Inquiry says Putin probably killed Alexander Litvinenko. Duh.

The testimony of Mario Scaramella gave me that idea. I don't have proof , but the evidence is in testimony that he admitted he had smuggled nuclear material before.

If folk havem't read the testimony of Scaramella then not much point debating the incident till everyone get's caught up.

Because selective media bias. It like how i see it with your Fox news vs CNN. If Trump still did nothing i bet those who dislike him will still claim should be impeached. Etc
 
"In an interview with The Independent shortly after the poisoning became public, Mr Scaramella said that Mr Litvinenko, a friend and professional contact since 2001, told him he had masterminded the smuggling of radioactive material to Zurich in 2000."

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/litvinenko-smuggled-nuclear-material-426266.html

We only have Scaramella's word this happened. There is no evidence Litvinenko was smuggling radioactive material. Also, Polonium is extremely toxic - 250,000 times more so than Cyanide - and difficult both to obtain and smuggle safely. Litvinenko was making a decent living as a journalist and author. He was a naturalised British citizen. You expect us to believe he would risk all that smuggling a substance so dangerous not only might it cause an agonising death, he almost certainly wouldn't have been able to find a buyer for it anyway?

You're a credit to the Troll Factory, comrade, but we're not buying what you are pushing;)
 
We only have Scaramella's word this happened. There is no evidence Litvinenko was smuggling radioactive material. Also, Polonium is extremely toxic - 250,000 times more so than Cyanide - and difficult both to obtain and smuggle safely. Litvinenko was making a decent living as a journalist and author. He was a naturalised British citizen. You expect us to believe he would risk all that smuggling a substance so dangerous not only might it cause an agonising death, he almost certainly wouldn't have been able to find a buyer for it anyway?

You're a credit to the Troll Factory, comrade, but we're not buying what you are pushing;)

Apart from radioactive trails on planes etc. Yeah Polonium is real toxic i know, how did it take the assassins 3 tries to dose him up right then?

You're not telling me anything I don't already know. You make asinine statements like "Troll Factory" so i don't have any expectations of you, other's might be interested. Why did he visit Boris Berezovsky?

You have no idea about the buying market for Polonium so why are you trying to make out "almost certainly wouldn't have been able to find a buyer". Yeah no one would want fissle material.

Remember as you're talking about smuggling even in the MSM scenario someone would have to obtain it and smuggle it anyway. So whatever your objections are for Alexander smuggling it they must be the same for the "assassins".

Now away up bread street and see if you can get a ride.
 
Sheep will just pretend there leaders arent capable of it. Unless they dislike that leader.


Yeah i bet most have not. The testimony and other stuff is odd. He could of been poisoned though i dont doubt state foreign security has eliminated people.

It's not the fact Putin murders political rivals that is a problem, it's the actual evidence in this case. It just doesn't square away for me. The enquiry had secret testimony etc.

Putin will have no problem murdering whoever he wants. Sending 3 attempts to poison by polonium doesn't quite add up to me.
 
Apart from radioactive trails on planes etc. Yeah Polonium is real toxic i know, how did it take the assassins 3 tries to dose him up right then?

You're not telling me anything I don't already know. You make asinine statements like "Troll Factory" so i don't have any expectations of you, other's might be interested. Why did he visit Boris Berezovsky?

You have no idea about the buying market for Polonium so why are you trying to make out "almost certainly wouldn't have been able to find a buyer". Yeah no one would want fissle material.

Remember as you're talking about smuggling even in the MSM scenario someone would have to obtain it and smuggle it anyway. So whatever your objections are for Alexander smuggling it they must be the same for the "assassins".

Now away up bread street and see if you can get a ride.

It's a damn sight easier to smuggle radioactive material when it's been authorised by the highest levels of the government who own the fucking stuff. One more time for the hard of thinking: Litvinenko was a journalist and author, not an arms dealer or smuggler. An exhaustive investigation and public inquiry found that he had been assassinated by Andre Logovi and Dmitry Kovton, on the express orders of Vlad Putin himself. The only people who disagree with that verdict are sucking Putin's dick so much they are making Donald Trump jealous.
 
It's a damn sight easier to smuggle radioactive material when it's been authorised by the highest levels of the government who own the fucking stuff. One more time for the hard of thinking: Litvinenko was a journalist and author, not an arms dealer or smuggler. An exhaustive investigation and public inquiry found that he had been assassinated by Andre Logovi and Dmitry Kovton, on the express orders of Vlad Putin himself. The only people who disagree with that verdict are sucking Putin's dick so much they are making Donald Trump jealous.

You're just being dogmatic. You're also misrepresenting the findings "express orders of Vlad Putin Himself".

