Crime Our national tradition continues: Multiple fatalities in TX HS Shooting

[machidafan99]

Have you been watching Tariq Nasheed again?

Anyway, you reaching.

whats so fascinating about this whole situation is that because the majority of the school shooters are white the country doesnt know how to handle this. there was a thread about white prvilege and this is just another example of it. can you imagine if the majority of the mass shooters were black? hispanic? muslim? ideas of re segregating schools or disarming only people of color would be floating in the air. the racism would be off the charts. when the perpetraitor is white the response is "how can this happen?"

 

[Makani]

It’s because of the immediate politics angles that come from it which feels so fake and empty it isn’t the actual event itself.

That's largely true. My first thought is always "here we go again," and I know it won't be the last time. There's also the fact that on the "horrible things that happened today list" this probably wouldn't make the top-20, and I don't have enough feeling to feel honestly woeful about everything.

 

[PainIsLIfe]

I dunno, I did some online courses in high school and university and I didn't see anyone having issues getting their work done. Basically you have a reading each day, there's a message board for discussion and then a quiz every few days and a final exam that's supervised somewhere. Pretty simple.

I mean, the current system has the same issue except for the fact that the kids who don't want to learn also ruin it for everyone else, not just themselves.

I think disruptive kids are a huge part of the problem and a lot of kids would do better working from home.

I also don't have the same view of kids as a lot for the people who seem to hate this idea do. I think most of them would do their work. I think most kids would just get their work done so they could do other stuff.

Sure some kids would fall through the cracks but that happens now anyway. The big thing my solution helps is you no longer need to ferry the kids back and forth to school (saves gas) you don't need as much admin staff, you don't need a physical location for the school itself... Teachers would still have jobsx they would be doing their lectures on a webcam.

Well, we have on-line schools like that here in the states now - not sure if all states allow them though.

 

[HereticBD]

whats so fascinating about this whole situation is that because the majority of the school shooters are white the country doesnt know how to handle this. there was a thread about white prvilege and this is just another example of it. can you imagine if the majority of the mass shooters were black? hispanic? muslim? ideas of re segregating schools or disarming only people of color would be floating in the air. the racism would be off the charts. when the perpetraitor is white the response is "how can this happen?"

Tell me, what was the grand solution people came up with to solve gun violence in Chicago? You know, because when minorities cause violence, we nip that shit in the bud, and put them in their place.

Fuck outta here, with that race baiting nonsense.

 

[Ruprecht]

Keep thinking you know shit because some polls told it to you. For one of the smartest people here you sure are dumb to dismiss what I said with that chart. One of us lives and experiences the topic at hand and the other reads about it on the news from afar. If anyone is blinded it's you with your hubris.

Yes, I rely on data more than anecdotes from the personally invested and ideologically inclined for the big picture.
Not just that one chart either, it's just one aspect of the growing divide (both in terms of general American partisanship, and partisanship on the issue of gun control in particular).

Thanks for being our lap dog. I guess your leadership is pursuing your nation's own self-interest or you just ethically support all of that shit you rubber stamp? Everyone is motivated by self-interest so careful up on that high-horse. Difference between our countries is we have far greater options to pursue it. You're welcome for the protection, by the way.

Unfortunately the political class seems to think your treaties are worth something. Even rubber stamping your most ill thought adventures against public disapproval. As we've seen recently, American treaties are worth very little.

 

[curryjunkie]

I don't know - perhaps check out the docu Beyond the Blade. They're the ones that compiled the stats.

here, i did your work for you
deaths at US schools since 2010.............80 , injured................267
deaths at UK schools since 2010.............3 , injured................2

 

[PainIsLIfe]

nah, the onus is on you to justify that particular diversion, making a claim of knife bloodbaths at british schools withgout having the figures to back it up

Pfft. I made an off hand comment.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Yes, I rely on data more than anecdotes from the personally invested and ideologically inclined for the big picture.



Unfortunately the political class seems to think your treaties are worth something. Even rubber stamping your most ill thought adventures against public disapproval. As we've seen recently, American treaties are worth very little.

