Official AMD "Ryzen" CPU Discussion

[jefferz]

A chiller is an external water cooling system, right? Don't think I've ever seen one before.

Yeah, it replaces the radiators in a custom loop. It's basically a mini fridge without the storage space.
It's the same thing as an aquarium chiller.

 

[jefferz]

On August 21rst, Intel is going to debut Coffee Lake.
https://newsroom.intel.com/press-kits/8th-gen-intel-core/

 

[GhostZ06]

On August 21rst, Intel is going to debut Coffee Lake.
https://newsroom.intel.com/press-kits/8th-gen-intel-core/

so when the release? ill probably get the 8700k

 

[jefferz]

so when the release? ill probably get the 8700k

*shrugs*
Depending on the core count and clock speeds I might as well. I'm really considering jumping to HEDT's though.

 

[Madmick]

<<Ars Technica>> AMD Threadripper 1950X review: Better than Intel in almost every way
Cheaper, faster, and more feature-rich than Skylake-X—what's not to love?

If Ryzen was a polite, if firm way of telling the world that AMD is back in the processor game, then Threadripper is a foul-mouthed, middle-finger-waving, kick-in-the-crotch "screw you" aimed squarely at the usurious heart of Intel. It's an olive branch to a part of the PC market stung by years of inflated prices, sluggish performance gains, and the feeling that, if you're not interested in low-power laptops, Intel isn't interested in you.

Where Intel charges $1,000/£1,000 for 10 cores and 20 threads in the form of the Core i9-7900X, AMD offers 16C/32T with Threadripper 1950X. Where Intel limits chipset features and PCIe lanes the further down the product stack you go—the latter being ever more important as storage moves away from the SATA interface—AMD offers quad-channel memory, eight DIMM slots, and 64 PCIe lanes even on the cheapest CPU for the platform.

Threadripper embraces the enthusiasts, the system builders, and the content creators that shout loud and complain often, but evangelise products like no other. It's the new home for extravagant multi-GPU setups, and RAID arrays built on thousands of dollars worth of M.2 SSDs. It's where performance records can be broken, and where content creators can shave precious minutes from laborious production tasks, while still having more than enough remaining horsepower to get their game on.

Sure, dive deep into the technicalities and Intel's Skylake-X is still the absolute fastest when it comes to pure instructions-per-clock performance and high-frame-rate gaming. But the sheer daring of AMD Threadripper and accompanying X399 platform is nothing short of astonishing. Its performance, particularly in content creation tasks and production workloads, wipes the floor with the Intel equivalent. Taken as a whole, there really is no competition—Threadripper is the High End Desktop (HEDT) platform to beat....

Move over Intel, there's a new sheriff in town
So compelling is the overall Threadripper package that these small differences in gaming performance matter little. If you're an enthusiast who just wants the very best components, without feeling like you're being taken for a ride, Threadripper provides all the PCIe lanes, I/O, and benchmark-crushing performance you could ever want, at a price under half what the competition is charging. Indeed, for the same price as a single Core i9-7980XE, you can buy a 1950X Threadripper CPU, a monster motherboard, graphics card, RAM, and NVMe storage.

If you work in an industry where time is money, Threadripper is not only a great value (relatively speaking), but offers rendering performance that can beat the absolute best workstations from Intel. It even supports ECC memory, which Intel reserves for its pricey Xeon chips. If you're a sole content creator or a small business looking at moving from mainstream platforms to workstations, the time savings over the likes of Ryzen 7 1800X or the Core i7-7700K are significant, even with the cheaper 1920X.

With Ryzen, AMD made the eight core CPU mainstream. It made an increasingly complacent Intel, which had long neglected and exploited its most vocal fans, pay attention to the desktop market again. With Threadripper, AMD hasn't just added more cores compared to Intel, it has changed the entire direction of the HEDT market for the better. It has made breathtaking levels of performance more accessible than ever and won the hearts and minds of the PC market's most vocal of communities.

For the last decade, the last word in desktop performance has belonged to Intel. Now it belongs to AMD.

