Picture of Norwegian mass murderers “prison cell” in Oslo

[HereticBD]

News flash, if someone brutally rapes a woman, there is no fixing them.

I don't know if I agree with that, but my stance is that they don't deserve to be fixed.

 

[KnightTemplar]

I'll walk you through this slowly...

The Norwegian model was created to decrease the amount of people that return to jail. It's based on rehabilitation more so than just punishment.

Your initial suggestion was that prisons should be like hell on earth. From a punishment standpoint, I agree, but that does little for rehabilitation. You made my point by saying that most criminal will end up back in jail anyone. Do you know why this is? Because our system is shitty and does little to rehabilitate.

In general terms, I agree with you. In certain specific cases, and Breivik is certainly one of them, rehabilitation is not possible. This is a man who murdered over seventy people, the vast majority of whom were teenagers. There's no coming back from something like that.

Put a round in the bastard's head and harvest his organs for transplant.

 

[KILL KILL]

In general terms, I agree with you. In certain specific cases, and Breivik is certainly one of them, rehabilitation is not possible. This is a man who murdered over seventy people, the vast majority of whom were teenagers. There's no coming back from something like that.

Put a round in the bastard's head and harvest his organs for transplant.

In his specific case, I agree wholeheartedly. However, the majority of prisoners are not like this guy. They didn't murder 70 people and will eventually be back in society.

 

[bobgeese]

That doesn't stop that person from eventually getting out of jail. Would you rather they;

A. Put some effort into reforming them

B. Just say duck it and hope they don't commit another crime

I'm assuming most logical people are going to go with A.

If they’re a violent criminal, I’d put them down like the sick animals they are.

 

[KILL KILL]

If they’re a violent criminal, I’d put them down like the sick animals they are.

Cool. That's no how the justice system works though.

 

[bobgeese]

Cool. That's no how the justice system works though.

The “justice” system doesn’t work.

 

[KILL KILL]

The “justice” system doesn’t work.

Ok. That still doesn't address the fact that the vast majority of criminals are released.

I'll pose the question again. Knowing that these people will be out, and potentially living in your neighborhood, would rather they;

A: Put effort into rehabilitation so that they are less likely to commit a criminal act again

Or

B: say fuck it

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Just make Escape from New York a reality.

 

[Nooob]

I always read comments about Americans saying executions are too costly, expensive and blah blah.

How are rifle and single bullet or a rope expensive?

 

[KnightTemplar]

Cool. That's no how the justice system works though.

To be pedantic: that's not how the justice system works in America or Europe. In places like China or several other Asian countries, that's exactly how it works.

Japan used to have a particularly sadistic method of capital punishment. Once sentence was passed, the condemned person could be executed at any time of the day or night - but they were never told the date in advance. Imagine sitting in a cell, knowing that the door could open at any time and you would led out to be executed...

 

[KnightTemplar]

I always read comments about Americans saying executions are too costly, expensive and blah blah.

How are rifle and single bullet or a rope expensive?

It's not the execution, it's the legal process before it. Appeals can take years and in many cases decades. Lawyers, both for inmates and the State, don't work cheap.

 

[Andy Capp]

In general terms, I agree with you. In certain specific cases, and Breivik is certainly one of them, rehabilitation is not possible. This is a man who murdered over seventy people, the vast majority of whom were teenagers. There's no coming back from something like that.

Put a round in the bastard's head and harvest his organs for transplant.

That guy and Tim McVey are the exceptions to the “solitary is cruel” argument imo. Killing is too good for those specific people, they should rot in a hole and fed the bare minimum to ensure they survive to regret what they did for decades if possible. I think the death penalty is not only counterproductive but potentially leads to innocent people being killed but my suggestion of permanent solitary instead should be reserved for only the most heinous crimes in cases of indisputable guilt.

 

[bobgeese]

Ok. That still doesn't address the fact that the vast majority of criminals are released.

I'll pose the question again. Knowing that these people will be out, and potentially living in your neighborhood, would rather they;

A: Put effort into rehabilitation so that they are less likely to commit a criminal act again

Or

B: say fuck it

What part of, they end up right back in jail, don’t you understand?


You can’t fix these people.

 

[KILL KILL]

What part of, they end up right back in jail, don’t you understand?


You can’t fix these people.

Some do and some don't. A lot fewer return to prison in countries like Norway that focus on rehabilitation. Why do you think that is?

 

[bobgeese]

Some do and some don't. A lot fewer return to prison in countries like Norway that focus on rehabilitation. Why do you think that is?

Because there’s more ghettos within 25 miles of my house than in all of Norway.

Different people.

Different cultures. The “thug culture” has ruined an entire generation of young men. It will take their families a couple generations to recover from them throwing their lives away.


How many crackheads are in Norway?

Meth?

Heroine?

 

[Andy Capp]

Because there’s more ghettos within 25 miles of my house than in all of Norway.

Different people.

Different cultures. The “thug culture” has ruined an entire generation of young men. It will take their families a couple generations to recover from them throwing their lives away.


How many crackheads are in Norway?

Meth?

Heroine?

While you’re looking up the prevalence of crackheads in Norway, perhaps you can also check on the number of pharmaceutical reps promoting opioids there, hm?

 

[bobgeese]

While you’re looking up the prevalence of crackheads in Norway, perhaps you can also check on the number of pharmaceutical reps promoting opioids there, hm?

Did you have a point?

 

[HereticBD]

Some do and some don't. A lot fewer return to prison in countries like Norway that focus on rehabilitation. Why do you think that is?

Norway has a population of around 5 million.

Throw 300 million more people there, and I'm sure their recidivism stats would get a little fucked up.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Prisons should be free of inmate violence. If an inmate is violent they should be isolated and locked down for as long as required and if that is permanent so be it.

The guards should run the prison with strict rules enforced.

And corrupt guards that take bribes should be punished severely immediately

 

[KILL KILL]

Because there’s more ghettos within 25 miles of my house than in all of Norway.

Different people.

Different cultures. The “thug culture” has ruined an entire generation of young men. It will take their families a couple generations to recover from them throwing their lives away.


How many crackheads are in Norway?

Meth?

Heroine?

Culture can be changed. You're suggesting these people can't be rehabilitated. If you're saying their actions are caused by indoctrination into a specific culture, then it is fair to say that changing their culture could fix the issue, no? And how would we go about that? Rehabilitation.