Ad hominem noted. Most humorous is it implies you're not ideologically driven. If you think that then it's you being blinded by your hubris. If you want to value public safety numbers of something as fundamental as self-defense then that's your ideology. And I'm sure as it applies in your country you're personally invested. Which is another thing that's humorous. You're basically saying that outsiders are the better authority on other people's business. Is that why your culture does what our culture says? You know we know better than you how to conduct your affairs? As for anecdotes, that's what your data is comprised of. Single instances added up. Same as mine. Beyond all that, your chart still doesn't refute what I told you. So either you're not addressing what I said in favor of repeating your own position or you've created a strawman. Hard to tell though with your poor attempt to articulate.

I'd be all for a treaty that says neither of our nations intervened on behalf of the other. Sound good?

 

[curryjunkie]

Pfft. I made an off hand comment.

i edited my post, had to see for myself, maybe next time dont make "offhand comments" if they show your argument to be dogshit

 

[Ruprecht]

Ad hominem noted. Most humorous is it implies you're not ideologically driven. If you think that then it's you being blinded by your hubris. If you want to value public safety numbers of something as fundamental as self-defense then that's your ideology. And I'm sure as it applies in your country you're personally invested. Which is another thing that's humorous. You're basically saying that outsiders are the better authority on other people's business. Is that why your culture does what our culture says? You know we know better than you how to conduct your affairs? As for anecdotes, that's what your data is comprised of. Single instances added up. Same as mine. Beyond all that, your chart still doesn't refute what I told you. So either you're not addressing what I said in favor of repeating your own position or you've created a strawman. Hard to tell though with your poor attempt to articulate.

I'd be all for a treaty that says neither of our nations intervened on behalf of the other. Sound good?

Unfortunately it's way too late. We should have at least told you to piss off when the Kiwis did. Actually the treaty was only supposed to be that we responded to incidents of attack on each other's territory (hence why the only time it's been invoked was after 911). That's not what's happened though. Personally I'd be more than happy for American troops to leave our shores.

Not outsiders (they are all Americans), data driven analysis rather than anecdotes. Doesn't surprise me you can't tell the difference or tell the difference between a (properly conducted) survey of opinions and an accumulation of anecdotes.
It's not one chart. You can check the latest from Pew or whomever you like. The percentage of Republicans that favour Gun Rights over Gun Control and vice versa with Democrats spells it out. As did the chart on ownership. As do the charts on the increasing partisan divide in your country. The house and senate voting records. Whatever actual data metric(s) for partisanship you like.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Doesn't surprise me you can't tell the difference or tell the difference between a survey of opinions and an accumulation of anecdotes.

Your mistake if you're assuming I know nothing and failing to consider that I know quite a bit. When I put together surveys in order to attain a degree in Sociology I learned there's two main differences between your beloved data and what you dismiss as a collection of anecdotes. The first is whether or not the answers are written down. The other is an allowance for nuance. I've experienced both reading polls and a lifetime of interacting with people (thereby getting a sense of their attitudes through conversation). That's what my views are based on. That's why your opinion looks ignorant. Those educated in the discipline understand the limitations of surveys as a data collection method. At least in my day they were considered to be on the ass-end of reliability.

It's not one chart. You can check the latest from Pew or whomever you like. The percentage of Republicans that favour Gun Rights over Gun Control and vice versa with Democrats spells it out. As did the chart on ownership. As do the charts on the increasing partisan divide in your country. The house and senate voting records. Whatever actual data metric you like.

Your charts may be true and still not contradict what I've said.

 

[PainIsLIfe]

i edited my post, had to see for myself, maybe next time dont make "offhand comments" if they show your argument to be dogshit

It wasn't an argument, it was a comment about violence at schools in other countries.

And it seems that the UK doesn't keep the stats on attacks:
This has raised concerns and seems to be a widespread issue about systems for recording knife crimes in schools as the overwhelming majority of the 213 local education authorities contacted either failed to respond or said they did not hold the data.

 

[PHATV]

They could amend it. It’s in the name

Good luck with the whole 2/3 of the states agreeing part.

