sets of scales, nor are they likely too anytime soon



you claim there are pre-existing companies worldwide that can weigh people, so im asking for examples..

and yes, driving out with a scale can be costly..

as I say, how would you go about weighing someone who is in Cyprus?

that's cool, you have a right to ask for proof. I agree, let's see what the logistics really break down too. But, more importantly, let's get SOMETHING going, for training camp testing to help change the culture over time, in the same way USADA is slowly changing the PEDs game. Its not about perfect, its about what reasonable plan can we come up with. I think there is a way to have local companies do this at a low cost. Its just speculation, but I think the intention is not as fool-hardy as you are making it out. Who thought an electric-car would ever be cost-effective? Its a problem, but seems solvable.
 
that's cool, you have a right to ask for proof. I agree, let's see what the logistics really break down too. But, more importantly, let's get SOMETHING going, for training camp testing to help change the culture over time, in the same way USADA is slowly changing the PEDs game. Its not about perfect, its about what reasonable plan can we come up with. I think there is a way to have local companies do this at a low cost. Its just speculation, but I think the intention is not as fool-hardy as you are making it out. Who thought an electric-car would ever be cost-effective? Its a problem, but seems solvable.
usada have "figured it out" because there is already a pre-existing worldwide group of national anti doping agencies operating in partnership with usada under wada

but they dont all have sets of scales, nor are they likely too anytime soon



you claim there are pre-existing companies worldwide that can weigh people, so im asking for examples..

and yes, driving out with a scale can be costly..

as I say, how would you go about weighing someone who is in Cyprus?

As far as Cyprus goes, ask yourself WWUD (What would USADA do?)
 
Fight at your natural weight, how about that for a novel idea..
 
Yes, exactly. That is the intention of random training camp weigh-ins.
 
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