Official Women's Division Discussion #25

[MajorTB]

Joselyne Edwards (8-1) has joined LFA's Women's Bantamweight division. I'm honestly not aware of any other 135ers that LFA has on roster. They'll obviously be putting her in some showcase fights and having her fight for a title against someone soon.

Joselyne has fought at 125 before as well, so I’m somewhat surprised she didn’t drop back down. She is only 23 though, so I wonder if she has grown and can no longer make flyweight. I’ll post her last fight, in case no one has seen it.

 

[Better Every Day]

Angela Lee vs Xiong Jing Nan

 

[det_regnar_på_vår_kärlek]

The UFC sucks so much at promoting.
Joanna vs Valentina should be a special fight. Some decent promo that is not the run of the mill clip with Rogan screaming on the background.
But then they schedule it, then cancel it, then reschedule again and there's basically no promotion. I gotta say I even felt bad with the disrespect they showed to Joanna, who has always been a company woman.
Also this fight will be on the card that Holloway and Ortega are headlining. So there's a big chance this fight is going to be the main event.

 

[leto1776]

The UFC sucks so much at promoting.
Joanna vs Valentina should be a special fight. Some decent promo that is not the run of the mill clip with Rogan screaming on the background.
But then they schedule it, then cancel it, then reschedule again and there's basically no promotion. I gotta say I even felt bad with the disrespect they showed to Joanna, who has always been a company woman.
Also this fight will be on the card that Holloway and Ortega are headlining. So there's a big chance this fight is going to be the main event.

This is a fight for the hardcore, not the casuals. Joanna is 1-2 in her last three, Valentina 1-1 in her last two. A former champion from a division below fighting a failed contender from a division above, in the division that the UFC has mismanaged. From a promotion perspective, not much is going to interest the ppv buying casuals.

Before you bring it up, nobody is going to give a shit about amateur Muay Thai matches from ten years ago. At this point, I think posters on Sherdog care more about those fights than the fighters who participated in them.

 

[Eater of Souls]

I think if the UFC put some effort into it, they could build a story line. It is not as if their usual tactic - hope the fighters shit talk like grade school kids - will work well with English being the ladies second and third language respectively. They could talk up their striking credentials and accomplishments outside of MMA, their history and use it as a demonstration of skill, etc. You know, something other than the childish crap they normally push.

So of course they will not. Then wonder why MMA is still looked down on as a marginal sport.

 

[aerius]

Let's be honest here, the UFC, especially under WME ownership is a clown fiesta when it comes to matchmaking & promotion. 145 is an abortion, 125 ain't much better, 135 is dying, and 115 is only surviving because of the insane depth & talent level in the division. You could literally draw names out of hat and do a better job than the UFC.

I'm pretty fed up with everything, once Dec. 8 is over I'm going to be watching a lot less UFC events. One FC is going to be where it's at for me, they're slowly rounding up fighters for their kickboxing & MT bouts. They've got their entire Evolve MMA trainer roster entered in the fights and Petrosyan, Holzken, and others are getting signed as well. When I can watch Sam-A, Nong-O, and all those other legends fighting with English commentary, you can bet I'm tuning in.

 

[Vulcan]

 

[Better Every Day]

 

[kuka45]

Nunes may go down as a loss for Shevchenko, but it was a respectable loss, especially given Nunes being one of the best in all division for the UFC.

Ok respectable loss, after most boring title fight in UFC (wmma), ppv failure and very rude behavior after losing - giving middle finger, weird salty postfight interview. I remember, because I was kinda cool with this fighter before, but after Nunes/Shevchenko 2 not really, sorry she lost my respect. Giving ultra boring peformance, trashtalking after fight, giving middle finger just after fight was over, not really my kind of fighter. And reality is she 3-2 in WBW division and 4-2 overall, people talking like she "deserves" belt. They doing this fight only because these two are best they got in 125 lbs division (if JJ can be considered as 125 lbser, because she has 11 fight in UFC as WSW,and zero in 125 lbs division).

