(NYT)Many Ways to Be a Girl, but One Way to Be a Boy: The New Gender Rules

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by Kafir-kun, Sep 15, 2018.

  1. Kafir-kun

    Kafir-kun not-so-grand mufti of Sherdog Yellow Card

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    In a new poll, girls say they feel empowered, except when it comes to being judged on how they look. Boys still feel they have to be strong, athletic and stoic.
    What do you guys think? Is this shift in gender norms a promising or discouraging sign for this generation of young people? Is the resiliency of traditional norms for boys to be stoic and strong and the importance of girls' looks good or bad? Do you think the long term effect of #metoo will be positive or negative for this generation?

    EDIT: Forgot to include this interesting bit from the article
    I think this part in particular is a very bad sign. The US already has declining birth rates and I think its important for children to grow up with the idea that marriage and parenthood are important milestones even if the exact manifestation of those milestones doesn't necessarily conform to traditional expectations.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2018
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  2. vengeful

    vengeful Green Belt

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    The NYT article is wrong because they're saying boys have to be strong, stoic, and athletic and claiming they're many different things girls can be. What they're forgetting is that apparently boys can be girls now
     
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  3. spin_

    spin_ Silver Belt

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    Red the whole article and found nothing to back up that point.

    It put it out there and just left it.

    It just included what you posted, is that boys think they're supposed to value strength etc.
     
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  4. Kafir-kun

    Kafir-kun not-so-grand mufti of Sherdog Yellow Card

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    *Read

    The article just summarizes what the survey says and then juxtaposes that info alongside some interviews the author did with some middle school students. Really most of the substance is in the OP with some elaboration in the rest of the article.
     
  5. VivaRevolution

    VivaRevolution Whoopin' Belt Double Yellow Card Yellow Card

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    Negative, very negative.

    One of the problems 3rd wave feminism created was tearing down the female gender role. Identity is important to mental health. These women are missing a large part of identity.

    I'm not saying women need to go back to the kitchen, so they can have an identity, but I am saying that it was highly destructive to remove the identity, and not replace it with anything.

    Ask 100 women what it means to be a women, and you will get 100 different answers.

    Ask 100 men what it means to be a man, and you will get very similiar answers.

    This means men have a society re-enforced indentity.

    Not many people that can really know who they are, without others confirming it.
     
  6. spamking

    spamking Mmm Pizza Rolls

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    Isn't it other girls who most often judge these girls who feel bad about how they're viewed or something?

    Boys should be strong (stand up for what they believe in), athletic is a plus (boys should be encouraged to play, but not forced) . . . it's okay for boys to show emotions. Just not too much where it causes others around them to "freak" out about things.

    Promising that it's possibly helping others to speak out about things, but discouraging because IMO it can often cause confusion and overreaction.

    People who can't deal with traditional norms for either boys or girls are bad for society . . .

    Negatives will likely outweigh any positives . . . people will overreact today for common occurrences of years ago (when nobody was harmed).

    I'm not saying there are incidents that happen today where someone was hurt that should be ignored or that something would change had it happened 20 years ago.
     
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  7. Fedorable

    Fedorable 1/1024th Mod

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  8. HereticBD

    HereticBD Steel Belt

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    Boys will be boys, and girls still apparently care deeply about how they look, despite their newfound empowerment.

    Is that the point?
     
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  9. Kafir-kun

    Kafir-kun not-so-grand mufti of Sherdog Yellow Card

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    According to the girls interviewed by the author, not among the pool of children who responded to the survey to be clear, its boys and society in general
    What do you mean by this?
    But children are uniquely vulnerable to sexual assault and often they feel too intimidated by the older status of their abuser to speak out, isn't changing that a huge benefit?
    Its not so much that boys will be boys but that the boys feel that they have to be "boys" in the traditional sense whether they like it or not. As for the girls, its not that they personally care about their looks but they feel that those around them place the highest value on that.
     
  10. luckyshot

    luckyshot iP of the ENTIRE WR

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    “Mmm.. sure, that and a pair of testicles.”

     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2018
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  11. spin_

    spin_ Silver Belt

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    I do think males get pressured into this narrow view of what a man should be


    But on the woman's side, women support other woman's decision to step out of outside of that narrow View. On the men's side men don't necessarily support the idea of being "unmanly". So there's no support for change
     
  12. HereticBD

    HereticBD Steel Belt

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    So it appears the brainwashing is not working, and human nature is dunking on the hashtags.
     
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  13. Kafir-kun

    Kafir-kun not-so-grand mufti of Sherdog Yellow Card

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    [​IMG]
     
  14. spamking

    spamking Mmm Pizza Rolls

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    I mean that people who stand in the way of someone or a family following the traditional roles are bad and do nothing but cause more issues.

    I'm not thinking about it from that angle . . .

    I guess it could depend on where a kid is raised . . . . anyone different from the rest is ostracized and talked about negatively.

    That's when parents need to go all in on teaching self-confidence and be encouraging.
     
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  15. spin_

    spin_ Silver Belt

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    * eatadick


    I made a second post a comment on the idea, because it's a solid one, but I also wanted to comment on the fact that that article starts out by posing this problem, but really never provides any evidence of it as a problem. It was just "here is what the survey found"
     
  16. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre Steel Belt

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    Good luck to parents.
     
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  17. Kafir-kun

    Kafir-kun not-so-grand mufti of Sherdog Yellow Card

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    *any dick or should I eat yours?

    The author just assumes its a problem, probably because she's a feminist and from her perspective that its a problem is just a given.
    Gotcha, I'd agree.
    I know, just saying that considering that potential benefit I think there's an argument that more good can come from it than bad.
    Right but it seems that the girls feel more comfortable stepping outside their traditional norms and roles than the boys. Why aren't the girls enforcing the old norm like the buys are? Probably because society has focused more on girls breaking the mold than boys.

    On the bright side, boys into tomboys or nerdy girls will seem to have more options now...
     
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  18. Seaside

    Seaside Caudillo

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    There is no way liberal men feel that way in the west. Only those right winger Trump types feel that way because they are less open minded and tolerant.

    Cuckoldry, open marriage, polyamours relationships, trans and feminism and being toletant accepting and feminine are all qualities embraced by the modern left let alone the far lext across the anglo sphere and northern and western europe. Fuck sakes look at Canadas Prime minister!! He never stops talking about openess tolerance love and not being toxic masculinity. Tolerance in political sense and sexual is a common view of liberal males who are secure enough to get in touch with feminine side.

    Dont beliebe me chec any left wing news outlet lile huffpost. The comments by the men often prove my point. Liberal men are not giving into these outdated masculine notions.
     
  19. spin_

    spin_ Silver Belt

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    *probably one that is also into spelling policing.


    it is an issue, but the article doesn't even mention it till the end, and doesn't actually into it other than mention it. i weep for journalism.
     
  20. IDL

    IDL Gold Belt

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    They eye of Sauron has been trying to turn women into men and men into women. Invert the masculine and the feminine.

    There is still work to be done.
     
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