The good

• Better performance than the equivalent Intel chip for the price
• Fully featured platform across all chips
• While liquid cooling is a must, Theadripper is easier to tame than Skylake-X
• Huge improvements in production tasks over mainstream CPUs
• Competitively priced

The bad

• Overclocking remains limited
• Needs a suitably robust cooling setup and power supply
• Lags behind Intel in overall IPC performance

The ugly

• That you're seriously considering spending $1,000/£1,000 on a CPU

AMD means business with these X399 motherboards:

Holy motherboard, Batman!
The same isn't quite true of the X399 platform, which features motherboards that are just as expensive as the Intel X299 equivalent. That said, you do get a lot for your money. With Ryzen AMD showed it could cajole partners into making motherboards as good as those they make for Intel—with Threadripper it has convinced them to make them even better. The flagship is without doubt the £520/$550 Asus ROG Zenith Extreme, an EATX motherboard (over an inch wider than ATX) that's as fiercely over-the-top as the Threadripper CPU itself.



It features four full-length PCIe 3.0 X16 slots connected directly to the CPU (with an additional PCIe 2.0 X4 slot and PCIe 2.0 slot wired to the chipset); three M.2 SSD slots, two of which are mounted via a unique DIMM-style board, along with a U.2 port, all of which are connected directly to the CPU; six SATA 6Gbps ports connected to the chipset, 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac+ and WiGig 802.11ad WiFi, excellent eight-channel audio courtesy of a ESS9018Q2C DAC (complete with LED-lit jacks); and eight USB 3.1 Gen 1 ports connected to the CPU, along with an ASMedia USB 3.1 Gen 2 controller and a swathe of other USB IO.

AT was also limited to 3.9GHz on their overclock of the TR-1950X, the same as Tom's Hardware, and they saw ferocious draws of power (total system draw here, I'm pretty sure):

Overclocked, the CPU temperature rises to 78 degrees Celsius, and power draw to 552W, the highest on test. Considering the 1950X is a 16C/32T chip, that's not bad going. Intel's i9-7900X, when overclocked to 4.6GHz, pulls 507W from the wall for its 10C/20T.

Spoiler: FireStrike

 

[jefferz]

> AMD Threadripper 1950X review: Better than Intel in almost every way
Cheaper, faster, and more feature-rich than Skylake-X—what's not to love?
View attachment 261839

AMD means business with these X399 motherboards:

AT was also limited to 3.9GHz on their overclock of the TR-1950X, the same as Tom's Hardware, and they saw ferocious draws of power (total system draw here, I'm pretty sure):

Spoiler: FireStrike

View attachment 261847

View attachment 261845

View attachment 261843

Jesus. Imagine pairing that up with the rumored dual Vega card coming out. It might max out a 1200w power supply.

 

[GhostZ06]

Jesus. Imagine pairing that up with the rumored dual Vega card coming out. It might max out a 1200w power supply.

fucking hell

 

[xcvbn]

Jesus. Imagine pairing that up with the rumored dual Vega card coming out. It might max out a 1200w power supply.

That's toaster oven territory.

 

[jefferz]

That's toaster oven territory.

I love how intel has been about power efficiency and temps the past 5 years. Then AMD comes in all Hank Scorpio lighting the place on fire.
I really hope this doesn't turn into piledriver, excavator, etc.

 

[Madmick]

Steve wanted to test Threadripper's actual real-world case usage versus the synthetic benchmarks where it shines. GN uses a custom Powershell compression script utilizing some major programs (including Handbrake) to compress, annotate, and store its uploaded video content for its channel to the online server it rents. This compression takes his stored video content from ~1.5 Petabyes to ~340 terabytes, and greatly reduces their costs. The typical compression of a 4K video:

• 11min = i7-4960X
• 7min = Intel Xeon E5 12-core (he doesn't specify which)
  
• 3min19s = Threadripper 1950X

The Xeon recovers about 50GB (via compression) every 3 hours, so the Threadripper will recover more than twice that data in the same amount of time. This frees up his production system for other post-production tasks in the editing phase.

I love how intel has been about power efficiency and temps the past 5 years. Then AMD comes in all Hank Scorpio lighting the place on fire.
I really hope this doesn't turn into piledriver, excavator, etc.

It's why processors like the Sandy Bridge i5's are still relevant. They stuck to four cores while pursuing the mobile market future.

 

[Madmick]

Intel announces its next-generation Ice Lake chips unexpectedly early

Intel may be preparing to announce its upcoming eighth-generation processors on August 21st, but the company is already looking to the future with an uncharacteristically early announcement of what seems to be its ninth-generation Ice Lake chips, as reported by AnandTech.