It should happen 1 year ago, when JJ was without loss in mma, and Shevcheko had 2 wins streak in WBW division. It would be perfect, but right now it's just desperate move, because they failed with division and Bellator did better job, so her champ is more recognizeable than any UFC 125 lbser, attractive, well spoken etc. It's fact.

And their solution is to match two foreign girls, one with nonexistant fanbase (but more twitter followers than Khabib) and being favourite. Sorry but Shevchenko's "fanbase" absorbed all JJ's haters long time ago. What's point of this fight? Hopefully JJ will win and this division will go somewhere just like WSW was going in right direction when she was champ.

 

[Better Every Day]

(if JJ can be considered as 125 lbser, because she has 11 fight in UFC as WSW,and zero in 125 lbs division).

Joanna had zero fights at 115 lbs before going to the UFC and only dropped down because the UFC had no 125 lbs division at that time.

 

[Xuh]

This is a fight for the hardcore, not the casuals.

To the contrary, they want to make the matchup for it's appeal to casuals first and foremost. Valentina and Joanna at least have some 'casual recognition' and drawing power. They even think Valentina is a 'killer' who is going to 'murder' whoever she is booked against (Montano, Eubanks) other than Joanna.

It's a rare WMMA fight that could headline a UFC PPV (what other WMMA fight do we think would draw as well as a PPV main right now?) . That's why it was their first choice to bail out UFC 230. Valentina vs 'who the fuck is that girl', not so much, even if they have 'earned their shot' more (according to some... hardcores?). Just see what kind of reaction Valentina vs Eubanks got. They had to scrap the matchup and go back to Valentina vs Joanna (screwing Joanna over twice).

Now imagine the reaction if the battle of the hardcore 'but they deserve it the most' got the UFC230 headline slot: Chookagain vs Eubanks...

 

[kuka45]

Joanna had zero fights at 115 lbs before going to the UFC and only dropped down because the UFC had no 125 lbs division at that time.

Well it's important, because she has two times more fight as WSW than WFLW in mma. It's important factor, because you build your physique and style around weight class you will fight.
Khabib also was WW before UFC and now he is UFC champion, missed weight two times in the UFC, his fights were cancelled few times and nobody is talking like he should fight as WW.
Valentina had zero fights as 125 lbser in mma, before 2018, maybe these ancient mma fights from 2006 were as 125 lbser but after not really.

To the contrary, they want to make the matchup for it's appeal to casuals first and foremost. Valentina and Joanna at least have some 'casual recognition' and drawing power. They even think Valentina is a 'killer' who is going to 'murder' whoever she is booked against (Montano, Eubanks) other than Joanna.

It's a rare WMMA fight that could headline a UFC PPV (what other WMMA fight do we think would draw as well as a PPV main right now?) . That's why it was their first choice to bail out UFC 230. Valentina vs 'who the fuck is that girl', not so much, even if they have 'earned their shot' more (according to some... hardcores?). Just see what kind of reaction Valentina vs Eubanks got. They had to scrap the matchup and go back to Valentina vs Joanna (screwing Joanna over twice).

Now imagine the reaction if the battle of the hardcore 'but they deserve it the most' got the UFC230 headline slot: Chookagain vs Eubanks...
{Heymansnicker}

Like I said. This fight is act of desperation. You can see how people will be interested if Shevchenko's oponnent ins't JJ, lol.
So seriously what is point of this division? WSW was hot stuff 1 year after they formed it in 2014, JJ was one of best fighters in 2015, I think mma fighter of first half of 2015....
This won't end well.

 

[Xuh]

Like I said. This fight is act of desperation. You can see how people will be interested if Shevchenko's oponnent ins't JJ, lol.
So seriously what is point of this division? WSW was hot stuff 1 year after they formed it in 2014, JJ was one of best fighters in 2015, I think mma fighter of first half of 2015....
This won't end well.

It had a bad start because they chose to kick it off with a TUF full of weak fighters, and then the surprise-champ was injured for year while more credible contenders were champing at the bit.