 

[Ruprecht]

Your mistake if you're assuming I know nothing and failing to consider that I know quite a bit. When I put together surveys in order to attain a degree in Sociology I learned there's two main differences between your beloved data and what you dismiss as a collection of anecdotes. The first is whether or not the answers are written down. The other is an allowance for nuance. I've experienced both reading polls and a lifetime of interacting with people (thereby getting a sense of their attitudes through conversation). That's what my views are based on. That's why your opinion looks ignorant. Those educated in the discipline understand the limitations of surveys as a data collection method. At least in my day they were considered to be on the ass-end of reliability.

Your charts may be true and still not contradict what I've said.

Then you didn't learn much about data quality and sampling.
Sure they contradict what you said. You said guns (talking about gun control) are not a partisan issue. You'd have to be playing some strange semantic games to say that when the parties (both voters and their representatives) overwhelmingly favour opposite positions on an issue (and increasingly so as your country's politics become more divided along partisan lines), that it's not a partisan issue.

 

[curryjunkie]

It wasn't an argument, it was a comment about violence at schools in other countries.

And it seems that the UK doesn't keep the stats on attacks:
This has raised concerns and seems to be a widespread issue about systems for recording knife crimes in schools as the overwhelming majority of the 213 local education authorities contacted either failed to respond or said they did not hold the data.

ooh! a picture of big scary knives! i retract my previous statement, the official crime stats for death and injury in schools must be fake news.....

 

[PHATV]

Actually, yes we are. Although we don't realize it.

A constitutional right of birth, I'm saying. The 2nd is the right of every free man. And woman, just using the term "man" as a unisex reference in this context.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

whats so fascinating about this whole situation is that because the majority of the school shooters are white the country doesnt know how to handle this. there was a thread about white prvilege and this is just another example of it. can you imagine if the majority of the mass shooters were black? hispanic? muslim? ideas of re segregating schools or disarming only people of color would be floating in the air. the racism would be off the charts. when the perpetraitor is white the response is "how can this happen?"

Er, what? Racial minorities commit a wildly disproportionate amount of the gun violence plaguing the US.

People hate each other plenty enough due to school shootings none of us were involved in without bringing in racebaiting.

 

[elfeliz]

Tell me, what was the grand solution people came up with to solve gun violence in Chicago? You know, because when minorities cause violence, we nip that shit in the bud, and put them in their place.

Fuck outta here, with that race baiting nonsense.

the violence in chicago is different from mass shootings by defintion: "a multiple homicide incident in which four or more victims are murdered with firearms, within one event, and in one or more locations in close proximity." a lot of the shootings there are gang related. also its mostly blacks killing blacks which doesnt matter for most people unless they need that satistic to enforce their talking point that blacks are inherently violent otherwise those people could not care less. also mass shootings are happening all over the country not in just one city. its not race baiting, we have seen all those comments where people automatically assume its a muslim and immediately call for a muslim ban but once that person is revealed to be white its considered a false flag and the victims are crisis actors.

 

[FinalFight]

I dont think its a gun or shooting problem. Everyone jumps on the "gun" issue and completely fucking ignores the actual problem. Why not skip the how and go to the heart of the why? Kids get bullied. Some kids cannot handle it, so they react and shoot people. Everyone of these fuckers were bullied. To make guns the main argument is absolute ignorance. That is all.

If the reason for school shootings is the shooters were bullied, then how come the shooter never directly targets the bullies but shoots indiscriminately? Instead of targeting the bully, why try and kill as many people as possible?

How come the shooters often have a fascination with guns?

Why is it mostly white males who do these school shootings, who often then not follow a right wing/ racist/ white supremacist ideology?

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Then you didn't learn much about data quality and sampling.

You know nothing of my sampling. And it's telling that you failed to acknowledge or contradict the problem with relying merely on survey.

Sure they contradict what you said. You said guns (talking about gun control) are not a partisan issue.

They don't because your synopsis is lacking. Sorry you missed the substance of my comment. No worries. We'll just skip it. Whatever Pew tells you is all you need to know.

Have a good one.