Khabib is a better striker than Lee

Foppa21 said:
You based your statement on one moment... Your sample size is a bit small ain't it?

I think they're about as good/bad as each other. Serviceable but the longer they stay upright, the more uncomfortable both become.
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A statistical comparison between them (fightmetric & UFC stats) shows that Khabib is generally superior, both in stand-up and in grappling.

As far as specific reference points; we have 2 common opponents; Al Iaquinta & Edson Barbosa.

Khabib did better on the feet against both of them.

And in general, Kevin has been (T)KO'd once and has been dropped in 1/2 of his UFC fights.

Khabib has never been knocked down, albeit he's been wobbled once.

People get hung up on the textbook technical display by Kevin and Khabib's super awkward style but the numbers don't lie.
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
A statistical comparison between them (fightmetric & UFC stats) shows that Khabib is generally superior, both in stand-up and in grappling.

As far as specific reference points; we have 2 common opponents; Al Iaquinta & Edson Barbosa.

Khabib did better on the feet against both of them.

And in general, Kevin has been (T)KO'd once and has been dropped in 1/2 of his UFC fights.

Khabib has never been knocked down, albeit he's been wobbled once.

People get hung up on the textbook technical display by Kevin and Khabib's super awkward style but the numbers don't lie.
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I don't think there's a superiority on either side. Might be semantics, but one might be slightly better than the other. I wouldn't classify either of them as "bad" but they're both fairly average in the striking stakes that to differentiate them would be to potentially split hairs over something that doesn't really matter. It's not their game. At a stretch, you might say well they can hang in there longer standing up.

A better analysis would be who is able to work their way into the takedown. I feel Khabib wins that fight. In a pure wrestling exchange, I feel Khabib gets him down. It's not even going to be even, to a point where we get a sloppy kickboxing fight and we find out who the better striker is.

Like for like, I think Khabib's success has led to him never really having a striking contest where it was "even" with his opponent (bar the first 2 odd mins vs Michael Johnson).

On the fight metric side, a lot of Khabib's striking success vs Iaquinta was because Iaquinta was so much banking into defending takedowns that he left his head wide open for jabs which Khabib gleefully took (to do damage but it also as a byproduct, pads his stats). Once Khabib stepped away from the takedown threat, Iaquinta was able to to fight in a more traditional stand up style and had more (albeit in my opinion still limit) success standing.

Again, I think all this stand up comparison is not really relevant if the two were to fight. It's just so far and away so unlikely given both Khabib and Lee's MO.
 
Arkham's Notorious Geyser said:
Lol, someone drinks a little bit to much of their own tee there buddy. You should do as your favorite Lightweight says and "Be Humble".

I'm not looking for you to go "OMG Kevin Lee's amazing" I don't need your approval to know that Lee is a top 5 LW and a tough/interesting match up for Khabib.

Kevin Lee stood up with Barboza and showed that his boxing is improving and that he can hang in Barboza's danger zone. He took a nasty kick, but stayed in it and went back to dominating the fight. Unlike Khabib who I know is a damn good grappler, he's never encountered that kind of adversity in a single fight outside of getting caught by Michael Johnson. The fact that Kevin Lee came back from what looked like the end of a dominant performance shows he has more heart and skills than people give him credit for.

Get off your High Horse or you can join the rest of the special snowflakes that think they know everything.

Lee showed that he can hang in every department against Barboza and even had Barboza turning into a panic wrestler quicker than Tony Ferguson did.
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Wait what? Ok first of.. Sure Kevin Lee is a top 5.. I never said he wasn't there... He is... Well bottom 5 five like #3 really.. He's not a top 1 or 2..

he only lasted with Barboza cause Barboza didn't realize what he did, Lee stanky Legging all over the map.. Went for a pray at your feet move to save himself.. Which is smart not taking that away.. He's just not a top contender.. He is a bottom 5 for sure.. Him and Al would be interesting to me. Not Khabib Khabib smashes that fool.
 
MMAandBOXINGfan said:
make both his eyes almost completely shut? make him bleed more? actually finish him before the final bell even though it was the doctor doing it and not edson quitting? I dunno but he did beat the crap outa him pretty good. thanks to khabib, edson shoulda been even more prepared to deal with Lee but he wasn't so Kevin lee is amazing because he beat an edson who khabib gave a blueprint to about how not to get beat up the same way lol o_O
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Yeah but at the same time.. It took him 5 rounds.. Which is not bad sure.. But he had 2 extra rounds.. good job him for reading blue prints..
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
completely
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Does not mean Khabib is a better striker.... Khabib in the edson fight was runnign towards Barboza lunging shots with his chin exposed with zero technique. His defense against Aiquinta was absolutely horrible and any accurate and experienced striker would tag Khabib left and right on the feet.

Lee actually surprised me since he tagged Edson a few times with some nice combations, and landed two very hard body kicks with one of them actually hurting Barboza for a moment. Lee does not have the best boxing or striking and has many holes, but he is still a better striker than Khabib.
 
