How do I deal with someone who punches non-stop?

[j123]

is there no clinching in kyokushin? why not just clinch him up and knee/sweep/elbow etc.

I don't think so. Quick google seach led to this

TSUKAMI (grappling). (For whatever reason, to grapple the opponent’s dogi is not allowed, neither to clinch hands with each other.)

http://www.sokyokushin.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/KyokushinCup2015UK.pdf

 

[AndyMaBobs]

I don't think so. Quick google seach led to this


http://www.sokyokushin.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/KyokushinCup2015UK.pdf

Also worth mentioning that because it's very short bare knuckle body punches, clinching won't do an awful lot of good anyway

 

[j123]

Also worth mentioning that because it's very short bare knuckle body punches, clinching won't do an awful lot of good anyway

I dunno, even in MMA against guys who don't know how to "thai" clinch I wreck them, and compared to a Thai I;m nothing, so the damage they can do is colossal. We're talking about guys who's plan is to block knees with arms or 1 arm extend to prevent my knee from hitting. Elbow city

 

[ARIZE]

Clinching and elbows to the head are not allowed as far as i know. So from my MT experience i would use teeps to the face and hips, and piercing knees. So i ask again, if there is a reason not to?

 

[shincheckin]

Also worth mentioning that because it's very short bare knuckle body punches, clinching won't do an awful lot of good anyway

I would disagree with this. punching someone in the clinch is not very effective. The knee is the most powerful move possible. Its the largest knuckle, with the largest muscle.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

I would disagree with this. punching someone in the clinch is not very effective. The knee is the most powerful move possible. Its the largest knuckle, with the largest muscle.

Have you ever been punched bare knuckle in the floating rib? If you look at how close kyokushin guys actually fight you'll get why I say that. When you get into off shoots like Ashihara, where there is more grappling, they still body punch their way out of clinches.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Clinching and elbows to the head are not allowed as far as i know. So from my MT experience i would use teeps to the face and hips, and piercing knees. So i ask again, if there is a reason not to?

As far as I know there shouldn't be, I see kyokushin guys throw knees quite a lot

 

[YourOnlineHero]

Spinning ushiro/hook kick with the heel.

(Assuming you're right handed). Start southpaw with longer stance than usual. Take a big step back into orthodox and spring your now back foot straight into the spinning ushiro to the head.

Just spam it. When he adjusts, just alternate between doing that and springing the back food into a regular roundhouse kick to the body.

 

[Tayski]

2:08 muay thai style

Please don't try to attribute Garry O'Neil's kicks to Muay Thai lol.

You might also like this KO at 1:59 then:

is there no clinching in kyokushin? why not just clinch him up and knee/sweep/elbow etc.

There used to be clinching back in the day, I believe they removed it from the allowed techniques as the bigger taller westerners would clinch and knee the smaller Japanese guys. From memory Dolph Lundgren for example would often grab the head of his smaller opponents and knee them. When he fought in the open weight world tournament in 1979 he won his first 2 fights by KO by grabbing the head of his opponent + knee.

I found a little clip here (not against a Japanese fighter though):



But yeah in Kyokushin Knockdown rules clinching or grabbing isn't allowed.

In some other organisations and styles they do allow grabbing, clinching and throws though.

For instance in Ashihara as you can see in this fight:



or even in Shidokan:

Clinching and elbows to the head are not allowed as far as i know. So from my MT experience i would use teeps to the face and hips, and piercing knees. So i ask again, if there is a reason not to?

There is no reason not to and that's what I advised him in my post, he can use push kicks / mae geri's to keep his opponent at bay. Knees are fine too but if he's in range for knees his opponent might already be too close to him.

 

[shincheckin]

Please don't try to attribute Garry O'Neil's kicks to Muay Thai lol.

You might also like this KO at 1:59 then:





There used to be clinching back in the day, I believe they removed it from the allowed techniques as the bigger taller westerners would clinch and knee the smaller Japanese guys. From memory Dolph Lundgren for example would often grab the head of his smaller opponents and knee them. When he fought in the open weight world tournament in 1979 he won his first 2 fights by KO by grabbing the head of his opponent + knee.

I found a little clip here (not against a Japanese fighter though):



But yeah in Kyokushin Knockdown rules clinching or grabbing isn't allowed.

In some other organisations and styles they do allow grabbing, clinching and throws though.

For instance in Ashihara as you can see in this fight:



or even in Shidokan:





There is no reason not to and that's what I advised him in my post, he can use push kicks / mae geri's to keep his opponent at bay. Knees are fine too but if he's in range for knees his opponent might already be too close to him.

alot of muay thai guys dont want to give kyokushin credit but its really good stuff IMO.

 

[ARIZE]

Knees are fine too but if he's in range for knees his opponent might already be too close to him.

I agree, but i still find it's a good option against pressure puncher once they got inside. Obviously you want to avoid that scenario (with teep/mae geri for example) but once they close the distance, you still need to deal with it.
In MT, my primary weapons would be clinch and elbows, but if that's not an option, piercing knee would be next.
A defensive back kick could also be useful, if it's something you guys train...

