"Jiu-jitsu is gonna drown", says Rickson Gracie

[yetanother]

Miyaos style is great for grappling And i have absolutely no doubt that if they ever consider fighting, they have all the tools to adjust their game to fighting, but right now? In a fight? Some old schooler bjj hard nose will probably beat the living shit out of them. Fighting ain't grappling.

Paulo Miyao would beat the crap out prime Rickson easily. Paulo has better wrestling, infinite cardio, crushing top pressure, if he lands on bottom a guard that won't let him get punched and if all fails he heel hooks the fuck out of Rickson.

 

[randomg1t]

against those clueless karate boys, no doubt..

no. against the guys beating those clueless karate boys.

we hear a lot about how today's top sport jiu jitsu fighters are nothing but point fighters who do double guard pulls and berimbolos and it's all so fancy and bullshit and blah blah blah. i loved the ROLL documentary from a while back, except for this exact reason: a few accountants talking shit about today's champions because back then they fought for top position and were a lot tougher. fuck off, the competitors of today would murder every single one of you back then, in jiu jitsu or in a fight. these guys had no striking, they relied entirely on their bjj, and today's best are a lot better than the old timers ever were. it's just the evolution of the sport, combined with the fact that modern competitors are professional athletes.

the line with this needs to be drawn when fighting becomes a professional sport. when you have pro fighters, today's bjj champs aren't a lock anymore. but the guys shitting on modern bjj are mostly from an era of gracie streetfighting, and it's just hilarious that they think they wouldn't get berimbolo'd, have their back taken, and get choked the fuck out.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Paulo Miyao would beat the crap out prime Rickson easily. Paulo has better wrestling, infinite cardio, crushing top pressure, if he lands on bottom a guard that won't let him get punched and if all fails he heel hooks the fuck out of Rickson.

this is go to be the most stupid riduclous post I have ever seen in my life. A dude who has never ever in his life being punch in the face is all the sudden beat rickson gracie? I dont by on the whole rickson was a demi fighting god, but come the fuck on....

nice trolling.

 

[randomg1t]

this is go to be the most stupid riduclous post I have ever seen in my life. A dude who has never ever in his life being punch in the face is all the sudden beat rickson gracie? I dont by on the whole rickson was a demi fighting god.

nice trolling.

i don't think he's trolling. and who has rickson fought that was such a fierce striker? hell, when has rickson shown any half decent striking?

rickson's game was his jiu jitsu. he took guys down and armbarred them. he occasionally also hit them in the face after mounting them, or getting side control on them, neither of which he'd ever get on paulo. i'm not even sure he could get paulo down, to be honest. and on the ground, as much as everyone adores rickson, i just refuse to believe he was some mythical creature. his jiu jitsu was good, but today's champions are undoubtedly better.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

no. against the guys beating those clueless karate boys.

we hear a lot about how today's top sport jiu jitsu fighters are nothing but point fighters who do double guard pulls and berimbolos and it's all so fancy and bullshit and blah blah blah. i loved the ROLL documentary from a while back, except for this exact reason: a few accountants talking shit about today's champions because back then they fought for top position and were a lot tougher. fuck off, the competitors of today would murder every single one of you back then, in jiu jitsu or in a fight. these guys had no striking, they relied entirely on their bjj, and today's best are a lot better than the old timers ever were. it's just the evolution of the sport, combined with the fact that modern competitors are professional athletes.

the line with this needs to be drawn when fighting becomes a professional sport. when you have pro fighters, today's bjj champs aren't a lock anymore. but the guys shitting on modern bjj are mostly from an era of gracie streetfighting, and it's just hilarious that they think they wouldn't get berimbolo'd, have their back taken, and get choked the fuck out.

murillo bustamante came out from brazil with pretty much no fighting experience but vale tudo trining, fabio gurgel took n fucking mark keer and lasted to a decision do you actually believe paulo would be alive after 3 minutes of having prime keer in a ring?

stop living in lalaland...

Guys from the past.. mario sperry murilo paulo filho the whole btt team, are you for real you get keenan cornelius in a cage with murilo from the past and you think keenan was going to destroy murilo?

my guts tell me the closes you have gotten to a fight, was ring side.

grappling works, if you train to be a fighter with grappling base, you may turn into a good fighter, but not every grappler is a fighter, you think what royce did couldve be achived by just any random black belt from today who has never trained to fight? yeah right.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

i don't think he's trolling. and who has rickson fought that was such a fierce striker? hell, when has rickson shown any half decent striking?

rickson's game was his jiu jitsu. he took guys down and armbarred them. he occasionally also hit them in the face after mounting them, or getting side control on them, neither of which he'd ever get on paulo. i'm not even sure he could get paulo down, to be honest. and on the grown, as much as everyone adores rickson, i just refuse to believe he was some mythical creature. his jiu jitsu was good, but today's champions are undoubtedly better.

how many times has paulo fought in his life? mmmm about zero. How many times did he fight some 300 pounds beast? mmm about zero, I cant believe I am actually arguing about this.