I say “seems to be,” because things are a little confusing this time around. Currently, Intel's processors are the Kaby Lake models, which use Intel's second-generation 14nm lithography process. (The company calls it 14nm+.) The upcoming Coffee Lake architecture, which is assumed to be the eighth generation of Intel Core chips, is expected to use the third generation of the 14nm process, or 14nm++. And while Cannon Lake hasn't formally been announced yet, it's said to use Intel's first-generation process on the 10nm scale.

Ice Lake throws a bit of a monkey wrench into things
But the recently announced Ice Lake throws a bit of a monkey wrench into things, given that Intel has announced it as the "successor to the 8th generation Intel Core processor family." That would seem to imply it’s some sort of ninth-generation architecture to follow the eighth-generation models. Intel also says that it will use the 10nm+ process, the second generation of the tech at that scale. That could be confusing since it seems like there should be a first-generation 10nm process line as a generation in between.

According to AnandTech, that split is due to the way Cannon Lake's 10nm chips are being grouped together as the Coffee Lake 14nm++ line for laptops at some point in that product generation; desktops will go straight from Kaby Lake’s 14nm+ to Coffee Lake’s 14nm++ to Ice Lake's 10nm+ technology. While we don't entirely know why Intel would split up the laptop and desktop lines, AnandTech has some speculation related to the more technical aspects of the chip design process, which I’d recommend for a read.

That said, given that Intel hasn’t even announced the eighth-generation line of processors yet, it’s probably still a little early to be looking so far ahead to Ice Lake (which probably won’t ship on actual devices until sometime in 2019, at the absolute earliest). But because Intel is usually quiet about its plans for future generations of products, this early glimpse is still an interesting look at what to expect from the processor powerhouse going forward.

Jesus, Intel is in panic mode. I haven't seen their stock crashing, and it's not like AMD is getting glowing press in the financial sector, despite the overwhelmingly positive talk about their market viability with the new releases in the tech blogosphere, but they keep trying to cut the bleeding with preemptive press announcements that are atypical for them.

 

[GhostZ06]

Intel announces its next-generation Ice Lake chips unexpectedly early

Jesus, Intel is in panic mode. I haven't seen their stock crashing, and it's not like AMD is getting glowing press in the financial sector, despite the overwhelmingly positive talk about their market viability with the new releases in the tech blogosphere, but they keep trying to cut the bleeding with preemptive press announcements that are atypical for them.

AMD better keep bringing it

 

[jefferz]

Intel announces its next-generation Ice Lake chips unexpectedly early

Jesus, Intel is in panic mode. I haven't seen their stock crashing, and it's not like AMD is getting glowing press in the financial sector, despite the overwhelmingly positive talk about their market viability with the new releases in the tech blogosphere, but they keep trying to cut the bleeding with preemptive press announcements that are atypical for them.

intel announced a die shrink that follows the release dates they've been using forever. Quick, stop the presses. No one ever seen that coming.
Anybody who even remotely follows computer tech already knew this was coming.
But Intel is in panic mode. Yeah, sure.

 

[xcvbn]

intel announced a die shrink that follows the release dates they've been using forever. Quick, stop the presses. No one ever seen that coming.
Anybody who even remotely follows computer tech already knew this was coming.
But Intel is in panic mode. Yeah, sure.

If you don't believe the x-series CPUs were rushed, I don't believe you even remotely follow computer tech. The performance/watt and heat issues, along with cheap construction, aren't indicative of an Intel on top of their game. They're not as pathetic as Vega but they're not in a position of strength either. Intel will be just fine but they made the mistake of letting their guard down by thinking they're Nvidia going against Radeon Technologies.

 

[Madmick]

If you don't believe the x-series CPUs were rushed, I don't believe you even remotely follow computer tech. The performance/watt and heat issues, along with cheap construction, aren't indicative of an Intel on top of their game. They're not as pathetic as Vega but they're not in a position of strength either. Intel will be just fine but they made the mistake of letting their guard down by thinking they're Nvidia going against Radeon Technologies.

Not to mention he just shit on The Verge.

It's never been hard to see that @jefferz is firmly entrenched in the Intel camp, but there's a very strong argument for Intel, obviously, and most gamers have been in that camp for the past five years, especially those that don't color their opinion too strongly with political philosophy over things like the "open-source" debate. So I've never batted an eye at that.