 

[j123]

There used to be clinching back in the day, I believe they removed it from the allowed techniques as the bigger taller westerners would clinch and knee the smaller Japanese guys. From memory Dolph Lundgren for example would often grab the head of his smaller opponents and knee them. When he fought in the open weight world tournament in 1979 he won his first 2 fights by KO by grabbing the head of his opponent + knee.

I thought that happened in K1, didn't know it happened back in KK also

 

[magicmarker]

If you try to maintain distance you have to be able to move back while leaning forward, if you lean back and move back you can't maintain distance for long imo. If you're leaning forward or towards the opponent you can always step into the pocket when you feel the time is right. If you're leaning back away from him you can't get in the pocket when you a golden opportunity presents itself to step in, land shots, and step out.

 

[Ilk]

Side steps? Side step and hook, side step and kick. I do go side step to left, trow low kick, add a hook body, upper cut body, keep on moving to left via pivot or side stepping. Basically he comes forward your circle him while trowing a 3 hit combo.

I dont know Karate, but you can take some angling examples of insight fighting in boxing.

 

[Azam]

I would disagree with this. punching someone in the clinch is not very effective. The knee is the most powerful move possible. Its the largest knuckle, with the largest muscle.

Punching in clinching range is very effective if you know what you're doing - especially if it's bare knuckle punches or small 4oz gloves. It wouldn't be as effective in muay thai though or even kickboxing. Body shots really come into their own with less ounce padding on your gloves - you really feel the dig. But if you already in a clinch I wouldn't advise throwing punches.

The knee is definitely one of the most powerful moves possible but you shouldn't under-estimate a nice hook to the liver or floating rib. I've seen soo many guys go down in kyokushin sparring from hooks to those areas while in clinching range.

Honestly though if someone had me in a clinch - I wouldn't be looking to trade shots but make sure my posture isn't compromised and immediately be looking to hip throw or foot sweep - or even wait for them to bring up that knee & sweep.

 

[shincheckin]

Punching in clinching range is very effective if you know what you're doing - especially if it's bare knuckle punches or small 4oz gloves. It wouldn't be as effective in muay thai though or even kickboxing. Body shots really come into their own with less ounce padding on your gloves - you really feel the dig. But if you already in a clinch I wouldn't advise throwing punches.

The knee is definitely one of the most powerful moves possible but you shouldn't under-estimate a nice hook to the liver or floating rib. I've seen soo many guys go down in kyokushin sparring from hooks to those areas while in clinching range.

Honestly though if someone had me in a clinch - I wouldn't be looking to trade shots but make sure my posture isn't compromised and immediately be looking to hip throw or foot sweep - or even wait for them to bring up that knee & sweep.

yeah i agree, so many guys focus on head hunting and forget about going to the body. a tuff guy will take a shot to the face. a tuff guy will go down with a good body shot. that being said, the knee is a better body shot than the punch. I will gladly take a body punch while clinching to throw a knee. also if your clinched, your not in proper position to throw a good body punch. I have had guys try to punch me in the body while clinching, its pretty much laughable taps then comes the big knee. Also, guys that try to double forearm block a knee, good luck, if you know how to knee properly, its powerful enough to smash straight through it.

 

[shincheckin]

Have you ever been punched bare knuckle in the floating rib? If you look at how close kyokushin guys actually fight you'll get why I say that. When you get into off shoots like Ashihara, where there is more grappling, they still body punch their way out of clinches.

body punching is effective, but not when someone has a 2 hand clinch on your head. your out of position to throw punches properly. anderson silva vs rich franklin is a perfect example of someone trying to punch their way out of a clinch. generally speaking, most guys that punch in the clinch dont know how to clinch. when clinched your better off to knee/elbow/sweep or takedown if its mma

 

[j123]

I have had guys try to punch me in the body while clinching, its pretty much laughable taps then comes the big knee. Also, guys that try to double forearm block a knee, good luck, if you know how to knee properly, its powerful enough to smash straight through it.

That is a dream scenario that happens more often than it should

 

[shincheckin]

That is a dream scenario that happens more often than it should

I remember seeing rich franklin get dropped by silva, I was amazed to see a pro in the UFC not know how to clinch.

 

[ARIZE]

Also, guys that try to double forearm block a knee, good luck, if you know how to knee properly, its powerful enough to smash straight through it.

I love those guys... Usually they have learned "MT for MMA" and are over confident. They think they know how to deal with the clinch, and a lot of times try to "correct" your technique with a condescending attitude...
Until the sparring. Then, they understand why the double forearm block is not an option against the knee, neither ducking under to escape the clinch, neither popping up straight up, when elbows are waiting...

@Azam

For the clinch, i think you forget the elbows to the face in MT. If your hands are occupied with body shoots, that means they are not protecting the face. Thats why we prefer to knee the body while clinching... We don't give an opening to the face, and we still control the opponents head.
So it's not just about gloves vs bare knuckles, even tho that's also an important reason.
Of course for your rule set, it make a lot of cense... But not so much in MT...