Other then that, there are plenty good fighters in the division, & it was the one 'hardcores' thought was the best (either that or 115) pre-UFC. Once it settles down the 'point' of it should become apparent and once it has a stable champ in place with a few defenses behind them they become 'hot stuff' themselves and the divisional 'storylines' write themselves around her. Even UFC's botched attempts at scripting and matchmaking can't keep that down over a timescale of ~2 years.

Meantime we get exiting fighters we didn't have before like Lipski, KGB Lee coming in, and also-rans at 135 like Carmouche, Davis, even Shevchenko suddenly seem more exciting at 125. Is it bad for 135 - yes, but that division already was facing problems with the lack of new talent coming on. At least 125 gives a place talent come in and shine. End of next year I'll guarantee UFC 125 will be seen as the clear 2nd for WMMA along with UFC 115 and these struggles will be mostly forgotten already.

 

[Rizz]

I don't watch kickboxing so what is the story on her? Is she a special talent that girls in MMA need to keep an eye on or just another fighter crossing over?

 

[Eater of Souls]

To the contrary, they want to make the matchup for it's appeal to casuals first and foremost. Valentina and Joanna at least have some 'casual recognition' and drawing power. They even think Valentina is a 'killer' who is going to 'murder' whoever she is booked against (Montano, Eubanks) other than Joanna.

It's a rare WMMA fight that could headline a UFC PPV (what other WMMA fight do we think would draw as well as a PPV main right now?) . That's why it was their first choice to bail out UFC 230. Valentina vs 'who the fuck is that girl', not so much, even if they have 'earned their shot' more (according to some... hardcores?). Just see what kind of reaction Valentina vs Eubanks got. They had to scrap the matchup and go back to Valentina vs Joanna (screwing Joanna over twice).

Now imagine the reaction if the battle of the hardcore 'but they deserve it the most' got the UFC230 headline slot: Chookagain vs Eubanks...

It had a bad start because they chose to kick it off with a TUF full of weak fighters, and then the surprise-champ was injured for year while more credible contenders were champing at the bit.

Other then that, there are plenty good fighters in the division, & it was the one 'hardcores' thought was the best (either that or 115) pre-UFC. Once it settles down the 'point' of it should become apparent and once it has a stable champ in place with a few defenses behind them they become 'hot stuff' themselves and the divisional 'storylines' write themselves around her. Even UFC's botched attempts at scripting and matchmaking can't keep that down over a timescale of ~2 years.

Meantime we get exiting fighters we didn't have before like Lipski, KGB Lee coming in, and also-rans at 135 like Carmouche, Davis, even Shevchenko suddenly seem more exciting at 125. Is it bad for 135 - yes, but that division already was facing problems with the lack of new talent coming on. At least 125 gives a place talent come in and shine. End of next year I'll guarantee UFC 125 will be seen as the clear 2nd for WMMA along with UFC 115 and these struggles will be mostly forgotten already.

Could not agree more.

Was that sound the breaking of the seventh seal?

 

[aerius]

I don't watch kickboxing so what is the story on her? Is she a special talent that girls in MMA need to keep an eye on or just another fighter crossing over?

The latter, IMO she's maybe a level down from Denise Kielholtz or Tiffany Van Soest but she's still young so there's decent potential for improvement. Probably have similar success as Kielholtz or Lansberg, I don't think the MMA world has too much to be concerned about for a while.

 

[Mittens]

TUF full of weak fighters

And Roxy.

 

[WingsLax9042]

And Roxy.

The only reason Roxy is not multi-time defending champion is because the NSAC banned Fatalities back in 1997.

 

[Dsfdandan]

https://www.instagram.com/bhonchak/?hl=en
Barb’s instagram now says “Former UFC Flyweight”

 

[Rizz]

https://www.instagram.com/bhonchak/?hl=en
Barb’s instagram now says “Former UFC Flyweight”

It would go with her being removed from the ranking a few weeks ago. It does suck how her career turned out. She was arguably the best 125er at one point. She stopped fighting due to there being no money in it and then when money finally comes she is so out of practice/past her prime that now she is no longer anywhere near as good as she once was.