Mousasi on why financial incentives in Pride favored exciting fights

[rurouni]

another 'has been' wishing he could fight more japanese

 

[Toco]

they also talked about the win bonus. it makes sense th at the win bonus make it so fighters fight not to lose. because if you have guaranteed purse, it doesn't matter if you win or lose, you will get the same money. but since in the UFC you have this huge bonus if you win, so you fight more safe just to win, instead of not being worried about winning or losing but being worried about putting an exciting performance

 

[Edwin]

another 'has been' wishing he could fight more japanese

Sure, because that’s what he was talking about...

 

[Edwin]

He’s right however...

The Japanese favor fighting spirit over records and this is something that has been known for years. That’s why fighters were more motivated to put on exciting fights instead of going out of their way to just win.

Opposite the UFC you have to keep a steady win streak while being someone entertaining to keep your job.

 

[dc007]

Problem is you have Moose saying if you lose you're out at the same time as saying title shots are not awarded based on merit but stardom. You can't really have it both ways since wins and losses means true sport and star power gaining you advantage means entertainment. The UFC always stuck to the wins and losses model until Chuck lost to Jardine and they desperately wanted the Wand fight so they booked it anyway.

 

[SmilinDesperado]

He's right.
I never understood the logic behind cutting or giving less money to a fighter that loses. Who cares about the record? The only thing i care about is seeing an exciting fight. If you put on a great fight, a loss shouldn't be held against you in regards to contract negotiations

 

[beastman]

War Mousasi!!!

pride did pay their fighters well, but they also didn't know who they'd fight until the last second sometimes. it was run in the shade and eventually got exposed and went away. i do miss the show that pride put on. it was entertainment at its best.

Guys would fly out to Japan and find out who they are fighting when they land. Not like someone is going to fly back without fighting.

 

[Shaddows]

That's not the argument. Pride was also about the money. But the money went to exciting fighters rather than people trying to win at all costs, even if it means turning every fight into a snoozer.

I disagree.
"the money" in Pride were not much at all.
I heard about plenty of fighters that made almost no money in pride... and they were not the bottom feeders either.

Only mega stars like Fedor, Wandi, Nogs, Crop Cop & Cia made a lot.

 

[CereserBr]

hes right

 

[Ken Fresno]

[ X ] Finish Bonuses

[ X ] Performance Bonuses

[___] Win Bonuses

 

[awymore]

You can't blame Mousasi for being a bit "sour" towards UFC.He fought out his 8 fight contract with UFC (which he went 7-1) and finished last fight with someone who was #4 and not the greatest style of match ups for him. He goes out in 2nd round and mollywhops Weidman for the tko.

Most fighters in his position re-up their contracted deals before the last fight on deal (he was 6-1 before weidman).

What does UFC do at the very start of the 90 day negotiation period? They tell him " he's not a big enough name" yet he had main event or co-main evented every fight in UFC outside of one [UFC 200].

And the thing that is blowing my mind is about the whole situation is that it's not like the UFC is overstocked with bigger names right now. Look at the shitty PPV buys on their last two events, and tell me all the names that were bigger than Mousasi on there? WTF is the UFC thinking?

 

[Fullmount Triangle]

I don't fault "the UFC".
The sport evolved.

I hate that now it is a lot about money, but it is what it is.

Well, obviously the UFC does not help much, they are greedy as f*** and they are the ones allowed that fighters like Conor turn this about a money thing.
But times changes, and before it was about honor and the love for the sport.
But it makes sense that now (that MMA is more popular), fighters get paid better.

But UFC and some fighters just made it all about the money, and the sport is hurting because of it.

You say the sport evolved and then say that it's more about money, but that's not what the post was about. It was about the company above the fights emphasizing different things as well as the cultures in both countries regarding fighting. UFC puts emphasis on winning, you get a win bonus, you have the opportunity to get paid more if you win, which puts incentive on fighting as safe as possible. Some people adhere to this, some don't, but that's what the emphasis is on in the UFC. PRIDE emphasized going out there and trying your best to put on good fights, and if you did, you would be brought back and given a place on their cards. It's why a guy like Daijiro Matsui kept getting fights, he went out there and he tried to win and it was entertaining even if he wasn't very good.

you can argue it's more about "sport", but then the UFC doesn't act like a sport, it acts like entertainment, but then the sport aspect contradicts it. It's a circle.

 

[tenniswhiz]

I don't fault "the UFC".
The sport evolved.

I hate that now it is a lot about money, but it is what it is.

Well, obviously the UFC does not help much, they are greedy as f*** and they are the ones allowed that fighters like Conor turn this about a money thing.
But times changes, and before it was about honor and the love for the sport.
But it makes sense that now (that MMA is more popular), fighters get paid better.

But UFC and some fighters just made it all about the money, and the sport is hurting because of it.

It's the strategy that revolves around the Unified Rules and winning 10-9 rounds that REALLY evolved.

THAT is the problem.
Many fans don't care for that and neither does UFC management.

The UFC needs to approach the commission again and rewrite the rules.
No reason surprise TD's, cage hugging, and in"significant strikes" need to be reevaluated. Basically everything Dom Cruz does to win rounds needs to be reevaluated.

 

[skylolow]

On the surface I can see what he is saying but I don't think its the truth when you fully think about it.

The UFC has hierarchy for each weight division and match ups are usually made based on it. Maybe not always correct in fans eyes but usually it flows. Pride was the wild wild west when it came to ranking. True they didn't put much on winning or losing with your future fights but you can't be dropping fights and expecting a title fight unless you were Japanese. If you did get to the top you really weren't rewarded either for it. In the UFC you are rewarded greatly compared to the most of the rest of the division when you become champ in most cases.

Fighters want to make more money when winning but if there losing they don't want to lose money either. Hard to have it both ways. So you get a Bellator contract that guarntee you "x" amount win or lose. Which is good but you never get to really cash in on by being at the top of the mountain. So I guess if your financially set Bellator is relaxing. But if many aren't and I'm sure they feel pressure just like many of the fighters in the UFC.

P.S.: Let's not forget when talking Pride pay we are talking maybe a few 100K for the very best and rare instances much more. With the UFC your talking 250K+(usually more) and many times over a million and some fighters multi millions when taking in PPV buys. The reward at the top of the UFC is much greater than Pride ever was on a pay scale.

 

[savantor]

Incentives.to win are good but fighter rankings need to be honored as well.

 

[josh345]

He's totally right about MMA fans being fast to kick fighters down when they lose. As soon as you lose you're washed up, figured out etc. Most fickle fan base ever

 

[savantor]

He's totally right about MMA fans being fast to kick fighters down when you lose. As soon as you lose you're washed up, figured out etc. Most fickle fan base ever

Yup,. But it'd.knd thing when fans do it and another when Dana White does it.

 

[campbecc]

I thought everyone knew that

 

[campbecc]

He's totally right about MMA fans being fast to kick fighters down when they lose. As soon as you lose you're washed up, figured out etc. Most fickle fan base ever

and the most ridiculous thing is it happens with fights where the decision could have gone either way

 

[snootylol]

I agree.. i hate Woodley but what he did was smart vs Maia.. The UFC caused it.. Woodley was far superior that night and i believe he could pressure and get the tko/ko.. But that tiny risk of being subbed and losing tons of money is there.. so in his position why do it?

People shat on Nunes.. myself included.. but she stood to lose alot of money if she risked fighting sick..

Bottom line UFC needs to pay non champs (top 10) more money.. better fights = more viewers.. alot of these top fighters dont have the ability to market themselves like Mcgregor...

They do it by great fights.. kos.. subs