Is catch wrestling dead? [QUINTET spoiler inside]

[yetanother]

Also probably a good idea to get a set with less of a focus on closed guard, which is neither played in grappling or in MMA at the high levels any more.

Doesn't closed guard have a use at the high levels of mma to stall for a standup.

 

[AZ103]

Doesn't closed guard have a use at the high levels of mma to stall for a standup.

Lol yes but stalling isnt a positive dawg. With yellow cards stalling should be a warning the point deduction like in folkstyle wrestling.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

This was interesting to say the least... very different approach from a regular sub wrestling match...

 

[yetanother]

Lol yes but stalling isnt a positive dawg. With yellow cards stalling should be a warning the point deduction like in folkstyle wrestling.

Being stood up from closed guard is insanely better from the guy on bottom the either being pitter pattered for the rest of the round or the top guy bashing your head in because you play some old school wrist control game.

 

[AZ103]

Being stood up from closed guard is insanely better from the guy on bottom the either being pitter pattered for the rest of the round or the top guy bashing your head in because you play some old school wrist control game.

Its insanely better because the UFC and MMA in general does not punish stalling in any way. In a real fight no one is coming to tell him to get off of you. Yellow cards and point deductions delt out in similar ways to wrestling would stop this.

 

[yetanother]

Its insanely better because the UFC and MMA in general does not punish stalling in any way. In a real fight no one is coming to tell him to get off of you. Yellow cards and point deductions delt out in similar ways to wrestling would stop this.

What's a real fight? A imaginary no holds bared no time limit deathmatch?

 

[AZ103]

What's a real fight? A imaginary no holds bared no time limit deathmatch?

What are you asking? You don't know what a real fight is? Ive been in plenty and at the time they are happening they feel like a no time limit death match, because they could potentially turn into one. Stalling in the guard for a stand up is not an acceptable tactic in a back alley alone and it shouldn't be in MMA either.

 

[yetanother]

What are you asking? You don't know what a real fight is? Ive been in plenty and at the time they are happening they feel like a no time limit death match, because they could potentially turn into one. Stalling in the guard for a stand up is not an acceptable tactic in a back alley alone and it shouldn't be in MMA either.

Why would I get into back alley street fights? MMA is different, how often did you fight shirtless *actually skilled* people who where trying to hold you down to win a ref decision and where protected by no hitting the back of the head rules?

 

[trustdoesntrust]

This was interesting to say the least... very different approach from a regular sub wrestling match...

Why are all good catch wrestlers big guys? Maybe this is just a bit of selection bias, but seems like everybody who's dangerous with a Catch style is the size of Erik Paulsen, Josh Barnett, Neil Melanson. only smaller catch guys I've seen have success were the Sakuraba generation of Japanese fighters. Granted, it seems like a well-suited style for giants compared to a BJJ guard/sweep/pass game.

 

[AZ103]

Why would I get into back alley street fights? MMA is different, how often did you fight shirtless *actually skilled* people who where trying to hold you down to win a ref decision and where protected by no hitting the back of the head rules?

I can see you are rooted in your ignorance so this will be my last response. Many times and nearly every time in my case, street fights become unavoidable. I trained MMA and kickboxing for two years after HS. I have a strong wrestling background and ive had my ass kicked more than enough times. You can beleive what you like but stalling in guard isnt fighting and shouldnt be rewarded in sport fighting. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.

 

[yetanother]

I can see you are rooted in your ignorance so this will be my last response. Many times and nearly every time in my case, street fights become unavoidable. I trained MMA and kickboxing for two years after HS. I have a strong wrestling background and ive had my ass kicked more than enough times.

How do you get into fights with trained people? Or did you get utterly humiliated and lose to an untrained opponent?

 

[TroldeAnsigt]

How do you get into fights with trained people? Or did you get utterly humiliated and lose to an untrained opponent?

Not a part of your argument, but just want to say your last sentence was complete nonsense. Anyone can lose a streetfight, let alone a MMA fight. Even pro boxers can get caught by a lucky punch from a layman and get knocked down, granted it doesnt happen often, but anything can happen. Especially in street fights when sucker punches, alcohol and awkward small spaces are involved.

 

[mcgoatp4p#1]

That butterfly sweep was incredible. I didnt think it was possible to do that to barnett

 

[Thaijitsu612]

Its insanely better because the UFC and MMA in general does not punish stalling in any way. In a real fight no one is coming to tell him to get off of you. Yellow cards and point deductions delt out in similar ways to wrestling would stop this.

99% of the time, in a real fight, someone is telling him to get off you and try to stop the fight once it goes too far. The street fight argument is so generic and unrealistic.

 

[Human Bass]

Here is a great example from Khabib when how to use the guard instead of trying to get up in desperation, with strikes included (combat sambo)

 

[AZ103]

99% of the time, in a real fight, someone is telling him to get off you and try to stop the fight once it goes too far. The street fight argument is so generic and unrealistic.

Simply not true. But beleive what you like.

 

[Thaijitsu612]

Simply not true. But beleive what you like.

It's absolutely true.

I work as law enforcement in one of the top 5 most violent cities in the nation. In all of our homicides you know how many people were beat to death? Less than 1%.

I couldn't guess how many fight calls, battery calls, and assault calls ive been to. Only a handfuls ended in serious injury.

We don't find guys dead in alleys from as a result of "real fights". They're shot or stabbed. Guys dont get their eyes gouged out or noses bitten off.

Id love to hear why you think street fights are often unavoidable, yet take place in total solitude away from outside interference or police response.

 

[AZ103]

It's absolutely true.

I work as law enforcement in one of the top 5 most violent cities in the nation. In all of our homicides you know how many people were beat to death? Less than 1%.

I couldn't guess how many fight calls, battery calls, and assault calls ive been to. Only a handfuls ended in serious injury.

We don't find guys dead in alleys from as a result of "real fights". They're shot or stabbed. Guys dont get their eyes gouged out or noses bitten off.

Id love to hear why you think street fights are often unavoidable, yet take place in total solitude away from outside interference or police response.

I didnt say they end in deaths bud. You said 99% of street fights if someone is takendown there is someone there pulling them off. Its a made up statistic and its bull shit. Fights go to the ground and remain there at varying amounts of time. Bystander effects take place. Jumpings take plCe. People dont do much. But this is the grappling forum so its all or nothing right?

 

[AZ103]

Also as a law enforcement officer maybe stop and think most people dont just beat someone to death. For multiple reasons... most people are untrained and in pathetic shape. Or how about that they dont want to kill anyone? They want to teach someone a lesson or show off. Plenty of fights end on their own accord because we arent all savages.

Now. My entire point was stalling in guard should be a last ditch effort. Holding on and praying for intervention isnt proactive, its not a good game plan in any instance and I still believe that.

 

[Thaijitsu612]

I didnt say they end in deaths bud. You said 99% of street fights if someone is takendown there is someone there pulling them off. Its a made up statistic and its bull shit. Fights go to the ground and remain there at varying amounts of time. Bystander effects take place. Jumpings take plCe. People dont do much. But this is the grappling forum so its all or nothing right?

No, you said, in a real fight no one is telling him when to stop. In most cases that's not true. Others typically step in eventually.