Official Judo Thread XI: Olympic Travesty Edition

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Zankou, Aug 6, 2016.

  1. RJ Green

    RJ Green Black Belt

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    that's why i'd give it the ten seconds. i think 20s(and especially 25s) is a little ridiculous for ippon when the old kodokan rules were 3s pins.

    so then under their point system:

    3-5s = 2
    5-9.9999s = 4
    10s = win
     
  2. RJ Green

    RJ Green Black Belt

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    i also agree with Russky on eliminating grip penalties. i'd eliminate crossfacing penalties too.

    every shido in judo is for stalling:
    out of bounds? stall.
    false attack? stall.
    getting handsy? stall.

    so to me, it doesn't make sense to pause the action to penalize stalling, or do all this grip fuckery. the new rules state everything's legit 'as long as you're attacking' but don't really qualify what 'attacking' is.

    i think what freestyle really gets right is penalizing belly-down turtles for noncombativity. that's exactly what they are, and the fact that it's used as a viable tactic to avoid groundwork really pisses me off.

    i'd eliminate crossfacing penalties because

    1. crossfacing is awesome
    2. if you don't wanna get crossfaced, don't be in a position to get crossfaced

    re 'neck cranks', i think you could just amend the rules to say 'no intentional twisting of the neck' and 'no unsupported neck flexion'

    if your head is twisting because you're using your chin to block a bow-and-arrow/clock choke attempt, that's your own fuckin' fault.

    if my crotch, forearm, or your shoulder is in the way of your neck bending, it's not a 'crank'. damn it.

    so like:
    can opener = not okay
    rnc face crank = not okay
    pulling the head down in a triangle = okay
    guillotine from guard = okay
    peruvian necktie = okay (pretty sure it is anyway)
    gerbi choke = okay (no idea why it's even illegal)

    the problem is a lot of the old guard just don't have the newaza chops the new generation has, and want to draw a stark line between BJJ and Judo.

    to me, that's arbitrary and artificial, based on competitive rulesets. i don't want there to be a difference. they're like mac and cheese...hall and oates...peanut butter and jelly....bert and ernie...they belong together
     
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  3. RJ Green

    RJ Green Black Belt

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    and i'll say this until i'm blue in the face: maaaaaybe nobody watches judo because it's really boring watching people in pajamas playing pattycake while someone who looks like a constipated mortician stops the damn match every 15 seconds to yell at them in japanese....
     
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  4. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    Huh? That is more like the current bjj ruleset than the current judo ruleset. Of course bjj doesn't have an ippon for big throws but I don't see how ippon is preferable to allowing leg locks etc?
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2018
  5. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    Just compete in BJJ occasionally, problem solved. People tend not to turtle in BJJ. There is no ippon but you can still throw, get a dominant position and then apply a submission. If the opponent decides to pull guard they just gave you the position you wanted!

    Only reasons I can think of for a judo competitor that likes ne waza not to also try BJJ is dojo politics or lack of bjj tournaments and money to pay for them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2018
  6. TheFakeMacoy

    TheFakeMacoy Green Belt

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    Ippon is literally what you're supposed to strive for in competition. Others may disagree with me, but I would say ippon is very necessary. If you remove ippon, the entire game changes.
     
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  7. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    I don't see the benefit of ippon, other than it means judo matches can be very quick.

    If you are a big fan of winning by ippon though BJJ is clearly an inferior rule set. But so far most of the discussion is what is wrong with judo rules not why they are preferable to BJJ, which is kind of weird in a thread about Judo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2018
  8. Russky

    Russky Green Belt

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    Bjj ruleset is awful. Whoever drops on his butt first wins.
     
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  9. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    I wouldn't say that, passing guard is 3 points whereas a sweep is two. Takedowns are 2 points as well and not everyone pulls guard. Most of my opponents try for take downs.

    Plus there are several different rules sets out there.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2018
  10. Bluesbreaker

    Bluesbreaker Brown Belt

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    Ippon is like pinning someone. You just made them your bitch.
     
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  11. TheFakeMacoy

    TheFakeMacoy Green Belt

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    If you don't see the benefit of encouraging big throws, then I'm honestly wondering why you train judo. If you remove ippon, there is no incentive to go for anything large.
     
  12. Franklegit

    Franklegit Orange Belt

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    I always thought of Ippon as the "one thrust, one kill" mentality of the ancient samurai. This also fuels my frustration with rolling uke on the mat gently "Ippons".
     
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  13. efficientjudo

    efficientjudo White Belt

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    I've always thought of it as to encourage the behaviour of practising / striving towards clean technique.
     
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  14. RJ Green

    RJ Green Black Belt

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    So I've got a contusion on the outside edge of my left foot. I've been keeping it in the air during ukemi and nagekomi but it's not healing very quickly. Does anybody have a good method for padding? Should I just tape a piece of styrofoam or neoprene over it?
     
  15. efficientjudo

    efficientjudo White Belt

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    I find that bruises on the feet always take a long time to heal - not helped by ashi-waza. I would tape it / wrap it, not so much because it will help it, more for it being a clear sign to training partners that its injured. I find Ibuprofen gels can speed up recovery with these types of things.
     
  16. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    To be honest most of the coaches I trained with judo under focused either on ne waza or ashi waza rather than big throws like uchi mata or Ura nage. So my experience of judo is probably very different than yours.

    Its actually kind of hard for me to imagine any but the most competitive judo club really focusing on the big throws like that.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2018
  17. RJ Green

    RJ Green Black Belt

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    buddy, not to be a dick, but you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. you haven't been doing Judo long enough to make generalizations about anything, other than "I generally don't know shit about Judo"
     
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  18. Kenny from MD

    Kenny from MD Less angry than before.

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    Super bummed I didn't do the tournament last weekend. Both of my coaches did and did excellent. My main coach won Masters, and placed 3rd in two different Senior weight divisions and went up against some World and Olympic medalist studs.

    My other coach is a much smaller guy that I don't work with as much but was a NCAA D1 tournament qualifier and so on. He ran through his division with the quickness, and looked phenomenal. I don't know how to post the videos because they are on Facebook.
     
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  19. QingTian

    QingTian Purple Belt

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    A good throw is exponentially more powerful than a poor one. Not one or two times. More like ten times and above.

    If you do not train for ippon, then there is no point in doing Judo. It would be a silly game to base a grappling art on just takedowns without ippon. It would have far more meaning to go for pin or sub then.
     
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  20. Thycidides

    Thycidides Banned Banned

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    Huh? I was mostly talking about my direct personal experience. The only generalization I might make is USA judo is less competitive and less professional than in other countries which you seem to agree with.

    You never did answer my question on why don't you compete in BJJ if you like guillotines and ne waza so much. It seems like a reasonable on to ask.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2018

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