Keenan talks about Saulo guard pass being wrong

trustdoesntrust said:
they show an armbar he hit on Rampage about 15 seconds before as well (that Rampage has to slam out of?). On the same Pride card as the Suda fight, a young Paulo Filho hits a similarly vicious armbar from mount. I don't know the invisible jiu-jitsu theyre doing, but clearly these guys have learned to lock the shoulder in such a way that leaves no room for the types of annoying defensive movements most of us are used to when our armbars fail.
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Watch the one that Roger did on Ron Waterman. H2O slams out of the first one but the second is super tight. In the interview afterwards he talks about it too.
 
BJJ_Rage said:
you need to start somewhere...
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Indeed, you start with the one step arm-bar so you don't give them bad habits and give them something that directly measures their ability to develop hip movement.
 
What about for short guys with short limbs?

Can the guarder grab the ankles or collar?
 
TheGZA said:
Bustamante took down Chuck, Hendo, and Lindland. What a badass.
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He's lost in the noise but a p4p goat honorable mention. His double sub on Lindland is a thing of legend. If you watch that, after Lindland's Brazilian tap Busta is punching him with a furry and anger you don't see in any of his other fights. I would have been pissed too. Dirty, unsportsmanlike tactic.
 
rmongler said:
Indeed, you start with the one step arm-bar so you don't give them bad habits and give them something that directly measures their ability to develop hip movement.
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IMO, that’s really not possible, you need to have certain skills to do that, timing with hip movement is esencial to perform a one or 2 step arm bar, something is really not necessarily st the beggining of your journey... he’ll I don’t lnow anyone blue and over to ever going for the 4 step arm bar, as you progresss you kind of figure it out yourself that shit ain’t cutting it.
 
BJJ_Rage said:
IMO, that’s really not possible, you need to have certain skills to do that, timing with hip movement is esencial to perform a one or 2 step arm bar, something is really not necessarily st the beggining of your journey... he’ll I don’t lnow anyone blue and over to ever going for the 4 step arm bar, as you progresss you kind of figure it out yourself that shit ain’t cutting it.
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You teach it as a counter to getting choked Frankenstein-style in your guard, which makes it both a tool for teaching hip movement and a valid fighting tool for untrained opposition.
 
PointyShinyBurn said:
You teach it as a counter to getting choked Frankenstein-style in your guard, which makes it both a tool for teaching hip movement and a valid fighting tool for untrained opposition.
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Actually that’s pretty good, I think they teach it like this in the comabtives dvd...
 
BJJ_Rage said:
IMO, that’s really not possible, you need to have certain skills to do that, timing with hip movement is esencial to perform a one or 2 step arm bar, something is really not necessarily st the beggining of your journey... he’ll I don’t lnow anyone blue and over to ever going for the 4 step arm bar, as you progresss you kind of figure it out yourself that shit ain’t cutting it.
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Well i suppose the point of departure here is, i don't think a beginner necessarily has to succeed at something right away...
 
rmongler said:
Well i suppose the point of departure here is, i don't think a beginner necessarily has to succeed at something right away...
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The 4 step armlock works just fine vs other whitebelts...
 
BJJ_Rage said:
The 4 step armlock works just fine vs other whitebelts...
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Right, i suppose the point of departure here is, i don't think a beginner necessarily has to succeed at something right away...
 
rmongler said:
Right, i suppose the point of departure here is, i don't think a beginner necessarily has to succeed at something right away...
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I think this approach to teaching is quite important to be honest. It goes beyond just one technique, but to teaching methods as a whole.

IMO, as long as a technique isn’t “wrong” fundamentally, being able to perform at its finest isn’t really that important when your a white belt. With time I’ve learnt that the worst possible mistake when teaching to noobs is to teach too many details or to tech a technique the perfection. For example, X technique requires a certain number of steps to make it work from white to black, if done correctly, thing is, most of the time, besides doing the right steps, the most important thing normally is timing, so no matter how perfect the person perfiomrs the technique will never make it work against a much better grappler. Insisting isn’t doing a technique to its perfection will normally take the focus out of the person, not only that, it’s quite hard to remember all of the steps when your just starting (not the case with armbars though, I’m just using this topic as an example) what the person should be learning is the concept of the technique, details are not that importat, why is the tech iqie working or what is the goal of the technique is the most important thing to transmit to a white belt, as the person gets better he Can learn the details that make the technique work on better people. My forte are triangles, I do not teach the “ryangle” right away to white belt.. why? Because I rather have them understand the concept of the technique first. I teach first the traditional way, explain to them how the choke works, I do however show them how I do it, but it is also fine the traditional way the differences , but since it’s quite more easy to pull off in a roll the traditional way, it’s ok for them to do it that way, as they get better with escaping the hips, they can transition to squeezing from a 90 degree. Just and example, basically make them have fun, they aren white belts they should have fun, stressing too much into details will confuse them more, Most techniques they will do will not be perfect, but will work on white belts and regular joes, so it’s fine imo. The will need to improve their technique as they advance, its natural, I’ve been taught the 4 steps armbar from the start, but i haven’t done one of thsoe in believe in the past 8 years or so.
 
yetanother said:
Does it? Are white belts in your club hitting them on anyone?
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I don’t know on anyone, but are all Whitbwlts in your gym hitting all basic techniques on anyone? What kind of dumb questikn is that? Course there are people who hits them and people who don’t.
 
BJJ_Rage said:
I don’t know on anyone, but are all Whitbwlts in your gym hitting all basic techniques on anyone? What kind of dumb questikn is that? Course there are people who hits them and people who don’t.
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He meant are they hitting them on some people, if he meant "are they hitting them on all the people" he would have said "everyone".
 
I’m honestly baffled by the amount of things in BJJ and Judo that are considered basics but just do not work in any setting bar against absolute beginners.The defence is always that they teach concepts, but why not show concepts in a way that won’t make you lose faith in them?
 
Kaffe said:
I’m honestly baffled by the amount of things in BJJ and Judo that are considered basics but just do not work in any setting bar against absolute beginners.The defence is always that they teach concepts, but why not show concepts in a way that won’t make you lose faith in them?
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Then those techniques are plain wrong. They should be good enough to work on beginners.
 
BJJ_Rage said:
My bad, then yeah of course, the answer is yes.
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In our gym nobody can do the traditional closed guard armbar on anyone who is a half decent white belt.
I can't do it and I do loads of closed guard armlocks.
I maybe could tap out the girls with it.
 
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