Is Kovalev as racist as Pascal claims?

[The Judas Pig]

Honestly, I simply can't think of a situation where comparing black people to monkeys would not raise eyebrows. That's all I'm saying.

Why didn't you just say that in the first place? I'm sure we've all got better stuff to do.

 

[LATEXXX COMMANDO]

We are all brothers, we are all one.

I'm a single child.

 

[Seano]

Why didn't you just say that in the first place? I'm sure we've all got better stuff to do.
View attachment 76923

That is pretty much what I said.

 

[DannyNL]

You sure about that?

No, I'm not from Russia and I've never been there.

I have no doubt that Kovalev knew it could be racially linked. Maybe he even meant it as a racial insult. But what I'm saying is maybe that kind of thing isn't as racially sensitive as it is over here, as they don't have the slavery/segregation thing in their not-so-distant past. Maybe calling it a black person a monkey is relatively innocuous over there. I'm not saying it's one way or the other, I'm just speculating.

Either way, I'm a big fan of the guy. As a boxing fan, I've learned you have to separate the boxer from the person, because boxing doesn't attract very many saints.

 

[Fzubek]

Who cares really?

I mean as long as he isn't committing hate crimes I don't give a shit what his beliefs are.

I don't share his culture, I don't identify with him in any way.

I just like to watch him fight.

 

[TheGreatA]

For such a huge racist, Kovalev sure seems to respect some black people.

I don't know, maybe he just didn't like Pascal and Stevenson because they talked a bunch of shit about him? A guy like Kovalev, once you start playing games with him, he doesn't pull any punches, in the ring or otherwise (except when he's looking to punish you for a couple of extra rounds).

Calling Stevenson a monkey might be racist and insulting, but that's kind of the point. Kovalev might not subscribe to any racist ideas but once Stevenson started screwing with him, he just came up with the worst insults that he could think of in response. What better way to piss somebody off another guy than to hurl racial insults at them? To Kovalev, it's the same thing as an American fighter using Russian stereotypes to insult him.

 

[kudo420]

Only black americans have the right to decide what's racist because we cant be racist. Plus we endured way more during slavery than any other race ever.

 

[Seano]

Only black americans have the right to decide what's racist because we cant be racist. Plus we endured way more during slavery than any other race ever.

"You" didn't endure anything.

 

[nac386]

Here is something to lighten the mood.

Skip to 9:30 to hear Kovalev explain his purse.

 

[MEAN357]

Dunno enough about it to label him a racist, but he's clearly a fucking hateful individual just a plain ol mean sunnamabitch...like any good power puncher should be really. If I recall correctly tho didnt he loom over some black russian dude he KTFO'd and scream hateful shit at him?

I watched the fight w/ a Russian buddy of mine and asked him what he was saying to the downed opponent and he just kinda said 'some mean shit, he doesn't like the black russian guy'..thats verbatum but still. Wouldn't be the first Russian to be racist as fuck either way. I think a lot of what he says might get lost in translation tho. Like his post fight interview vs pascal the other night even Kellerman brought it up.

Wouldn't surprise me if he was at all, but im honestly not judging the guy for what he does outside the ring. He's a fighter, that typically doesn't refer to a highly enlightened and insightful individual.

 

[MEAN357]

Here is something to lighten the mood.

Skip to 9:30 to hear Kovalev explain his purse.

That was pretty fkin hilarious, nice find

 

[MEAN357]

For such a huge racist, Kovalev sure seems to respect some black people.

I don't know, maybe he just didn't like Pascal and Stevenson because they talked a bunch of shit about him? A guy like Kovalev, once you start playing games with him, he doesn't pull any punches, in the ring or otherwise (except when he's looking to punish you for a couple of extra rounds).

Calling Stevenson a monkey might be racist and insulting, but that's kind of the point. Kovalev might not subscribe to any racist ideas but once Stevenson started screwing with him, he just came up with the worst insults that he could think of in response. What better way to piss somebody off another guy than to hurl racial insults at them? To Kovalev, it's the same thing as an American fighter using Russian stereotypes to insult him.