MMA__Analyst said:
Does not mean Khabib is a better striker.... Khabib in the edson fight was runnign towards Barboza lunging shots with his chin exposed with zero technique. His defense against Aiquinta was absolutely horrible and any accurate and experienced striker would tag Khabib left and right on the feet.

Lee actually surprised me since he tagged Edson a few times with some nice combations, and landed two very hard body kicks with one of them actually hurting Barboza for a moment. Lee does not have the best boxing or striking and has many holes, but he is still a better striker than Khabib.
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Again, you're referencing how they look when they strike as opposed to the actual consequences and statistical data.

Kevin Lee could move like Floyd Mayweather, with a safeguarded chin, a nice, defense, and perfect text-book movements but it doesn't matter when he gets dropped every other fight and is statistically getting tagged more and having less accuracy with his shots.
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
Kevin Lee could move like Floyd Mayweather, with a safeguarded chin, a nice, defense, and perfect text-book movements but it doesn't matter when he gets dropped every other fight and is statistically getting tagged more and having less accuracy with his shots.
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Khabib doesn't get dropped like Kevin Lee because Khabib doesn't stand up as much as Lee does. Lee believes that he has good boxing and is a good striker. He is decent but he has many holes in his striking as does Khabib, however Khabib doesn't spend as much time on the feet as Lee does.

Also I don't know why you claim Lee has less accuracy with his shots. Im discussing striking, and the vast majority of strikes landed by both Lee and Khabib are on the ground, so to compare their accuracy percentage would be pointless in comparing their striking. Of all the strikes both lee and Khabib land on the feet, are Khabibs strikes landed from a distance on the feet more accurate than strikes landed by Lee on the feet? If so I'd like to see where you get those stats from, because I don't even think fight metric provides those stats. Fight metric provides what percentage of the strikes are landed on the feet and the ground, but not the accuracy for each category
 
Leoooo said:
This !!!
Khabib is way less active and quite boring. But he doesn’t get hit much.
Doesn’t make him better head to head. He’s a shit striker but does good because of the takedown threat.

Both Lee and Tony actually took chances and finished Barboza. I think they beat up Khabib, cause they would never fear his striking, and the grappling is closer.
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I'd love to see any of these matchups. Things like Tony's crazy active guard vs. Khabib's top control would be very interesting. Speaking of Tony's guard - it's criminal that Barboza with his long limbs has such a dismally inactive guard, no?
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
A statistical comparison between them (fightmetric & UFC stats) shows that Khabib is generally superior, both in stand-up and in grappling.

As far as specific reference points; we have 2 common opponents; Al Iaquinta & Edson Barbosa.

Khabib did better on the feet against both of them.

And in general, Kevin has been (T)KO'd once and has been dropped in 1/2 of his UFC fights.

Khabib has never been knocked down, albeit he's been wobbled once.

People get hung up on the textbook technical display by Kevin and Khabib's super awkward style but the numbers don't lie.
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An issue I think you have is that striking in MMA is very often judged by what "looks technical" due to a a lack of knowledge from fans and indeed many commentators. If you keep to a standard Boxing/kickboxing stance with your hands high, throw conventional looking jabs and the odd kick then this will be praised as "good technique" even if actually your skill level is pretty low. If on the other hand your less conventional like Khabib with lower hands, fewer kicks and an unconventional stance then you'll be talked down as untechnical.

I mean I don't think Khabib is close to Fedor's level standing but even Fedor has been called a sloppy brawler by a lot of sherdoggers who praise "evolved" strikers who just pump the jabs, throw the odd lowkick and then fall to bits totally when put under any pressure.
 
jmmj said:
I'd love to see any of these matchups. Things like Tony's crazy active guard vs. Khabib's top control would be very interesting. Speaking of Tony's guard - it's criminal that Barboza with his long limbs has such a dismally inactive guard, no?
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That's definitely I think a weakness for a lot of strikers coming into the sport these days, theres focus on avoiding the ground but much less focus on a strong guard, even if its mostly defencive.
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
a striker

NauticalWarmheartedHornedtoad-max-14mb.gif
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Kamal Shalorus is a striker? Wow, this is some next level reaching, fair play.
 
TheLastEmperorReurns said:
A statistical comparison between them (fightmetric & UFC stats) shows that Khabib is generally superior, both in stand-up and in grappling.

As far as specific reference points; we have 2 common opponents; Al Iaquinta & Edson Barbosa.

Khabib did better on the feet against both of them.

And in general, Kevin has been (T)KO'd once and has been dropped in 1/2 of his UFC fights.

Khabib has never been knocked down, albeit he's been wobbled once.

People get hung up on the textbook technical display by Kevin and Khabib's super awkward style but the numbers don't lie.
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bump.

I said this before Khabib/Conor and Lee/Al II.
 
Lee's gas tank is not good enough for 5 rounders, Khabib would outwork him.
 
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