The actual report says "Taking full account of all the evidence and analysis available to me, I find that the FSB operation to kill Litvinenko was probably approved by Mr Patrushev and also by President Putin,"

He was a journalist and author. Yet we read the from the inquiry "Possible motives were Mr Litvinenko's work for British intelligence agencies" Was he writing them books? Delivering newspapers to them?

So not only are you ignorant of the wording in the report you're so assiduously brandishing as 100% evidence. You then proceed to try and muddy the debate by saying folk are "sucking Putin's Dick" again giving us an insight into your reasoning skills.

The Enquiry was of limited scope and MI6 involvement was not allowed in the scope and the witneses are all called D! and shit like that.

No doubt you're a former pupil of Castlebrae Community High School or CraigRoyston.
 
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So no testimony reading yet, look for what he said Alexander said was his job (smuggling fissile material).

I'm not going to debate on the basis of wikipedia. I think believing the poisoning story is naive, he was leaking so much they had to change the story to he was poisoned thrice, third time lucky and all that(even though polonium is super toxic), Scotland Yard has never established how the assassins transported the polonium. the "assassins" themselves acted nothing like assassins leaving radioactive trails all over london,Boris Berezovsky office, Israel.

It's far too much to type out, we'll just go with he was poisoned then.


Lol dude you are the one going against the accepted public record and reason is "I read some transcripts from some dude (Which you haven't sourced) and until you read them there is no point in discussing it."

Why would you make the claim if you have no interest in backing it up?
 
Lol dude you are the one going against the accepted public record and reason is "I read some transcripts from some dude (Which you haven't sourced) and until you read them there is no point in discussing it."

Why would you make the claim if you have no interest in backing it up?
Because he's a paid Russian troll.
 
You think Russian Trolls Astroturf Sherdog? dunning-kruger springs to mind.

I know i'm going against a public Inquiry. I've actually read it in it's entirety. I find it unconvincing.

Your brilliant use of Occam's razor seems to think I must be a paid Russian Shill to think this, even though you haven't read the inquiry.

It's ludicrous. Scaramella said Alexander had smuggled fissle material before.

"
"Alongside several other versions behind this crime, we are seriously considering the possibility that Litvinenko's death could have been connected to the illegal trade in nuclear materials," a police official told the Berliner Zeitung newspaper.

German officials estimated the value of the polonium dose used to poison Litvinenko at $25 million.

Russian press outlets have speculated that Litvinenko, a vocal critic of Russian President Vladimir Putin, might have been aiding Chechen separatists in producing a radiological "dirty bomb."

"We know that there has been a demand for nuclear materials in terrorist circles for several years," the German police source said. "So we are carefully watching these circles now."

http://www.nti.org/gsn/article/polonium-poisoning-could-be-linked-to-nuclear-smuggling/
 
You're just being dogmatic. You're also misrepresenting the findings "express orders of Vlad Putin Himself".

The actual report says "Taking full account of all the evidence and analysis available to me, I find that the FSB operation to kill Litvinenko was probably approved by Mr Patrushev and also by President Putin,"

He was a journalist and author. Yet we read the from the inquiry "Possible motives were Mr Litvinenko's work for British intelligence agencies" Was he writing them books? Delivering newspapers to them?

So not only are you ignorant of the wording in the report you're so assiduously brandishing as 100% evidence. You then proceed to try and muddy the debate by saying folk are "sucking Putin's Dick" again giving us an insight into your reasoning skills.

The Enquiry was of limited scope and MI6 involvement was not allowed in the scope and the witneses are all called D! and shit like that.

No doubt you're a former pupil of Castlebrae Community High School or CraigRoyston.

Semantics. Two highly experienced FSB agents are not going to carry what amounted to an act of Nuclear Terrorism in a First World nation without it being approved at the very highest level.

Of course Litvinenko provided information to MI6. That was the price of being granted asylum and later citizenship. No doubt money also changed hands; as the joke goes, "Espionage is the second oldest profession, but lacks the morality of the oldest". However, Litvinenko's primary source of income was writing, both as a journalist and author.

Your insistence that Litvinenko somehow managed to irradiate himself flies in the face of all available evidence. One of the most damning pieces of which is the fact that German police found traces of Polonium on a couch in the Hamburg flat belonging to Dmitty Kovton's ex-wife. A couch that Kovtun slept on the night before he flew to London to meet with Litvinenko.
 
Semantics. Two highly experienced FSB agents are not going to carry what amounted to an act of Nuclear Terrorism in a First World nation without it being approved at the very highest level.

Of course Litvinenko provided information to MI6. That was the price of being granted asylum and later citizenship. No doubt money also changed hands; as the joke goes, "Espionage is the second oldest profession, but lacks the morality of the oldest". However, Litvinenko's primary source of income was writing, both as a journalist and author.