Not a great argument really, not that I disagree with the point you're tryign to make. Muhammad Ali, a black nationalist, made a speech infront of the KKK at a clan rally a was cheered by the whole lot of em. Just because you accept certain people, especailly when its at your own benefit, doesn't mean someone isn't 'racist'. Granted i have met motherfuckers that are so hateful they wouldn't even listen to a good song of a black person was singin it. But theres also plenty of people who in the public eye, or at work, ect will be as courteous and nice to a person regardless of their personal feelings just cuz it's a professional envirionment. Then 5 mins later go back to slangin N bombs and spewin bullshit.

It's hard to understand racism if you've never been discriminated on. but thats not to say it isn't an overused excuse. Too many people try to discredit it's existence when they have no experience with it. Just like too many people wanna claim it just because it's a great excuse to not have to take personal responsibility.

 

[LATEXXX COMMANDO]

Dunno enough about it to label him a racist, but he's clearly a fucking hateful individual just a plain ol mean sunnamabitch...like any good power puncher should be really. If I recall correctly tho didnt he loom over some black russian dude he KTFO'd and scream hateful shit at him?

I watched the fight w/ a Russian buddy of mine and asked him what he was saying to the downed opponent and he just kinda said 'some mean shit, he doesn't like the black russian guy'..thats verbatum but still. Wouldn't be the first Russian to be racist as fuck either way. I think a lot of what he says might get lost in translation tho. Like his post fight interview vs pascal the other night even Kellerman brought it up.

Wouldn't surprise me if he was at all, but im honestly not judging the guy for what he does outside the ring. He's a fighter, that typically doesn't refer to a highly enlightened and insightful individual.

Black Russian?

 

[MEAN357]

Black Russian?

LOL i know dudes more rare than hens teeth. But thats what they called em LOL ...the black russian...

 

[TheGreatA]

Not a great argument really, not that I disagree with the point you're tryign to make. Muhammad Ali, a black nationalist, made a speech infront of the KKK at a clan rally a was cheered by the whole lot of em. Just because you accept certain people, especailly when its at your own benefit, doesn't mean someone isn't 'racist'. Granted i have met motherfuckers that are so hateful they wouldn't even listen to a good song of a black person was singin it. But theres also plenty of people who in the public eye, or at work, ect will be as courteous and nice to a person regardless of their personal feelings just cuz it's a professional envirionment. Then 5 mins later go back to slangin N bombs and spewin bullshit.

It's hard to understand racism if you've never been discriminated on. but thats not to say it isn't an overused excuse. Too many people try to discredit it's existence when they have no experience with it. Just like too many people wanna claim it just because it's a great excuse to not have to take personal responsibility.

I just don't think a big-time racist would surround himself with black people giving him advice. He has gone out on his way to get rid of the average Russian/European trainers, in order to learn the American style by visiting American gyms and hiring JD Jackson as his mentor. If he was an ignorant bigot, he would've just stayed with a bunch of Russian guys patting him on the back all the time and laughing at all of his jokes.

People hurl racial insults to get under somebody's skin, not necessarily because they have an advanced racial ideology that they follow inside their heads. I think the evidence just shifts towards Kovalev being a very politically incorrect guy from a politically incorrect country, but not one to have any grand-standing racist opinions. He seems quite open-minded to me, to be honest, because of how he has been able to adapt to the American culture, going through the effort to learn their language and traditions. He even apologized for his comment, which would be unthinkable if he was still in Russia, where his comment would've probably earned him unanimous support.

 

[proudamericanda]

Not a great argument really, not that I disagree with the point you're tryign to make. Muhammad Ali, a black nationalist, made a speech infront of the KKK at a clan rally a was cheered by the whole lot of em. Just because you accept certain people, especailly when its at your own benefit, doesn't mean someone isn't 'racist'. Granted i have met motherfuckers that are so hateful they wouldn't even listen to a good song of a black person was singin it. But theres also plenty of people who in the public eye, or at work, ect will be as courteous and nice to a person regardless of their personal feelings just cuz it's a professional envirionment. Then 5 mins later go back to slangin N bombs and spewin bullshit.

It's hard to understand racism if you've never been discriminated on. but thats not to say it isn't an overused excuse. Too many people try to discredit it's existence when they have no experience with it. Just like too many people wanna claim it just because it's a great excuse to not have to take personal responsibility.

Buddy you hit the nail on the head here.

