New Jersey School Suspends Students For Going to Range with Parents.

[ultramanhyata]

A lot of the arguments against police brutality include the fact that the victims in many cases were originally being stopped for non violent offenses.

How does that change the difference between injury and/or death on the one hand and suspension from school on the other??

 

[Scrody]

How does that change the difference between injury and/or death on the one hand and suspension from school on the other??

Because it's an unjustified punishment, you're for one but not the other, then you post things like this:

"Welcome to the adult world of rules and regulations that sometimes put a cramp in your style."

Do laws fall under that? Or just school policies?

 

[Lord Coke]

What's the relevant precedent concerning the Constitutional rights of minors? Don't courts allow for the picking and choosing?

Minors have less in some contexts i.e. the Second Amendment gives them less rights because they are not old enough to serve in the militia. But the first amendment issue just has to deal with the fact they are students rather than their age.

 

[ShinkanPo]

I'm one of those horrible gun control people, and I think this is a horrible idea. What the fuck.

What are horrible gun control people? You rape people who own guns?

 

[Karasu-Hanta]

Once the school is sued for infringing constitutional rights things should go back to normal.

 

[Karasu-Hanta]

It wouldn't but I understand the point. The thing is that hunting isn't something that the local school district needs to plan around, it's not a constitutionally protected right that all school age children be allowed to hunt during these seasons.

Are you sure because I think it is.

 

[Gregolian]

How can the school control what people do when off school property?

 

[Karasu-Hanta]

They are not banning hunting. That's equivalent to saying that because they ban drunk driving, they're banning drinking and they're banning driving. No, they're banning a very specific combination of events. Kids can still get hunting licenses, they can still own firearms, they can still go hunt. They just can't be in possession of the weapon during the academic year.

Show me where it says the right to bear arms is suspended during the academic year ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

 

[the muntjac]

I remember having high school teachers that would have Guns & Ammo and other gun related magazines lying in their classrooms for students to read.

I’ve never owned a gun myself besides BB guns and paintball guns, but it blows my mind that a school can suspend a kid for something they were doing on their own time with a parent. That’s beyond messed up.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Minors have less in some contexts i.e. the Second Amendment gives them less rights because they are not old enough to serve in the militia. But the first amendment issue just has to deal with the fact they are students rather than their age.

Great. The fact that both the First and Second are being punished by government here should make this a no-brainer to anyone with integrity. Unless they're commie scum. Then all bets are off.

 

[floivanus]

I’ve never owned a gun myself besides BB guns and paintball guns, but it blows my mind that a school can suspend a kid for something they were doing on their own time with a parent. That’s beyond messed up.

Buy one; I only ever had a pump shotgun my dad gave me until last year I last shot my pump shotgun something like 16 years ago, but a few years ago decided to get a few evil “assault” guns to see what the fuss is about. And let me tell you, you find and meet some great people when you go to the range.

Glad I took the hobby back up again.

 

[bufetadanacara]

edit first new story on it https://www.ammoland.com/2018/03/nj...uspended-students-range-photos/#axzz59svF0BrD

remember who brought you the story first

before the news is news alanb



This is a developing story. Two students in Lacey Township High School (New Jersey) were given 5 days in-school suspension because they posted pictures of themselves on Facebook with, guns. Lacey Township High School placed the pair on 5 days of detention for posting pictures of themselves taken at a range onto social media that contained firearms with the caption of "fun day at the range"! Note they were with at least one of the student's parents and the other teen had permission from his parents to be there.

This is copy of the school policy. This is 100% real friends. I am currently investigating this matter on behalf of the War Room and have confirmed this to be true. My sources say they are aware of at least 5 students who have been suspended for this policy. It is unclear when the policy was put in place but since the Florida shooting the school district has started actively monitoring students social media looking for any evidence of weapons.

The school shouldn't have any say over a child's social media.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I hope the parents sue that school district district into financial insolvency.

I hope for the opposite, that the parents have the maturity to realize fucking over a school isn't the most moral thing they can do and simply ask the school to apologize and admit their mistake and wipe their kids; records clean.

Really don't know why someone would think shutting down a public school would be a good thing but to each his own I guess...

 

[Shoemaker]

Are you sure because I think it is.

Where is it in the constitution? The right to hunt isn't in the second.


Some states have a right to hunt, but not all of them.

 

[Lord Coke]

[

I hope for the opposite, that the parents have the maturity to realize fucking over a school isn't the most moral thing they can do and simply ask the school to apologize and admit their mistake and wipe their kids; records clean.

Really don't know why someone would think shutting down a public school would be a good thing but to each his own I guess...

Some of us don't get to be the hero in this life. For the good people in San Francisco, Hawaii and New Jersey to know they are good Kafir. there have to be bad men like me. We're the evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the Common Law itself to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go. That's the nature of this world. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

 

[IDL]

Yeah... Just searching around, it's just starting to get a little traction. A major news outlet hasn't put it out yet, but I'm guessing they're trying to do some research on it before reporting. There's hints that people are digging for more info in the comments, asking for key players to call them.

One radio station there did mention the story, but was stonewalled by the School when they called them. The School tried telling them that the initial reports on Facebook were inaccurate. However, there's a facebook post by the one of the students (who has a great Italian name) detailing what happened. However his account is private... probably for the best, since he was likely outed by some shithead busybody anyway. God, people are assholes.

Their crime: "climate change"

 

[IDL]

Did you read the Safe School Initiative? I linked it shortly after that post.
Ok, I'm going to disagree with you based on reading the linked case, NJ 6A:16-7.1, .5; 18A:37-2. First and foremost, your cited case supports the ability of the school to discipline for conduct away from school grounds.