Your insistence that Litvinenko somehow managed to irradiate himself flies in the face of all available evidence. One of the most damning pieces of which is the fact that German police found traces of Polonium on a couch in the Hamburg flat belonging to Dmitty Kovton's ex-wife. A couch that Kovtun slept on the night before he flew to London to meet with Litvinenko.

Semantics you chose to play instead of just quoting the report you had to stretch it just to spice the argument up a bit, but anyway beside the point, but glad to see we've stopped the dick sucking talk and moved onto the case.

It's only damning if Kovtun was an assassin and not a smuggler also. (well even if he was an assassin he was a smuggler as well) or contaminated earlier.
 
Semantics you chose to play instead of just quoting the report you had to stretch it just to spice the argument up a bit, but anyway beside the point, but glad to see we've stopped the dick sucking talk and moved onto the case.

It's only damning if Kovtun was an assassin and not a smuggler also. (well even if he was an assassin he was a smuggler as well) or contaminated earlier.

Show me a single shred of solid evidence that either Litvinenko or Kovtun was involved in the smuggling of radioactive material. Just one. Please note that I specify solid evidence. An uncorroborated statement given to a journalist won't cut it. Just one piece of evidence that counters all the masses of evidence that Putin authorised two veteran FSB agents to murder a man he regarded as an enemy and traitor.

Take your time, tovarisch. I'll wait;)
 
Show me a single shred of solid evidence that either Litvinenko or Kovtun was involved in the smuggling of radioactive material. Just one. Please note that I specify solid evidence. An uncorroborated statement given to a journalist won't cut it. Just one piece of evidence that counters all the masses of evidence that Putin authorised two veteran FSB agents to murder a man he regarded as an enemy and traitor.

Take your time, tovarisch. I'll wait;)

What are the masses of evidence that Putin did it? You can't just dogmatically hide behind a public inquiry you haven't read.

Continual accusations of being a Russian Shill just discredit your argument. I could say you're a shill, then we get nowhere. An examination of the evidence is what we should be doing, not using semantics and smears.

You're just a dogmatic shill and till you evidence your claims i'll wait as well, quisling. See where does this get us?
 
What are the masses of evidence that Putin did it? You can't just dogmatically hide behind a public inquiry you haven't read.

Continual accusations of being a Russian Shill just discredit your argument. I could say you're a shill, then we get nowhere. An examination of the evidence is what we should be doing, not using semantics and smears.

You're just a dogmatic shill and till you evidence your claims i'll wait as well, quisling. See where does this get us?

- Of the three main players, Litvinenko was the only one to ingest Polonium. Lugovoy and Kovtun actually left a more significant trail of Polonium around London, which - along with the fact that neither of them died - indicates they handled the Polonium but did not ingest it.

- If Litvinenko ingested Polonium, then it was murder. Not an accident caused during the smuggling of radioactive material. Unless you are seriously suggesting he swallowed radioactive material to get it through customs:rolleyes:

- Detectives investigating the assassination eventually found three distinct radioactive trails. The first two were left by Lugovoy and Kovtun, during unsuccessful attempts to poison Litvinenko, who did not leave any trail on these two occasions. This means that Litvinenko only came into contact with Polonium on the third, successful, attempt to poison him with it.

This was a political assassination, planned and carried out by the FSB. Which by definition means that Putin was not only aware of it but approved. The FSB would not dare carry out such a potentially risky operation without Putin's blessing.

You cannot accuse me of being a shill, because I am simply stating what has been entered into legal record. The UK Government has stated they have evidence that Litvinenko was murdered by Lugovoy and Kovtun. Evidence strong enough for the British Government to start extradition proceedings, although this was of course denied by the Russian government.
 
- Of the three main players, Litvinenko was the only one to ingest Polonium. Lugovoy and Kovtun actually left a more significant trail of Polonium around London, which - along with the fact that neither of them died - indicates they handled the Polonium but did not ingest it.

- If Litvinenko ingested Polonium, then it was murder. Not an accident caused during the smuggling of radioactive material. Unless you are seriously suggesting he swallowed radioactive material to get it through customs:rolleyes:

- Detectives investigating the assassination eventually found three distinct radioactive trails. The first two were left by Lugovoy and Kovtun, during unsuccessful attempts to poison Litvinenko, who did not leave any trail on these two occasions. This means that Litvinenko only came into contact with Polonium on the third, successful, attempt to poison him with it.

This was a political assassination, planned and carried out by the FSB. Which by definition means that Putin was not only aware of it but approved. The FSB would not dare carry out such a potentially risky operation without Putin's blessing.