 

[MEAN357]

I just don't think a big-time racist would surround himself with black people giving him advice. He has gone out on his way to get rid of the average Russian/European trainers, in order to learn the American style by visiting American gyms and hiring JD Jackson as his mentor. If he was an ignorant bigot, he would've just stayed with a bunch of Russian guys patting him on the back all the time and laughing at all of his jokes.

People hurl racial insults to get under somebody's skin, not necessarily because they have an advanced racial ideology that they follow inside their heads. I think the evidence just shifts towards Kovalev being a very politically incorrect guy from a politically incorrect country, but not one to have any grand-standing racist opinions. He seems quite open-minded to me, to be honest, because of how he has been able to adapt to the American culture, going through the effort to learn their language and traditions. He even apologized for his comment, which would be unthinkable if he was still in Russia, where his comment would've probably earned him unanimous support.

Like I said I don't necessarily disagree with the point you were trying to make, just didn't agree with the arguement you presented. I agree, if he was a bigtime hatemongering biggot he would refuse help from any black person ever. But like I also said, it's not uncommon for someone to accept someone regardless of whether or not they look down on them as lesser people if its in their direct benefit. Kovalev knew that if he wanted to really grow as a boxer he'd have to get a legit trainer so he went to the best trainer Miami has to offer since Angelo Dundee retired. Black white pink or purple he could recognize that would directly benefit him, and money is the one thing that seems to transcend hatred.

That being said I'm not implying Kovalev IS racist, and personally dont really care either way. I work with some really racist fucks, they hated me right off the bat untill they realized Im about my business. Just off of that alone we work together really well and they show me nothing but respect because of that. That doesn't change the fact that I know they'll take any oppertunity to hate on anyone who's not of their own kind. They just have the common decency/intelligence never to say it to me. We may disagree on every other thing under the sun, but we have a common goal: git money.

 

[JABMALASSIE]

I don't think he's racist in the true definition, meaning he thinks blacks are genetically inferior. I do think he's really prejudice, probably sees a black dude and assumes they are a chain snatching dope smoker who knocks up chicks and doesn't pay child support. That doesn't make him racist, just really prejudice which is also bad. I worked with (and am related to) some of these guys. Definitely assholes but the difference is once they realize a black guy doesn't fall into that category they treat them just like every other guy and would go to bat for them if they needed it.

I hate prejudice because as a person of color it means I've got to go and prove I'm not a lazy good for nothing thief everywhere I go while my white counterparts get the benefit of the doubt. But at the same time guys like Kovalev are just Resorting to lazy thinking and it's actually normal human behavior to stereotype and group people based on identifiable traits, it helps us make quick decisions as a species.

It is what it is, he's still my favorite fighter at the moment.

Reminds me of an Italian contractor who repaired my parents place when I was young. He always used the term "Bongo Man" to refer to the black workmen and complained about how lazy they were. He would always bring wine, cheese and tomato sauce for my parents even after he completed the job. He was prejudiced but a good guy and quite hilarious. If he liked you he didn't really care what race you were.

We don't really know Kovalev but sometimes you just have to give the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Shoemaker]

I think criticizing me in any way for calling anyone a monkey whenever I want is a particularly pernicious form of reverse racism.

We need to #MakeAmericaGreatAgain

 

[Future GOAT]

I just don't think a big-time racist would surround himself with black people giving him advice. He has gone out on his way to get rid of the average Russian/European trainers, in order to learn the American style by visiting American gyms and hiring JD Jackson as his mentor. If he was an ignorant bigot, he would've just stayed with a bunch of Russian guys patting him on the back all the time and laughing at all of his jokes.

People hurl racial insults to get under somebody's skin, not necessarily because they have an advanced racial ideology that they follow inside their heads. I think the evidence just shifts towards Kovalev being a very politically incorrect guy from a politically incorrect country, but not one to have any grand-standing racist opinions. He seems quite open-minded to me, to be honest, because of how he has been able to adapt to the American culture, going through the effort to learn their language and traditions. He even apologized for his comment, which would be unthinkable if he was still in Russia, where his comment would've probably earned him unanimous support.

This exactly. I would go as far as to say that a good 90% if not more, of all the racial things we are hearing today on the internet, in forums, and in general are simply used as trolling tools. Not because the person actually believes the BS they are spewing. In todays day and age, people are overly sensitive about race, and this is well known to the point that it becomes an easy target for a good troll, or tactic to get someone off their game or whatever.

I think that true racism in it's real form is close to extinct these days.