How popular was prime Van Damme REALLY?

[wildchild88]

Van Damme was cool in Kickboxer, Bloodsport and Hard Target..

But Arnold and Stallone were levels above him..

Van Damme could never carry a role like Terminator or Dutch three way that Arnie could..

 

[Turtlejuice]

low budget commercial movies is what you said

Just cause he was lower than Arnold doesn't mean he was B level.

10 million budget is a low budget for an action film. Even in them days.

A typical JCVD action film attracted the same budget as a film about Arnie walking around talking to a fat guy. And the latter drew significantly more.

JCVD was B-List in his prime.

 

[the ambush]

10 million budget is a low budget for an action film. Even in them days.

A typical JCVD action film attracted the same budget as a film about Arnie walking around talking to a fat guy. And the latter drew significantly more.

JCVD was B-List in his prime.

He was never B-level at his peak. This thread has turned into a podium for Turtlejuice to voice his opinion though. I am just sitting back in disarray.

SMH

 

[Turtlejuice]

He was never B-level at his peak. This thread has turned into a podium for Turtlejuice to voice his opinion though. I am just sitting back in disarray.

SMH

It's that not what discussion boards were made for? For people to discuss their thoughts?

 

[Mike]

10 million budget is a low budget for an action film. Even in them days.

A typical JCVD action film attracted the same budget as a film about Arnie walking around talking to a fat guy. And the latter drew significantly more.

JCVD was B-List in his prime.

Eh he might not have reached the absolute peak like Arnie and Sly, but I don't think B level is right. Maybe now, but not in his prime. The man was pretty well known in the 90s.


It's just that a lot of guys look B level in comparison to Arnold and Stallone, since they were such enormous stars.

 

[Turtlejuice]

Eh he might not have reached the absolute peak like Arnie and Sly, but I don't think B level is right. Maybe now, but not in his prime. The man was pretty well known in the 90s.


It's just that a lot of guys look B level in comparison to Arnold and Stallone, since they were such enormous stars.

I could see an argument for him being bottom of the A list but that's not really all that different from being top of the B list.

When execs were in their initial meetings discussing who they could get in to lead their $60million budget action film, nobody in that room was thinking JCVD.

 

[Mike]

I could see an argument for him being bottom of the A list but that's not really all that different from being top of the B list.

When execs were in their initial meetings discussing who they could get in to lead their $60million budget action film, nobody in that room was thinking JCVD.

Well I think it depends a lot on what we're considering B-list. I think some people hear that term and think B movie, but they're different things. I think that's why some JCVD fans feel offended, the guy shouldn't be put on the level of say Michael Jai White, Cung Le, Stone Cold in his "acting" career, etc. In his prime he was a household name, and most of his movies were in theaters, not straight to video. Even among A listers there re levels.


For example someone like say Wesley Snipes was a legit A lister for awhile, but he was nowhere near Arnold or Stallone even in his prime. But through the 90s most people would know who Snipes was, if you asked. That's an A-lister to me, someone that's a household name at a national level.

 

[BisexualMMA]

Arnold / Stallone
Mel Gibson
Bruce Willis

JCVD
Wesley Snipes
Steven Seagal

Danny Glover
Peter Weller




Thomas Ian Griffith
Jeff Speakman

Lorenzo Lamas
Michael Dudikoff









Neil Breen

 

[Turtlejuice]

Well I think it depends a lot on what we're considering B-list. I think some people hear that term and think B movie, but they're different things. I think that's why some JCVD fans feel offended, the guy shouldn't be put on the level of say Michael Jai White, Cung Le, Stone Cold in his "acting" career, etc. In his prime he was a household name, and most of his movies were in theaters, not straight to video. Even among A listers there re levels.


For example someone like say Wesley Snipes was a legit A lister for awhile, but he was nowhere near Arnold or Stallone even in his prime. But through the 90s most people would know who Snipes was, if you asked. That's an A-lister to me, someone that's a household name at a national level.

I think people have a misconception of what a B movie actually is. A lot of people see B movie and think its some sort of derogatory term. Same with B list for that matter.

Wesley Smiles is a good example of someone who was at the top of the B list. He did sneak into the A list for a while around the mid to late 90s/early 00s. I don't think JCVD ever reached the level that Snipes did. But then I think JCVD was higher on average, just didn't peak as high.

 

[Mike]

I think people have a misconception of what a B movie actually is. A lot of people see B movie and think its some sort of derogatory term. Same with B list for that matter.

Wesley Smiles is a good example of someone who was at the top of the B list. He did sneak into the A list for a while around the mid to late 90s/early 00s. I don't think JCVD ever reached the level that Snipes did. But then I think JCVD was higher on average, just didn't peak as high.

I think people think of B level as straight to video schlock, instead of say a movie with a $40 million dollar budget versus $100 million. I believe the argument is at that point you're a bonafide star and not B level anymore. During his hayday JCVD was known nationwide, whereas B level actors only reach that notoriety if they're in a movie that turns into a cult classic.