The regulation in the cited case was dismissed as being overly broad because it penalized all activity that would be a criminal or juvenile delinquency offense. Nor was it limited to drug and alcohol offenses. To emphasize the overly broad nature of the regulation, the court noted that even littering would trigger the penalty. It was not dismissed based on a lack of authority over away from school conduct.

I do not think the regulation here is over broad. It is specific to weapons and a period of time. NJ has a broad definition of "weapons" and that appears to be the definition that the district is applying.

If the authority to discipline for actions away from school grounds stands then there has to be a nexus between the activity and the operation of the school. IMO, the reference to the Safe School Initiative (SSI) and the recent history regarding school shootings provides a defensible nexus for the school. One of the key findings from the SSI is the following:



Based on those findings, the school has a reasonable argument that the safety and well-being of other students is at issue when students are found to be familiarizing themselves with weapons away from school grounds. That this regulation exists to "prevent the occurrence of problem behaviors" which is something their code of conduct is allowed to address.

And then I'd point to this regarding 2 different NJ students who were threatening shootings in their school district. All adding credence to the school district's argument that protection of other students is a good enough reason for this regulation.

Curious about how these things go. I can see a legitimate use for rules like this (say some students were promoting gang activity or something), but then there are exceptions that fall outside of the 'spirit of the law'.

I think some kids going to the range for some supervised target practice would fall outside of the spirit of such a rule.

From a legal perspective, is it strictly what you can 'pin' on someone using technicalities, or does this sort of common sense factor in?

I understand that the intentions or laws/rules or whatever can be a grey area, but it seems there is also something of value to the concept.

edit: yes I used the word 'rule' and 'law' interchangeably when they can mean different things in this context, but hopefully my question still makes sense in general.

 

[Lord Coke]

Yeah... Just searching around, it's just starting to get a little traction. A major news outlet hasn't put it out yet, but I'm guessing they're trying to do some research on it before reporting. There's hints that people are digging for more info in the comments, asking for key players to call them.

One radio station there did mention the story, but was stonewalled by the School when they called them. The School tried telling them that the initial reports on Facebook were inaccurate. However, there's a facebook post by the one of the students (who has a great Italian name) detailing what happened. However his account is private... probably for the best, since he was likely outed by some shithead busybody anyway. God, people are assholes.

I know for a fact the school is lying. This is not the first time either.

 

[Lord Coke]

@panamaican policy has been amended to

Also the school says this is wrong. Well I spoke to a parent at the school who is friends with the suspended students and the school is lying

https://www.app.com/story/news/education/2018/03/19/gun-rights-lacey-high-school/438930002/


LACEY - The same week that students across New Jersey walked out of their classrooms for stronger gun control measures, Lacey residents expressed fury over allegations that local students were suspended for sharing photos of a firearms training.

The Association of New Jersey Rifle & Pistol Clubs said in a letter to Lacey Township School District's superintendent that school officials took "unlawfully imposed disciplinary action against several students" and violated their First and Second Amendment rights.

The association said the students had shared pictures on social media of "lawful participation in firearms practice and training."

Superintendent Craig Wigley called the claims "incorrect."

"It is important to note ... that we have not had to invoke Policy 5611 for the unlawful use of a firearm by a Lacey student," he said in an email to parents. "The recent rumors and social media posts are not related to Policy 5611 as no student has been disciplined for violating Policy 5611."

Policy 5611 forbids students from carrying weapons or simulated weapons.

Crime: Ex-student from Rumson charged with having bomb materials 'for large scale destruction'

The association objected to wording in the district's policy that prohibited students from having weapons for any reason on or off school grounds. Penalties included an evaluation by the Child Study Team and a recommendation that a student be suspended from school for at least one year, according to the association.

"Both the actions taken against the students, and the Firearms Policy, are in blatant violation of the First and Second Amendments to the United States Constitution and the free speech protections of the New Jersey Constitution," the association's attorney Daniel L. Schmutter wrote in the letter to Wigley.

National School Walkout: Students call for gun control, mourn Parkland shooting victims

Schmutter threatened legal action against the district if officials did not immediately rescind the disciplinary action taken against the students and erase records that suggested they committed misconduct. He also demanded the school district issue a written apology to the students and their families and amend the district's Firearms Policy.


The Asbury Park Press was not able to reach the affected students or families in order to independently verify the association's claims that they were disciplined under this policy.

Wigley said no rights were violated and no students were disciplined or suspended under the policy, but added that its language was clarified in the student handbook.

As of Monday, the student handbook Policy 5611 read that students are forbidden from bringing any type of weapon or simulated weapon to school or on any school bus without written authorization from the district's top official.

The association celebrated the district's move as a victory.

"A policy that allows for discipline of students for exercising a fundamental right off of school grounds is clearly unconstitutional and violates the Second Amendment," the association Sunday wrote in a news release. "A policy that allows disciplinary action for posting a picture of the exercise of that fundamental right off of school grounds also violates the First Amendment.

The association said the students were working with school officials to clear their permanent records of the incident.

Overtly broad policies of the school district have been criticized in the past. Ed Cardinal, whose son attends a school in the same district, said the officials once demanded his son to remove a window sticker of a gun from his pickup truck that he drives to school.

"He was kind of heated about it and so was I," Cardinal said.

They abided by the demands and removed sticker after the district threatened to punish the teen.

 

[Hogey]

I had a Guns and ammo magazine when I was in 7th grade. I had to explain why, had it, had it confiscated and had to have my parents come, they just got pissed at the school.

This was in 2003.