NBA Yoff Thread V3: Life Off

[iwhoopedbatman]

you know I love me some defense haha

also it's looking like Bron is making the Finals yet again. There is no Iguo/Kawhi to even kinda slow him down out east, and that slow ass predictable fallaway is absolutely lethal right now

That fall away's consistency has really made up for his difficulties from 3 and FT this 'yoffs. I wasn't sure he'd be able to adjust when he started losing his speed (because he hadn't improved much of his footwork in years), but I think he's still going to be effective for a few more years. Seems to be still learning. He's still overdue for a serious regression in his abilities. I really believe this is his last run at this level.

 

[hearthstone25]

no, Lebron is nowhere near 'technically skilled' as Kobe Bryant is, and that's not even remotely close

but that doesn't mean he isn't still considered 'better' by many pundits/analysts/posters here. To put it succinctly, Kobe's bball IQ wasn't quite as high as Lebron's most notable through his higher number of 3pt FGAs despite being a very streaky 3pt shooter

It's the main problem comparing a strength versus a finesse based player, production may somewhat match up but it's gone about totally differently

It's like comparing Shaq to Dirk or Duncan

Great post.

Agree with it all.

 

[hearthstone25]

I actually count defensive minutes though and effort
so IMO Jordan put forth more energy and effort in those minutes b/c still played HIGH level defense after baseball

Lebron hasn't since that one series against Derrick Rose's bulls years back

Lebron’s defense on Shaqin a foo yesterday was fun to watch..

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

I don’t think Kobe would have shortened his career at all by playing heavy minutes at 18, is what I’m saying. Logging those minutes at 18 isn’t like logging them at 30 and over.

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

I never said Lebron is more skilled than Kobe. He's not. Kobe definitely wins that comparison. I said Lebron has always been more productive. He has. It's not close. He averages more points, more efficiently and dominates all other categories.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

That fall away's consistency has really made up for his difficulties from 3 and FT this 'yoffs. I wasn't sure he'd be able to adjust when he started losing his speed (because he hadn't improved much of his footwork in years), but I think he's still going to be effective for a few more years. Seems to be still learning. He's still overdue for a serious regression in his abilities. I really believe this is his last run at this level.

I agree, although maybe next year depending on where he goes

Also, if he adjusts his game slightly (so like the exact opposite of Carmelo) or does more of a Wade role as he gets actually older, he could probably play 5 like really solid years still

 

[HunterSdVa29]

in Kobe's defense, he came out of HS and had an AS level Shooting Guard playing in front of him at first...

People forget how good Eddie Jones actually was, on both LAL and MIA

and LeBron played heavy minutes right away, but missed the yoffs in both of his first two seasons (which for some reason, never gets brought up, but Jordan's early losses IN THE YOFFS always do!)

 

[hearthstone25]

I never said Lebron is more skilled than Kobe. He's not. Kobe definitely wins that comparison. I said Lebron has always been more productive. He has. It's not close. He averages more points, more efficiently and dominates all other categories.

Defense?..

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

I agree, although maybe next year depending on where he goes

Also, if he adjusts his game slightly (so like the exact opposite of Carmelo) or does more of a Wade role as he gets actually older, he could probably play 5 like really solid years still

Yeah that's what I'm saying. If he's willing to no longer be "LEBRON" he could go be a co-1 somewhere and do some damage. He should. No one holds it against Kareem that half his titles he was a #2.

 

[hearthstone25]

I don’t think Kobe would have shortened his career at all by playing heavy minutes at 18, is what I’m saying. Logging those minutes at 18 isn’t like logging them at 30 and over.

Exactly.

 

[therealdope]

Also, if he adjusts his game slightly (so like the exact opposite of Carmelo)

Lost. Hard.

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

Defense?..

Kobe stopped playing defense halfway through his career too. At his peak, yes he was a better on ball. Lebron was an excellent defender too when he devoted effort to it.

Please don't bring up all of Kobe's gifted All-D awards late in his career when he literally didn't try until late in playoff games, just like Bern does.

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

I don’t think Kobe would have shortened his career at all by playing heavy minutes at 18, is what I’m saying. Logging those minutes at 18 isn’t like logging them at 30 and over.

Hypotheticals aren't a counter argument to us saying that no one has maintained production of this level this many minutes into their career. Because they haven't.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

Kobe's last 3ish all D team nods were clearly on name recognition

even his most stalwart fans agree on that one

but he earned them first like 4 or 5 legitimately

 

[echohead]

Yeah that's what I'm saying. If he's willing to no longer be "LEBRON" he could go be a co-1 somewhere and do some damage. He should. No one holds it against Kareem that half his titles he was a #2.

He always wants to run the offense I wish he would just go ahead and move to PG for the rest of his career and not have to take a beating inside.
He is already the best passer in the league.

 

[BKMMAFAN]

LeBron already is number 1 all time in playoff minutes played. That's pretty astonishing. If he stays relatively healthy and plays 5 more years, he'll be so far ahead of Duncan it's unlikely anyone will ever get close.

He's played over 3 regular seasons worth of playoff minutes. His consistency and durability is probably his most underappreciated asset.

 

[iwhoopedbatman]

Kobe's last 3ish all D team nods were clearly on name recognition

even his most stalwart fans agree on that one

but he earned them first like 4 or 5 legitimately

He was a phenomenal on ball defender the first half of his career. And could still be a pesky bastard later on when he wanted to be. He just reserved it too much for me to pretend he was actually productive defensively as he got older.

 

[wlu.29]

Damn Bronsexuals have bad memories

says a kobetard

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

Hypotheticals aren't a counter argument to us saying that no one has maintained production of this level this many minutes into their career. Because they haven't.

No one’s had the opportunity to either. No one else ever got that many minutes at 18. My point was every comparison is a hypothetical.

And I wasn’t trying to counter the initial point, I said what LeBron has done is amazing.

What’s not hypothetical is that minutes when you’re 18 are not the same as minutes when you’re 30 and over. Or even 26 and over.

 

[Luminaire]

in Kobe's defense, he came out of HS and had an AS level Shooting Guard playing in front of him at first...

People forget how good Eddie Jones actually was, on both LAL and MIA

and LeBron played heavy minutes right away, but missed the yoffs in both of his first two seasons (which for some reason, never gets brought up, but Jordan's early losses IN THE YOFFS always do!)

Gunt knock it off.

Jordan’s Bulls won 38 games his rookie season, they only made Yoffs because the East had 11 teams, 8 of which make “Yoffs” of which they were easily dispatched.

Case in point, the following season in which Jordan missed due to an ankle injury, they still made “Yoffs” and then were swept in the first round even tho Jordan had returned by that time.

And then the same exact thing happened in Jordan’s 3rd season. Another below .500 campaign in which they were swept in the 1st rd.

It wasn’t until his 4th nba season that Chicago was actually a decent team... they finally won 50 games and advanced in Playoffs.

Lebron only had his rookie year below .500, that’s it. His 2nd year they were 42-40 and narrowly missed playoffs. His 3rd year they won 50 games (quicker than mike accomplished that and without the college years)

In Lebrons 4th season (as a fucking 22 year old) he made the finals with the likes of Daniel Gibson and Larry fuckin Hughes.

So just stop, what Lebron has accomplished is outrageous.