Fighting aint just grappling, its quite clear you cant see the difference, stick to berimbolos bro.

 

[randomg1t]

how many times has paulo fought in his life? mmmm about zero. How many times did he fight some 300 pounds beast? mmm about zero, I cant believe I am actually arguing about this.

Fighting aint just grappling, its quite clear you cant see the difference, stick to berimbolos bro.

and how many times has rickson won his fights using anything other than his jiu jitsu? hell, has he ever even faced someone whose base was jiu jitsu? would he magically become a boxer or a fierce gnp'er when facing a jiu jitsu fighter of paulo's caliber?

i can't even do the berimbolo. but i do know that paulo miyao can do it to people who train 4 hours a day and drill nothing but their counters to it. and he still does it to them and takes their back.

murillo bustamante came out from brazil with pretty much no fighting experience but vale tudo trining, fabio gurgel took n fucking mark keer and lasted to a decision.

stop living in lalaland...

Guys from the past.. mario sperry murilo paulo filho the whole btt team, are you for real you get keenan cornelius in a cage with murilo from the past and you think keenan was going to destroy murilo?

my guts tell me the closes you have gotten to a fight, was ring side.

grappling works, if you train to be a fighter with grappling base, you may turn into a good fighter, but not every grappler is a fighter, you think what royce did couldve be achived by just any random black belt from today who has never trained to fight? yeah right.

did you miss the part where i said pro fighters aren't a lock for today's champs anymore? it's incredibly difficult to talk to you about anything when you just ignore half of the post you're responding to.

sperry, bustamante, filho were all pro fighters. they weren't just some jiu jitsu thugs. they all knew how to stike and wrestle, all of them. they're not the guys i'm talking about. but i'm too tired to keep explaining the same thing so fuck it, have it your way.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

and how many times has rickson won his fights using anything other than his jiu jitsu? hell, has he ever even faced someone whose base was jiu jitsu? would he magically become a boxer or a fierce gnp'er when facing a jiu jitsu fighter of paulo's caliber?

i can't even do the berimbolo. but i do know that paulo miyao can do it to people who train 4 hours a day and drill nothing but their counters to it. and he still does it to them and takes their back.


did you miss the part where i said pro fighters aren't a lock for today's champs anymore? it's incredibly difficult to talk to you about anything when you just ignore half of the post you're responding to.

sperry, bustamante, filho were all pro fighters. they weren't just some jiu jitsu thugs. they all knew how to stike and wrestle, all of them. they're not the guys i'm talking about. but i'm too tired to keep explaining the same thing so fuck it, have it your way.

wrong, they were pure jiu jitsu guys bread on carlson gracie gym. They came to the US with zero fighting eperience, murilo is on tape saying that.

What you are saying is just because someone has better jiu jtsu he can jump in and fight a jiu jitsu based fighter and beat him because all he does is jiu jtsu. Well demian maia only does jiu jitsu, im quite sure leandro lo will moop the floor with demian in a bjj match today, you think leandro is going to beat demian in a fight? I mean all he does is jiu jitsu right?

the problem is that you seem to think fighters are just some type of video game shit, a fight is a fight, not just a grappling competition even if both guys are grapplers.

 

[CFGroup]

and how many times has rickson won his fights using anything other than his jiu jitsu? hell, has he ever even faced someone whose base was jiu jitsu? would he magically become a boxer or a fierce gnp'er when facing a jiu jitsu fighter of paulo's caliber?

i can't even do the berimbolo. but i do know that paulo miyao can do it to people who train 4 hours a day and drill nothing but their counters to it. and he still does it to them and takes their back.


did you miss the part where i said pro fighters aren't a lock for today's champs anymore? it's incredibly difficult to talk to you about anything when you just ignore half of the post you're responding to.

sperry, bustamante, filho were all pro fighters. they weren't just some jiu jitsu thugs. they all knew how to stike and wrestle, all of them. they're not the guys i'm talking about. but i'm too tired to keep explaining the same thing so fuck it, have it your way.

Basically every convo with that guy...

Good points on your end, the evolution is happening even if the die hards want it to be 1993 forever.

 

[lechien]

Henry Akins said the ibjjf world champions would come to rickson gym and they would get demolished.

Of course, henry never mentioned any names.