Nevertheless, I can't recall seeing him post anything this blatantly fanboyish, before. Intel has been eating shit throughout 2017. They're dying out there.

Center yourself, Jeff. Remember, it's just metal.

 

[Slobodan]

Wendell from Level1Techs posted this:



EDIT: it's not embedding properly, half of if is cut out.

 

[xcvbn]

Not to mention he just shit on The Verge.

It's never been hard to see that @jefferz is firmly entrenched in the Intel camp, but there's a very strong argument for Intel, obviously, and most gamers have been in that camp for the past five years, especially those that don't color their opinion too strongly with political philosophy over things like the "open-source" debate. So I've never batted an eye at that.

Nevertheless, I can't recall seeing him post anything this blatantly fanboyish, before. Intel has been eating shit throughout 2017. They're dying out there.

Center yourself, Jeff. Remember, it's just metal.

I've only ever owned Intel CPUs as they have for the last decade been the only sensible gaming option above $250(maybe even $180+) but it's painfully obvious they're scrambling. This is a good thing. Nothing breeds innovation like a top-flight company in desperation. My guess is that things will be rough for a generation but that Intel will bounce back stronger than ever.

One thing that I'll never understand about consumer products in general is blind brand loyalty. Sure, I have a personal bias towards companies like Asus, EVGA, Gigabyte, hell even Nike and The North Face, but it's foolish to not do your due diligence and shop around.

Right now, AMD is killing the CPU market and they earned all this praise while Intel was caught with their knickers down.

 

[kenetics]

AMD better keep bringing it

I hope so. I have $500 shares at $12.50

 

[jefferz]

If you don't believe the x-series CPUs were rushed, I don't believe you even remotely follow computer tech. The performance/watt and heat issues, along with cheap construction, aren't indicative of an Intel on top of their game. They're not as pathetic as Vega but they're not in a position of strength either. Intel will be just fine but they made the mistake of letting their guard down by thinking they're Nvidia going against Radeon Technologies.

I don't think skylake x was rushed, it was just a bad product from the start. This is their first flop in how long?
They've had no competition from AMD for awhile now and had no reason to push the envelope.

@Madmick
Core clock is very, very high on my list when looking for a new CPU. That's why I choose intel. If AMD offered a chip that hit 5.2 on 4 cores, I'd sell my current setup in a heartbeat.
I'm not a fan boy of either brand. I used AMD stuff since from 462 until 939 and switched to intel because of the performance. Same with video cards, after the 5670 I switched to AMD cards until the 10 series because they were better at the time I was purchasing.
i haven't been a fan of the way AMD has been releasing their products lately either. I can't say they've been dishonest, but I think you know what I mean.
I am watching for a cheap b350 board and the R3-1200 to go on sale for $90 to play around with this winter. I'm also going to pick up a i5-3470 Dell optiplex as well to compare with the g4560. I plan on doing a 3 way shootout with a 1050ti.

 

[Madmick]

I don't think skylake x was rushed, it was just a bad product from the start. This is their first flop in how long?
They've had no competition from AMD for awhile now and had no reason to push the envelope.

Skylake-S and Skylake-X have been both massive disappointments. Broadwell was desktop vaporware, and it's not like Ivy Bridge (before Haswell) was a world-ender, either, with the modest improvement over Sandy Bridge, and the onset of heat issues with overclocks due to the obsession with shrinking the die without sacrificing clock. AMD just wasn't firing back with anything beyond glorified pre-overclocked refreshes, and so Intel was slowly expanding their already substantial lead, unchallenged, during those generations.

@Madmick
Core clock is very, very high on my list when looking for a new CPU. That's why I choose intel. If AMD offered a chip that hit 5.2 on 4 cores, I'd sell my current setup in a heartbeat.
I'm not a fan boy of either brand. I used AMD stuff since from 462 until 939 and switched to intel because of the performance. Same with video cards, after the 5670 I switched to AMD cards until the 10 series because they were better at the time I was purchasing.
i haven't been a fan of the way AMD has been releasing their products lately either. I can't say they've been dishonest, but I think you know what I mean.

Yes, I'm well aware, I know of your @5.2GHz clock ambitions, and it's not like it's difficult to divine that this is the #1 reason almost all Intel gaming fans gravitate towards Intel.

AMD has definitely been playing some stupid games with the releases, but they're an underdog, so I tend to forgive them a bit more. They're still having trouble making a profit despite all the sales.