Bruce Campbell is more of what I think of when I think of a high level B actor. Or even someone like Michael Biehn or Sean Bean, that gets roles in huge films but is never the star.

 

[D Train]

He made some poor contract choices and when his popularity grew and he would have had a chance at bigger films, he was still shackled to low budget operations who cashed in on his name with crappy films. But I love Cyborg.

 

[D Train]

Or even someone like Michael Biehn or Sean Bean, that gets roles in huge films but is never the star.

Nah, those guys are very solid supporting actors who work on high profile projects.

 

[Turtlejuice]

I think people think of B level as straight to video schlock, instead of say a movie with a $40 million dollar budget versus $100 million. I believe the argument is at that point you're a bonafide star and not B level anymore. During his hayday JCVD was known nationwide, whereas B level actors only reach that notoriety if they're in a movie that turns into a cult classic.


Bruce Campbell is more of what I think of when I think of a high level B actor. Or even someone like Michael Biehn or Sean Bean, that gets roles in huge films but is never the star.

I think our opinions are fairly similar. Maybe you round up a little and I round down.

The way I look at A list and B list is not dissimilar to yours. I just think someone has to consistently hit them big budget movies, where JVCD only had a couple, maybe 3 or 4,
when he was at his peak.

 

[Mike]

Nah, those guys are very solid supporting actors who work on high profile projects.

I agree, was just saying I've heard them described that way. Just to point out there are lots of opinions on what constitutes A level or B level. Hell one time we had a "entertainers that failed to live up to their potential" thread and someone mentioned Jamie foxx. You mean the guy that had a successful tv, music, and movie career?

I think our opinions are fairly similar. Maybe you round up a little and I round down.

The way I look at A list and B list is not dissimilar to yours. I just think someone has to consistently hit them big budget movies, where JVCD only had a couple, maybe 3 or 4,
when he was at his peak.

Yeah I guess I just see breaking into the mainstream as more of an accomplishment. Being in the top 1% of your profession is a big accomplishment. Earlier itt Shadow mentioned Arnold was "only" on top for a decade. But being a huge star in the public consciousness that long is super impressive. I guess to me guys like JCVD or Snipes are in that 1% just for being so well known so long, whereas guys like Arnold and Sly are in the top .01%

 

[Mike]

Arnold / Stallone
Mel Gibson
Bruce Willis

JCVD
Wesley Snipes
Steven Seagal

Danny Glover
Peter Weller




Thomas Ian Griffith
Jeff Speakman

Lorenzo Lamas
Michael Dudikoff









Neil Breen

This is actually pretty much exactly how I have it. Especially JCVD/Snipes/Seagull

 

[Jumpy]

I bet Weinstein never tried any funny business with Van Damme, thats for sure

 

[Guestx]

Wesley Smiles is a good example of someone who was at the top of the B list. He did sneak into the A list for a while around the mid to late 90s/early 00s. I don't think JCVD ever reached the level that Snipes did. But then I think JCVD was higher on average, just didn't peak as high.

That's weird to think. I never gave even half-a-shit about Snipes compared to Van Damme and I've never considered him to be anything as close to as influential an action star either, but when I think back about it I guess for a time he was more of a mainstream success.

 

[Turtlejuice]

That's weird to think. I never gave even half-a-shit about Snipes compared to Van Damme and I've never considered him to be anything as close to as influential an action star either, but when I think back about it I guess for a time he was more of a mainstream success.

Yeah VD was at a higher level overall, but somewhere between Demolition Man and Blade, Snipes' stock rocketed for a period of time, before it came tumbling back down.

 

[Guestx]

Yeah VD was at a higher level overall, but somewhere between Demolition Man and Blade, Snipes' stock rocketed for a period of time, before it came tumbling back down.

It's funny how fucking fickle the public always is.

It's like: We love you! We love you! We love you! . . . Ohhhhkay, now we're bored with you.

It's the weakest kind of love. These hoes ain't loyal.

 

[Turtlejuice]

I agree, was just saying I've heard them described that way. Just to point out there are lots of opinions on what constitutes A level or B level. Hell one time we had a "entertainers that failed to live up to their potential" thread and someone mentioned Jamie foxx. You mean the guy that had a successful tv, music, and movie career?






Yeah I guess I just see breaking into the mainstream as more of an accomplishment. Being in the top 1% of your profession is a big accomplishment. Earlier itt Shadow mentioned Arnold was "only" on top for a decade. But being a huge star in the public consciousness that long is super impressive. I guess to me guys like JCVD or Snipes are in that 1% just for being so well known so long, whereas guys like Arnold and Sly are in the top .01%

I see what you're saying. It's kind of like when someone's says a rank 15 fighter isn't elite. On one hand, he's the 15th best fighter in the world, how can he not be elite, but you don't really compare them to the rest of the world.

I usually compare them to their peers. 95%+ of the people that are not the top 1% are people that a huge majority wouldn't even recognise, or have seen in anything.