 

[Concrete Whale]

Sport BJJ guys in 2017 would not be able to do what the old school BJJ guys did. They would beat the old school 80s-90s BJJ players in any grappling format but they would get knocked out by boxers, MT fighters or anyone who does any other even semi-legit striking art. Old school BJJ was for vale tudo and trained you how to move the fight through the 4 distances against strikers with bare knuckles. If you try to clinch with even a basic striker of your weight with no striking training whatsoever you are just going to get knocked out immediately 9/10 don't kid yourself, they only have one shot well they are not going to miss if you mummy walk towards with your chin in the air. Gracie Combatives would be destroyed by 3 months of casual boxing training probably less.

 

[yetanother]

hell, has he ever even faced someone whose base was jiu jitsu?

Most of his opponents had zero skill in anything fighting related.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

No worse than jumping guard. You don't see jumping guard much in the UFC for a reason.

jumping guard its quite silly for SD.

But the reason you dont see jumping guard in the UFC is becasue the grappling level of now is quite high, its quite hard to sub someone from the guard and you are losing the fightt if you are on bottom.

Change the rules and match none grapplers with grapplers and all the suddeng jumping guard will be a very valid strategy.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Sport BJJ guys in 2017 would not be able to do what the old school BJJ guys did. They would beat the old school 80s-90s BJJ players in any grappling format but they would get knocked out by boxers, MT fighters or anyone who does any other even semi-legit striking art. Old school BJJ was for vale tudo and trained you how to move the fight through the 4 distances against strikers with bare knuckles. If you try to clinch with even a basic striker of your weight with no striking training whatsoever you are just going to get knocked out immediately 9/10 don't kid yourself, they only have one shot well they are not going to miss if you mummy walk towards with your chin in the air. Gracie Combatives would be destroyed by 3 months of casual boxing training probably less.

walking with the chin on the air and closing the distnce has worked pretty damn well for gracies vs other strikers.

You are not going to get knocked out 9/10 times, you cant ko someone whos clinching with you... if you are an strker and youve got to the clinch, and do not pummel, your ass is going down, most likely with a body lock trip.

 

[HunterAcosta]

I'm shitting on Kudo and Kyokushin because I think the fucked up sparring and fighting replaces people's natural untrained flailing with something worse, making them into pain denying robots with no ability to protect their faces.

I like shotokan.

Im not shitting on shotokan but kyokushin has a "harder rep" than shotokan for being hard core in its training and practioners. I agree that no punching to the face is lame, but I respectfully disagree that full contact kyokushin training is worse than some jabroni with no training flaining away. Of course, if that jabroni is a mean , large, violent person who street fights alot, he will definitely be a handful for most people, trained or untrained. And kyokushin are used to taking full power KICKS to the face so its not like they arent used to no face contact. Im basing this on a dojo that trains full contact, not a strip mall dojo or mcdojo. But ultimately, the practioner and how tough they are is more important than any style.

 

[SummerStriker]

Im not shitting on shotokan but kyokushin has a "harder rep" than shotokan for being hard core in its training and practioners. I agree that no punching to the face is lame, but I respectfully disagree that full contact kyokushin training is worse than some jabroni with no training flaining away. Of course, if that jabroni is a mean , large, violent person who street fights alot, he will definitely be a handful for most people, trained or untrained. And kyokushin are used to taking full power KICKS to the face so its not like they arent used to no face contact. Im basing this on a dojo that trains full contact, not a strip mall dojo or mcdojo. But ultimately, the practioner and how tough they are is more important than any style.

lol at Kyokushin face kicking. Those dudes lower their IQs through their sport faster than girls' soccer.

 

[yetanother]

murillo bustamante came out from brazil with pretty much no fighting experience but vale tudo triningt.

Murillo Bustamante actually had striking training, it's likely Paulo wouldn't do well against him without any striking training. Rickson on the other hand had zero striking (and got away with it because the opponents he fought where mostly pro wrestlers with zero skills in anything). Rickson was basically fighting CM Punks.

 

[Hotora86]

I'm shitting on Kudo and Kyokushin because I think the fucked up sparring and fighting replaces people's natural untrained flailing with something worse, making them into pain denying robots with no ability to protect their faces.

I like shotokan.

Controversial opinion. I haven't trained Kyokushin long enough to feel any impact to my natural reactions but I know for a fact that not every Kyokushin guy is a "pain denying robot" and counter-strikers aren't uncommon in competition.
Perhaps @shinkyoku can elaborate more?

And sorry for the OT, BJJ ppl.

 

[yetanother]

Henry Akins said the ibjjf world champions would come to rickson gym and they would get demolished.

Henry akins is a parasite on the rickson myth. He is just Ronda Rouseys ex who hasn't accomplished anything whatsoever himself so he hypes rickson up to gets some scraps just on being ricksons black belt.

 

[Hotora86]

Henry akins is a parasite on the rickson myth. He is just Ronda Rouseys ex who hasn't accomplished anything whatsoever himself so he hypes rickson up to gets some scraps just on being ricksons black belt.

Burn!