Muay Thai scoring outside of Thailand

Discussion in 'Muay Thai and Kickboxing' started by Dudko, Nov 9, 2017.

  1. Dudko

    Dudko White Belt

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    How is muay thai scoring system in Europe? Are all punches scored equal or like in Thailand? How about USA and Canada?
     
  2. Cocakillbana

    Cocakillbana Black Belt

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    It's kickboxing
     
  3. AbeRudder

    AbeRudder Green Belt

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    Depends. Some orgs try to score it thai style, others use the 'everything scores equally' philosophy. The only consistency is that the hometown fighter will more often than not be at an advantage scoring wise.
     
  4. jtwarwagon4life

    jtwarwagon4life Green Belt

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    No consistent standard outside of Thailand.
     
  5. Cocakillbana

    Cocakillbana Black Belt

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    I don't think people really look at how badly shitted on Muay Thai is by the rest of the world. In what other sport does the world choose a different direction for the sport than the country that invented it, and the country that makes up 99% of the best competitors? And not only that, but they take umbrage with it: "He didn't get the win in Thailand because they score differently over there... our kind can only win by KO... grrr." We've all seen that quote a million times but apparently we're immune to just how absurd it is. It's like if dissatisfied baseball players made up their own form of baseball and then cried about the rules after losing in an actual baseball game.
     
  6. Kanka

    Kanka Brown Belt

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    Scoring in thailand also took a different direction than when it was invented. Also within thailand the scoring is different in different venues.

    The problem outside of thailand is incompetent judges and home town favoring.
     
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  7. Cocakillbana

    Cocakillbana Black Belt

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    Different venues may favor certain techniques, but that's not scoring. What's scored 50-47 at Lumpini doesn't turn into 50-45 at Rajadamnern. How a Muay Thai fight is usually won is pretty well established.
     
  8. theranch

    theranch Yellow Belt

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    Discrepancies between different Orgs aside, many UK promotions seem (emphasis on seem) to score it closer to Thai than mainland Europe. Body kicks scoring well, punches less so etc.
     
  9. ARIZE

    ARIZE Blue Belt

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    France had a good, close to real MT mentality, but it's been years since i fought there, and don't really follow the scene anymore, so i don't know if that changed.
    For Balkans, it's a lot harder to find real MT gyms, so MT events are rare... Most of the times it's some kind of tournament a gym will try to organize, so the rules are often kinda of random.
    Most of the fighters go to K1 style and KB shows. Bigger events, more often, and some money may be involved...
    Or they go a week to Thailand, take a trainers certificate, and work in a MMA gym... That's the shit right now...
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2017
  10. Yodsanan

    Yodsanan K'FESTA.1

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    In what sport the scoring shifted over the years thanks to gambling? Should non-thai countries also follow this trend?

    Channel 7 seems to score different, so does max muay thai.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2017
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  11. Tayski

    Tayski Stand-up Fighting

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    In what other sport does gambling dictate when athletes should be either pushing themselves or coasting during their performance?

    Also, MMA now has different rules. The Unified Rules of MMA are different to what the Pride rules were for instance.

    + the recent change of rules and scoring criteria by the ABC is only in place in certain US states, and only in place in certain countries of the world: https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2017/1/...g-criteria-explained-hinds-bell-mma-interview

    Beat me to it.
     
  12. Tayski

    Tayski Stand-up Fighting

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    yeah the judges give the decision to whoever fighter they've got bribed for to give the decision the most ;)
     
  13. Cocakillbana

    Cocakillbana Black Belt

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    There's more to this than the judging, as is clearly stated by the TS when they ask about techniques.

    The fact is the rest of the world largely disregards the importance of technical know-how, body control, and discipline. Turning your back, flailing around, struggling to to get out of bad positions, poor reactions to attacks etc... are not frowned upon and factored into the result like in Thailand. Elsewhere, a fighter can be pushed back with five straight push kicks, get turned, take three knees in a double collar but return with a few sporadic and ineffectual punches, and the latter will be viewed as the superior attack. That's an example of going in the other direction.

    Losing a decision that wasn't controversial, but getting it reversed by a kickboxing federation. That's an example of going in the other direction.

    What does MMA have to do with any of my post?

    Does one country contain almost the entirety of the talent? Was MMA cultivated over centuries and made a sport because of one group of people? I don't see a countries name in "mixed martial arts," "no holds barred," "cage fighting," or whatever the hell you want to call it. Maybe I missed the meeting where they decided to call MMA, "Japanese Fighting," "Brazilian Fighting," or "American Fighting," you know, because everything contained within the sport was developed from the people of one country.
     
  14. Yodsanan

    Yodsanan K'FESTA.1

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    that's so hyperbolic, that doesn't lead the discussion anywhere. that's like me saying you can punch someones head off in Thailand, get kneed to the side two times, thrown to the ground once and still lose the fight.
     
  15. Tayski

    Tayski Stand-up Fighting

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    How the fight is judged is entirely defining what techniques score or don't score, aside of the rules and what's allowed or not. So when TS asks about how techniques score depending on the country, it's completely related to how the fights are scored by the judges which is also based a lot around the gambling.

    Even Samart himself talks about how the sport of Muay Thai and its scoring has changed a lot in Thailand in the last few decades because of the gambling.

    You asked about "In what other sport does the world choose a different direction for the sport than the country that invented it, and the country that makes up 99% of the best competitors?"

    MMA was an example.

    It's irrelevant if the country that invented the sport originally still makes up for a high percentage of the best competitors - by the way that 99% figure that you threw in there has completely been pulled out of your ass and is based on no real calculation.

    If you want another example than MMA, how about Football? Both American Football and Australian Football were created based on the real sport of Football originally invented in England centuries ago and which has probably been the most popular team sport worldwide for a very long time already and still is today.

    There are other examples out there where a popular sport was invented in a country ages ago and then was copied by another country which modified the rules and scoring.
     
  16. Mickf

    Mickf White Belt

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    Gambling has also had a good influence in the stadiums because there is no appetite for mismatches. As opposed to boxing for instance where it is all about building a star by putting him in against overmatched opponents and making them seem invincible.
    You can even see it in internationally in muay thai /kickboxing to a certain extent.
     
  17. esum80

    esum80 ศิษย์มนต์ชัย

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    here are the rules for scoring here in canada:

    muay thai canada/ontario rulebook:
    https://muaythaiontario.org/forms-documents/competition-rules/
    section 13 lists out the scoring system; section 14 lists out the types of fouls

    cask - council of amateur sport kickboxing rulebook:
    http://www.kickboxingcanada.org/pdfs/all_discipline_rules_09
    pages 12-13
     
  18. ZemoKicks

    ZemoKicks Pretending to be humble Double Yellow Card

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    I wish posters from Thailand would have a Thai flag attached to their avatar so I don't read these bitter posts.

    You invented it so you get to decide what everyone in THEIR country is doing ?

    Also be happy we give you money you even let us win so we come back and give you some more money.


    Also Thais get prefered scoring in Thailand everyone globaly does in their country besides in the UFC americans don't get a advantage.

    Stop being bitter.
     
  19. ZemoKicks

    ZemoKicks Pretending to be humble Double Yellow Card

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    Also did you forget Farangs beat some of the best Thais in kickboxing matches.

    Now you gon say we are scared of elbows and clinching ok are you then scared of ground and pound and submissions ?


    I love Thailand Buakaw is one of my favorites all time
     
  20. Snubnoze707

    Snubnoze707 High Level

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    Thanks, that really helps with your credibility.

    And don't get it twisted, @Cocakillbana isn't from Thailand he's some white boy from the midwest...
     

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