If Cormier wasn't really a champion, were Barao, Dillashaw, or is Holloway?

[IBeLurkin]

No, he didn't. If he didn't defend the title for years, he wasn't the champion. You don't get to be the champion without defending the belt.
Especially since it would've been against Rumble and Gus.

That's great, and I agree.

Perfect circumstance for an interim champ.

And DC was a very good interim champ, until the real champ (Jones) came back.

 

[Deleted member 510653]

Barao was on an insane win streak, defended his interim, got rewarded for it and deserved to be champion

TJ basically ruined Barao twice, who many were saying was a p4p best. He was a rightful champion

Hollowway, yes as well. Beat Aldo fair and square, that's his belt.

 

[Dead Kennedy]

Should "Interim" be considered real champions or are their belts more of a place holder, so their guaranteed a "real" title fight?
If not, then these guys were never champions...

 

[Sapp]

That's great, and I agree.

Perfect circumstance for an interim champ.

And DC was a very good interim champ, until the real champ (Jones) came back.

You don't just keep the title until you're beaten if you step away from the action. A champion who doesn't defend regularly is a champion no longer.

Jon lost the title due to his own idiocy, and he reclaimed it by being the GOAT. However, inbetween he was not the champion.

 

[Bmurray]

Paper comes in varying thicknesses

 

[IBeLurkin]

You don't just keep the title until you're beaten if you step away from the action. A champion who doesn't defend regularly is a champion no longer.

Jon lost the title due to his own idiocy, and he reclaimed it by being the GOAT. However, inbetween he was not the champion.

He didn't "step away", he was forced to for out-of-cage reasons.

If you're going to say failing a test (which he only tested positive for possible masking agents btw And was given an abbreviated sentence because of it) means you aren't champ, you're travelling down a slippery slope when it comes to past champs and possible contenders.

While Jones was out (only 15 months), perfctly acceptable to have an interim champ.

And DC did a good job of that.

 

[Sapp]

He didn't "step away", he was forced to for out-of-cage reasons.

If you're going to say failing a test (which he only tested positive for possible masking agents btw And was given an abbreviated sentence because of it) means you aren't champ, you're travelling down a slippery slope when it comes to past champs and possible contenders.

While Jones was out (only 15 months), perfctly acceptable to have an interim champ.

And DC did a good job of that.

Jon lost the title due to the hit and run, the positive test (completely Jon's fault, even if we assume his story is true) prevented him from getting a shot at regaining it.

Your arbitrary definition of interim champion is the problem. If you're stripped of the title you aren't the champion anymore. It's clear as day. You're overcomplicating it.

 

[Why So Serious]

Nope. No one in the UFC is or was a real champion.

 

[Joker Jiujitsu]

You've NEVER seen there be only an interim champion?? Have you not been watching the FW and BW divisions in the last couple years?

Apparently you haven't been watching. The BW Champion was Dominick Cruz and Barao was the Interim Champ. The moment Cruz vacated the "real" title Barao was promoted to Champion, not just Interim Champ. Same thing happened with Aldo and McGregor. As soon as McGregor was forced to vacate the FW title, Aldo was no longer an interim champion. He was the actual champion. That's how it's always been. There will NEVER be an interim champion without another champ. Jones was NOT Champ when DC won the real UFC LHW Title. He had been stripped. DC was not the Interim anything.

Your first example of Barnett winning the title is hilarious, considering he tested positive for roids and was stripped of the title. OF FUCKING COURSE that meant he loses the belt and the contenders fight for it. No interim title necessary, lol.

You just contradicted yourself and nullified your whole argument. Replace "Barnett" with "Jones" and you have almost identically the same situation. Cormier and Rumble were those top contenders fighting over the actual title. You even point it out yourself here:

Jones was stripped of the title, until he could come back. DC won the fight they set up against the top contenders, and they gave him a belt for it.

I know you hate Jones, but that doesn't change reality.

I don't hate Jones, but that's not even relevant. That headkick on Cormier was sick. I've loved watching Jones since he debuted. I just wish he wouldn't have robbed us of 2-3 years of his prime with stupidity and immaturity.