You cannot accuse me of being a shill, because I am simply stating what has been entered into legal record. The UK Government has stated they have evidence that Litvinenko was murdered by Lugovoy and Kovtun. Evidence strong enough for the British Government to start extradition proceedings, although this was of course denied by the Russian government.

Oh shit I hadn't realised the UK Government had stated it my bad. You realise how many "legal record" claims in the UK have no bearing with the Truth. Hillsborough, Iraq, Colin Wallace, Northern Ireland, Bloody Sunday, Lockerbie, Mcrone report, FCO30/1048 Can list them off for a fortnight. We bombed the shit out of Iraq on lies,but why would we start extradition over it.

The rest are statements not evidence your argument amounts to "the UK Government told me it was true", sorry Qiusling not compelling.

Accidental ingestion after the transportation device being unknowingly compromised is possible, that's why they could trail them all over the place, it was leaking. It's alpha radiation.

Also "Two highly experienced FSB agents" who take 3 attempts to poison their target? while leaving huge radioactive trails? That the SOP for assassination keep hovering about till you can get it in his tea, while Alexander just keeps meeting up with them.
 
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Oh shit I hadn't realised the UK Government had stated it my bad. You realise how many "legal record" claims in the UK have no bearing with the Truth. Hillsborough, Iraq, Colin Wallace, Northern Ireland, Bloody Sunday, Lockerbie, Mcrone report, FCO30/1048 Can list them off for a fortnight. We bombed the shit out of Iraq on lies,but why would we start extradition over it.

The rest are statements not evidence your argument amounts to "the UK Government told me it was true", sorry Qiusling not compelling.

Accidental ingestion after the transportation device being unknowingly compromised is possible,
that's why they could trail them all over the place, it was leaking. It's alpha radiation.

Also "Two highly experienced FSB agents" who take 3 attempts to poison their target? while leaving huge radioactive trails? That the SOP for assassination keep hovering about till you can get it in his tea, while Alexander just keeps meeting up with them.

It's possible I'll fuck Jennifer Lawrence tomorrow night. It's about as likely as the scenario you are suggesting, that Litvinenko somehow managed ingest a lethal radioactive substance by accident. Without knowing he had done so; Litvinenko had no idea he was suffering from radiation poisoning, and was unable to give doctors treating him any clues as to what was making him so ill.

There were three attempts to poison Litvinenko. In the first, the two FSB men slipped the Polonium into a cup of tea, but Litvinenko didn't drink it. On the second occasion, they aborted the attempt because there were too many CCTV cameras in the meeting place. Experts who investigated the assassination believe that the FSB agents themselves were not fully briefed on just how dangerous Polonium was, possibly to stop them from losing their nerve. The way they handled it, for example using an ordinary towel to clean up leaks from the container, was described as being, "idiotic verging on suicidal".

I'm well aware of the short-comings of my nation's politicians. Frankly, I wouldn't piss on most of them to put out the flames. But we are a Utopia compared to your Motherland. The Chechen Wars, the Russian Apartment Bombings, Beslan...where do you want me to stop? At least in the UK journalists can investigate and criticise our so-called leaders without being murdered for their troubles.

And what I have listed above is evidence from the British Government's own public enquiry. Evidence strong enough for the British Government to request the extradition of two senior FSB agents. Are you really so dense you think the British Government, some of the most pragmatic and, frankly, risk-averse politicians on earth would damage relations with Russia if they didn't have evidence so strong it meant they had no option but to act?

Seriously, kid, up your game or tap out. Because you are getting smashed into the mats here.
 
I'm well aware of the short-comings of my nation's politicians. Frankly, I wouldn't piss on most of them to put out the flames. But we are a Utopia compared to your Motherland. The Chechen Wars, the Russian Apartment Bombings, Beslan...where do you want me to stop? At least in the UK journalists can investigate and criticise our so-called leaders without being murdered for their troubles.


Seriously, kid, up your game or tap out. Because you are getting smashed into the mats here.

This is how deluded you are, I live in West Lothian. You're completely paranoid.



Joseph McCarthy's tweaked up Scottish nephew over here, wailing on about Russian sailors like he is Mickey Forrester. Jesus Christ lol.

 
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This is how deluded you are, I live in West Lothian. You're completely paranoid.



Joseph McCarthy's tweaked up Scottish nephew over here, wailing on about Russian sailors like he is Mickey Forrester. Jesus Christ lol.



I've passed on your details to MI5. I'm sure Police Scotland's Special Branch will be along shortly for a nice little chat;)

Joking aside, the only people who claim Litvinenko wasn't assassinated on the orders of Putin are either paid Russia Trolls, or what the Russians themselves refer to as, "useful idiots".

I guess we now know which one you are:rolleyes:
 
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