Since I can't quote mself bcos of the lock....
@QingTian:
That's just what I was taught to call it. Back of tori's knee pushes
side of uke's knee.
Plus, aside from just being lucky enough to be in the proper
position already, to get in position to throw it, you need to do a
tai otoshi-style entry then cut across uke's body towards the far
side. There are enough small differences (in entry, kuzushi, and
reap) that I feel that there should be a distinction.
I never claimed that it should be officially recognized by the
Kodokan, just that what I was taught is not o soto as it's
commonly pictured.
Plus, aside from just being lucky enough to be in the proper
position already, to get in position to throw it.
It's my tokui waza.It is not good to to reap at the knee. That is an injury waiting to happen. Also in general you should aim for backwards unless right vs. left or Kimura style (who may have developed this way to compensate for a lapel grip instead of sleeve).
I think from this quote my previous post was missing the point and leading you to double down on attacking from the side.
What I mean is, you should investigate how to get someone in proper position. That will pay off far more dividends in your Judo.
You don't need to be lucky. You create your openings.
Similarly, textbook backwards osoto is available to you if you learn how to create it. Once you have the proper kuzushi and tsukuri, you can take your sweet time to finish the throw because uke will not escape. So focus on that instead of throw variations.
It's my tokui waza.
Aside from the odd seoi nage or ashi waza, yo soto is the throw I end up hitting 90% of the time. Not once have I hurt someone's knee.
this is where the traditionalist and i disagree. i believe wholeheartedly that learning a throw in only one context limits your game. this osoto debate is a perfect example - yeah, you should be able to do the classic, orthodox osotogari.
should that be the only way you do ostogari? no.
is that the only way to osotogari? no.
is one way more correct than the other? yeah, the way that works best in that circumstance.
Not to be an ass, but your two statements do not prove anything. You are basically saying, "it hasn't happened to me yet, and I've been doing Judo for ___ long" and "___" is not a very long time.
It's fundamental anatomy that the knee does not bend to the side. At some point you will damage someone's ligaments. If not an outright tear, then a slow weakening over time.
The only reason you haven't hurt someone now is...
Not about tradition. It's about diagnosing the root cause of the problem rather than looking for short cuts. Furthermore I gave examples of when you should attack from the side.
Anti-traditionalists need to get over themselves and see that there is a reason things are done the way they are.
Subbing. Can't remember if I mentioned this on the past thread, but I've been preparing for a BJJ tourney on the 10th, and I'm going to do my damn best to get a highlight reel Judo throw. I'm also going to try footsweeps. I think a well-timed De Ashi Barai might be the dark horse that nobody expects in a BJJ tourney.
Anti-traditionalists need to get over themselves and see that there is a reason things are done the way they are.
Isn't everything in this post the antithesis of the very ideals Jigoro Kano believed in?
btw, has Riner ever jacked up someone's knee in competition before? He's a big fan of that o soto variation as well.
Isn't everything in this post the antithesis of the very ideals Jigoro Kano believed in?
The entire reason there's literally dozens of different types of throws is because Kano was a strong believer in experimentation and doing what worked. He couldn't beat Fukushima Kanekichi with what he knew, so he went out, learned a new move, and beat him with it. We now call that kata guruma.
I practice the classic o soto, but I can't get it to work for me in randori/shiai, so I learned a variation (taught to me by my head coach, btw) that does work for me. If it's good enough for Kano and my coach... what's the problem?