Powerlifting exposed

Sano said:
Exactly, he only went as far as Ascended Super Saiyan, which was the strenght of a SS2 but at a loss of speed. Doh!
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Vegeta should've really spoken to trunks during that year together.
 
belph said:
Vegeta should've really spoken to trunks during that year together.
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Yeah he should, but Vegeta has no patience for such things. Ahh... the hyperbolic time chamber...good times.
 
belph said:
You filthy fucking casual, Trunks never went SS2. That form was in between SS and SS2.
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Can't believe I had to wait through 3 episodes to find out that Trunks was a can
 
j123 said:
Can't believe I had to wait through 3 episodes to find out that Trunks was a can
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His intro was fucking godly. Taking down King cold and Frieza in seconds and then nothing but disappointment followed.
 
It just occurred to me that it was Jones's first fight cutting with no intravenous hydration afterwards. I think, without checking.
 
Greg Jackson then brought up the heavy lifting that Jones has been doing for this fight as a reason for his somewhat lackluster performance.

"Powerlifting’s a problem," Jackson said. "He gasses. I only want to do an I-told-you-so dance right now."

Jones boasted a new physique during his bout, and posted several clips of his feats in the weight room (such as deadlifting 585 lbs) during the lead up to the match. Quite a few fans expressed concern on what it could do with his cardio, and based on the candid statement above, it seems like Jackson did as well.

While some people attribute Jones' performance to just ring rust from the layoff, his rival in Daniel Cormier seems to think it had a lot to do with powerlifting as well.

"He looked a lot bigger, but he also looked a lot slower. He looked like he tired a little faster," Cormier said on the MMA Hour.
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http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2016/4/2...on-jon-jones-powerlifting-is-a-problem-i-told
 
Damn, I wonder why Edgar didn't have these problems when he was training with Martin Rooney ? Oh, I bet there are various other things at play here other than "herp derp Jones lift jones slow trainer told ya so".
 
ripskater said:
I saw some of the fight now. Jones did look a lot slower and less explosive . He used to be so dynamic with all the spin kicks. Nobody used to touch him during a fight.
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Surely, all of that can only be attributed to the lifting.
 
ripskater said:
I saw some of the fight now. Jones did look a lot slower and less explosive . He used to be so dynamic with all the spin kicks. Nobody used to touch him during a fight.
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Maybe he didn't take his usual cocaine dosage
 
Didn't expect power-lifting to really help Jones, if anything it psychologically curbed his addictive personality, preventing him from doing harm to himself or others which is a plus. If there is any carryover it will be months from now, much of which won't be carried over anyways. Oly style weightlifting has more benefits to an athlete but then you have to take in to account the learning curve to reap the rewards.

As the nervous system adjusts from the increase in absolute strength to fight training, the timing, technical precision of strikes etc will be off, and this is not including Jon's ring rust. This then takes more time for the body and mind to taper off into the fight game, there is not enough time in between training till the fighters next big fight where they are truly performing at their peak. There is a possibility to put it all together if he is fighting once a year, then again that is even pushing it still.
 
ripskater said:
I saw some of the fight now. Jones did look a lot slower and less explosive . He used to be so dynamic with all the spin kicks. Nobody used to touch him during a fight.
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He's been throwing less spinning shit for a while after the Shogun fight he got much more conservative this isn't a recent developement. He didn't look slower either he has never been a very quick fighter.

He is coming off a long layoff and got a little bit older, he fought a weird stylistic matchup kinda like the Gus fight, he had to be careful as to not jeopardize his fight with Cormier at UFC 200. All those things had certainly more to do with him looking the way he did and not powerlifting.

Sure you might say "who knows him better than his trainer" but trainers also told boxers 100 years ago to not even do pushups because it might make them "slow and bulky". No that's not an exageration.

This doesn't really look like he has become less explosive

 
PivotPunch said:
He's been throwing less spinning shit for a while after the Shogun fight he got much more conservative this isn't a recent developement. He didn't look slower either he has never been a very quick fighter.

He is coming off a long layoff and got a little bit older, he fought a weird stylistic matchup kinda like the Gus fight, he had to be careful as to not jeopardize his fight with Cormier at UFC 200. All those things had certainly more to do with him looking the way he did and not powerlifting.

