If you think Jones is GOAT, can you please explain to me why?

gondo said:
While he clearly destroyed Hamill being a dirty fighter cost him. He always fights dirty and it should called more often.
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Yep. I totally agree. My point in this particular context was only that Jones clearly destroyed Hammill, but I think Mazzagatti made the right call. Jones loves to play fast and loose with the rules and it finally cost him.
 
TS makes good points.

I think this is settled for now.

Cross it off the list.

Next.
 
He's a legendary eyepoker and knee wrecker. He is also one of the best to ever perfect the technique of hiding from drug testing under the octagon. He is the first fighter ever to get busted not only for peds but cocaine as well all while having testosterone levels of a 90 year old grandma. He is the greatest DUI driver in the history of combat sports. He is the only ever champion who ruined the card he headlined because he was too scared to fight Can Sonnen on short notice.

The list goes on and on. It's undeniable.

Jon Jones is GOAT.
 
IngaVovchanchyn said:
Yep. I totally agree. My point in this particular context was only that Jones clearly destroyed Hammill, but I think Mazzagatti made the right call. Jones loves to play fast and loose with the rules and it finally cost him.
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For a guy with great fight IQ those elbows were completely unnecessary at that point of the fight. I wonder how many fighters read all the rules of the octagon.
 
gondo said:
Shogun and rampage were while machida and rashad should've been MWs. I'll give him DC and Gus. Also sonnen and vitor are MWs.
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I mean, thats your opinion and i respect that. I think you are looking for ways to devalue his wins. Shogun was the champ and KOd Machida and Chuck. Rampage still had it. Shad was a HW on TUF and Machida was a LHW champ. Dont get upset but I assume you are a Pride guy and anyone that came over automatically was out of their prime.
 
^^Some other hater pick up after me please. I blew my wad on that post.
 
I watch. He's dismantled every opponent outside of Gus. That is the only fight that leaves any sort of a negative feeling on his abilities.
 
Mondo Freaks said:
I mean, thats your opinion and i respect that. I think you are looking for ways to devalue his wins. Shogun was the champ and KOd Machida and Chuck. Rampage still had it. Shad was a HW on TUF and Machida was a LHW champ. Dont get upset but I assume you are a Pride guy and anyone that came over automatically was out of their prime.
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I am a pride guy there's no denying it but it doesn't mean I'm blind to other great fighters from the UFC. Shogun being champ doesn't mean he was still in prime years his numerous surgeries may have made it hard to determine. Do you think Bisping is right now? A lot of fighters dropped multiple weight classes that came from early TUF. Of all the fighters I'd say shogun in his pride years would have been the biggest challenge for jones. You're right about the rest I'll concede that much but it doesn't change where they were when they fought him.
 
Jones has fought old men and middleweights (sometimes not even exclusively), and used dirty tactics to win fights. The only time he fought people his own age/size he was in close competitive fights (Gus and OSP). Plus he was roiding.
 
Mondo Freaks said:
I mean, thats your opinion and i respect that. I think you are looking for ways to devalue his wins. Shogun was the champ and KOd Machida and Chuck. Rampage still had it. Shad was a HW on TUF and Machida was a LHW champ. Dont get upset but I assume you are a Pride guy and anyone that came over automatically was out of their prime.
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Shad was a LHW champ too, which further supports your point.
 
Infamous GOAT losses
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gondo said:
I am a pride guy there's no denying it but it doesn't mean I'm blind to other great fighters from the UFC. Shogun being champ doesn't mean he was still in prime years his numerous surgeries may have made it hard to determine. Do you think Bisping is right now? A lot of fighters dropped multiple weight classes that came from early TUF. Of all the fighters I'd say shogun in his pride years would have been the biggest challenge for jones. You're right about the rest I'll concede that much but it doesn't change where they were when they fought him.
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I think Bisping is fucking crushing it right now and is at his peak. I thought he turned a corner in the Cung Le fight. So lets take the average of Rashad then: HW, LHW, and potentially MW (he has yet to fight at that division). The average is LHW. Even math supports my claim lol. The rest is speculative. A heathly Shogun in a ring would give Jon trouble. But in a cage, Bones throttles any version of Shogun.
 
Agree w/ TS. Jones has made a living fighting in a weight class below his natural weight and beating up on guys who were fighting up a weight class. Neither Anderson, GSP, nor Fedor ever lost a championship in their prime. To top it off, Jones has a loss against Hamil, so he has to avenge that before anything else. I'd say Jones is top 5 or just outside. He needs to move up to his natural HW and clean the division before true consideration.
 
Mondo Freaks said:
I think Bisping is fucking crushing it right now and is at his peak. I thought he turned a corner in the Cung Le fight. So lets take the average of Rashad then: HW, LHW, and potentially MW (he has yet to fight at that division). The average is LHW. Even math supports my claim lol. The rest is speculative. A heathly Shogun in a ring would give Jon trouble. But in a cage, Bones throttles any version of Shogun.
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Are there any fighters that you think are fighting in the wrong weight class that have been around for a long time? Bisping is doing great against the older fighters but how will he fair against the top guys at MW?
 
Imo the p4p goat list goes..

GSP
Jones
Anderson
Aldo
Fedor

If Jones gets his shit together I think he will pass GSP. He already has a case after beating 5 former UFC LHW champions in a row. I also believe he is the best pure talent this sport has ever seen.
 
No one in their right mind would consider a proven ped cheat goat. he aint even in the discussion. with reduced performance from a lack of peds he may not have been that great. gus and cormier would have beaten him. not goat status.
 
gondo said:
Are there any fighters that you think are fighting in the wrong weight class that have been around for a long time? Bisping is doing great against the older fighters but how will he fair against the top guys at MW?
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I feel like, the reason they were in that weightclass for so long is because they found success there which means it was the right weightclass all along and Shad did hold the LHW strap so its really hard for me to see that he didnt belong. I thought Luke was a top guy when Bisping finished him, but yea, Romero and Jacare will definitely give Bisping trouble.
 
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