 

[IBeLurkin]

Jon lost the title due to the hit and run, the positive test (completely Jon's fault, even if we assume his story is true) prevented him from getting a shot at regaining it.

Your arbitrary definition of interim champion is the problem. If you're stripped of the title you aren't the champion anymore. It's clear as day. You're overcomplicating it.

We can keep disagreeing on this, and that's fine.

But I honestly can't believe you think DC was ever the real champ. He clearly was never the best LHW in the world. And that's all that really matters.

 

[Ironman70.3]

Paper champs.

Over used word

 

[Fedor>Cain]

Over used word

They are the literal definition of paper champs. You are correct though, it is often used incorrectly.

Cormier was the champ because Jones did Coke. Jones was fighting once per year even with the suspensions. Fought in 2015 and beat Cormier, beat OSP in 2016, beat cormier in 2017. Cormier is the very definition of a paper champ.

Barao and TJ probably shouldn't be called paper champs since Dom was out for almost 3 years. That one, I don't get worked up about. There is absolutely no argument for Cormier being a real champ though lol.

 

[yeguiza]

cormier was a paper champ

barao and dillashaw would have destroyed injured cruz, who could not fight, so in that moment, they were just better

holloway is a true champ. not his fault that connor decided not to defend and abandon the division

 

[Dbreiden83080]

Jon changed his tune as the fight got closer and said DC was a good champion, who represented the belt well.

He was a champion because he had it for 2 1/2 years and has a couple of defenses. He just was never better than Jones..

 

[Joker Jiujitsu]

cormier was a paper champ

barao and dillashaw would have destroyed injured cruz, who could not fight, so in that moment, they were just better

holloway is a true champ. not his fault that connor decided not to defend and abandon the division

The Cruz that KO'd Mizugaki in 3 minutes and change would've been a handful for them.

 

[Venom]

Holloway is a paper champ.

So were Barao and Dillashaw.

Cruz had a good chance to beat either of them...

McGregor would easily starch Holloway.

 

[JT RIPPER]

A lot of people seem to believe that what Jon Jones said during the pre-fight hype, that "Daniel Cormier was never really Light Heavyweight Champion" is true, even though Jones has since gone back on these words himself and stayed DC is a true champion in every sense of the word.

To those who still insist Cormier was never the champ, what about Renan Barao? He never beat Cruz for the title. He was interim champion, and Cruz was forced to vacate due to injury, but he came back and won fights while Barao lost his "title".

What about Dillashaw? He beat Barao, but if he was never champion, then Dillashaw lost his shot at being the "real" champ when he lost via decision to Cruz.

And that leads us to Max Holloway, who never beat the "real" Featherweight Champ, Conor McGregor (in fact, he has a loss to him) and only beat someone who Conor beat for the belt.

If Brock wouldn't have beaten Mir in the rematch, was he still the UFC HW Champ? Is anyone after Frank Shamrock vacated the LHW title really a champion? Or when BJ vacated the Welterweight Title until GSP or Hughes beat him? Was Robbie Lawler the WW Champ since GSP retired and he only beat the guy GSP already beat?

In that case, was Conor really the champ if he didn't rematch Aldo? Seems to be the case a lot lately, instant rematch proves you're the champ by beating the former champ twice

 

[HIMBOB]

Yeah I'm just saying I don't know, maybe Barao wasn't a real champion but the rest were. They just couldn't beat the best guy in the division.

Cruz fought once in 4.5 years. No one could face him.

 

[emax]

If you're champ because the guy who had it last chooses not to defend, whether it be due to leaving for biggest prize fight possible or because the make a series of dumbest decisions humanly possible for a pro athlete, regardless they're the legit champs for that time. Until Bisping faces Whittaker for the true MW title, I count Whittaker as a legit champ too.

 

[csroster]

Are you high? DC lost to Jones before getting the title. Jones lost the title for reasons outside of losing any fight and was widely considered not only the legit #1 LHW, but #1 P4P contender, LHW goat, and all time time GOAT contender.

It has more do with the resume of the guy that beat DC than anything DC did to get the belt relative to the other examples.