Sure you might say "who knows him better than his trainer" but trainers also told boxers 100 years ago to not even do pushups because it might make them "slow and bulky". No that's not an exageration.

This doesn't really look like he has become less explosive

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I think he's slowed down very noticeably. That's a very nice jump he did there, but he's not even close to as athletic as he used to be. He no longer moves in the cage with the ease he once did. He's no longer using spin kicks and punches like he used to do with ease. He used to be so dynamic and athletic. The other fighters couldn't even land on him. Now he gets hit more often and sorta stands there and cardio seems to be gone compared to what it used to be. He just looks less athletic in the cage. I think it's obvious to my eye test. Just my opinion, but I don't think powerlifting is helping him now. So I agree with Jackson. I think it is slowing him down, taking away the natural athleticism that he once had and possibly taking away some cardio.
 
ripskater said:
I think he's slowed down very noticeably. That's a very nice jump he did there, but he's not even close to as athletic as he used to be. He no longer moves in the cage with the ease he once did. He's no longer using spin kicks and punches like he used to do with ease. He used to be so dynamic and athletic. The other fighters couldn't even land on him. Now he gets hit more often and sorta stands there and cardio seems to be gone compared to what it used to be. He just looks less athletic in the cage. I think it's obvious to my eye test. Just my opinion, but I don't think powerlifting is helping him now. So I agree with Jackson. I think it is slowing him down, taking away the natural athleticism that he once had and possibly taking away some cardio.
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He's been getting hit more for several fights. It's the difference between fighting an ancient Shogun or Rampage to fighting Gustaffson and Cormier and even OSP.
Even Machida tagged Jones. Jones has never been unhittable. he has no headmovement and his general defence for any attack is to simply extend his arms turn away and back up that doesn't work against really good strikers especially if they have a similar reach.

Watch his fight with Cormier and you will see he looked exactly the same. So did he vs Glover who and Gustaffson and the difference is just that they are very good strikers unlike a shot Shogun and that version of Rampage with not much of a gameplan.

He has never been one of the fastest LHWs nor has he had great boxing or boxing defence if he couldn't just evade attacks by backing up.

He's as athletic as he's ever been he fought the way you desrcible before winning the title even in his very first title defence vs Rampage he fought more like he did now than like he fought vs Bonnar for example.
It's more due to Greg Jackson and Winklejohn than due to powerlifting they did the same with Overeem, Holm fights that way, Condit fought that way vs Diaz and so on.

How often you throw spinning shit is much more than a matter of athleticism Condit isn't the greatest athlete in the UFc and he's the master of spinning shit and fancy attacks. Go to a semi decent TKD club and you see 14 year olds throw better and more spinning shit than Jones does nowadays but it doesn't mean that they are more athletic
 
PivotPunch said:
He's been getting hit more for several fights. It's the difference between fighting an ancient Shogun or Rampage to fighting Gustaffson and Cormier and even OSP.
Even Machida tagged Jones. Jones has never been unhittable. he has no headmovement and his general defence for any attack is to simply extend his arms turn away and back up that doesn't work against really good strikers especially if they have a similar reach.

Watch his fight with Cormier and you will see he looked exactly the same. So did he vs Glover who and Gustaffson and the difference is just that they are very good strikers unlike a shot Shogun and that version of Rampage with not much of a gameplan.

He has never been one of the fastest LHWs nor has he had great boxing or boxing defence if he couldn't just evade attacks by backing up.

He's as athletic as he's ever been he fought the way you desrcible before winning the title even in his very first title defence vs Rampage he fought more like he did now than like he fought vs Bonnar for example.
It's more due to Greg Jackson and Winklejohn than due to powerlifting they did the same with Overeem, Holm fights that way, Condit fought that way vs Diaz and so on.

How often you throw spinning shit is much more than a matter of athleticism Condit isn't the greatest athlete in the UFc and he's the master of spinning shit and fancy attacks. Go to a semi decent TKD club and you see 14 year olds throw better and more spinning shit than Jones does nowadays but it doesn't mean that they are more athletic
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You may have some good points PivotPunch. I don't follow Jones closely. I do know that he looks more lumbering and slow. Less dynamic and less athletic.

I'd be trying to get that back with more work on agility, balance, footwork, quickness etc.
 
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