Hagler vs Leonard, 30 years ago today

[DannyNL]

To this day this is a very controversial fight. Some think Leonard won, some think Hagler was robbed, and some even had it a 6-6 draw (like me). But SRL got the nod, and the magnitude of this win should not be diminished.

Ray came back from a 3-year retirement and, without even a tune-up fight, jumped 2 weight classes and took on possibly the greatest, scariest middleweight of all time. Southpaw with a right jab that more resembled a straight right, 52 KOs in 62 wins and with one of the greatest chins in boxing history. Marvin was a legit monster and Leonard stepped up to the plate and came away with the W.

One of the many reasons why Leonard will always be look at as one of the greatest of all time.

 

[Seano]

eh, Leonard won. He took too many of the early rounds for Hagler to catch up.

 

[burningspear]

THE Superfight of my lifetime, cemented Ray as ATG. Floyd coming out of retirement to face McGregor lol.

 

[Buddy Revell]

I'm more of a Hagler fan but i think Sugar Ray edged it out. He flat out caught Hagler without a plan B.

But anyway, i actually hate this fight. This fight, more than anyother bout in the last 30 years, is responsible for the proliferation of shitty safety first title fights and superfights.

It spawned a few generations of trainers and boxers who saw SRL run, shoo shine, and basically hustle his way to that win, and have followed suit.

At least Leonard was an honest to goodness warrior when he could manage it, and i know his eye was a real concern, so he'll always get a pass from me. But his imitators don't.

Full circle: I totally think Hagler would have won a rematch.

 

[Mr Mojo Lane]

Hagler gave up too many of the early rounds. I think he was trying to prove that he had more skills than Leonard. SRL's showmanship is what won the fight for him.

 

[Sir Punchalot]

Hagler should be blaming himself for that loss, not anyone else.

 

[Buddy Revell]

Hagler gave up too many of the early rounds. I think he was trying to prove that he had more skills than Leonard. SRL's showmanship is what won the fight for him.

Judges are people too, and like everybody they like a good human interest story. Someone, something, too root for. That and Leonard's style made for great theater. He "won the event", as they say.

 

[wilddeuces]

To this day this is a very controversial fight. Some think Leonard won, some think Hagler was robbed, and some even had it a 6-6 draw (like me). But SRL got the nod, and the magnitude of this win should not be diminished.

Ray came back from a 3-year retirement and, without even a tune-up fight, jumped 2 weight classes and took on possibly the greatest, scariest middleweight of all time. Southpaw with a right jab that more resembled a straight right, 52 KOs in 62 wins and with one of the greatest chins in boxing history. Marvin was a legit monster and Leonard stepped up to the plate and came away with the W.

One of the many reasons why Leonard will always be look at as one of the greatest of all time.

"without even a tune-up fight" is only true in the sense that they were not sanctioned bouts, but the reality was the Ray had put himself through several unofficial fights, reffed, glove size, everything against guys that would be as close to a facsimile of Marvin as possible. He only took the Hagler fight because he got through those grueling exhibition bouts, but it should be understood that those were, in effect, his "tune up" bouts.

Also, he admitted to pondering the fight after watching how slow and aged Hagler looked against Mugabi. Most of us might not notice (I'd have to rewatch too), but even the slightest variance from what is their peak efficiency throws off a lot of things for a fighter (timing, control of range, stamina, etc.). He took the fight, fought three times after Hagler fought Mugabi, whereas Hagler didn't fight once and then overtrained for the Leonard fight (something that was stupid, on his part and entirely his fault).

Still a win, still an ATG.

 

[Confucamus]

Hagler is my all time favorite fighter. I met him twice and got to tell him that the world knows he beat Ray Leonard. Big moment in my life.

Reality is, I've actually sat down three different times and scored that fight. First time I had Hagler winning. The two times after that I had Ray Leonard winning. Tough fight to score, setting favoritism aside and using the correct judging criteria. I think Hagler would've lost a rematch more clearly too. Ray had the formula, and Hagler had too many wars at that time. He looked slow as fuck in their first fight.

 

[XThe GreatestX]

eh, Leonard won. He took too many of the early rounds for Hagler to catch up.

I agree. Leonard made hagler look kinda bad tbh. He looked soooooo slow in this fight

 

[Gregoire1]

I'm more of a Hagler fan but i think Sugar Ray edged it out. He flat out caught Hagler without a plan B.

But anyway, i actually hate this fight. This fight, more than anyother bout in the last 30 years, is responsible for the proliferation of shitty safety first title fights and superfights.

It spawned a few generations of trainers and boxers who saw SRL run, shoo shine, and basically hustle his way to that win, and have followed suit.

At least Leonard was an honest to goodness warrior when he could manage it, and i know his eye was a real concern, so he'll always get a pass from me. But his imitators don't.

Full circle: I totally think Hagler would have won a rematch.

And what about peak vs peak?

 

[Buddy Revell]

And what about peak vs peak?

I dont know. Its pure fantasy as they were seperated by 2 weightclasses and their primes were, i think, at least 5 years apart.

Conventional wisdom says a good bigman beats a good little man, so slight edge to Hagler, the naturally bigger man. But Leonard was anything but conventional so...

 

[Mr Mojo Lane]

SRL was two years younger. Hagler had a little bit more mileage than an Olympic turned pro. I think Hagler could have won , if he hadn't tried to outbox SRL.

 

[Diamond Jim]

The Legendary Nights on this fight is pretty damn good.

 

[Seano]

SRL was two years younger. Hagler had a little bit more mileage than an Olympic pro. I think Hagler could have won that not, if he hadn't tried to outbox SRL.

Shouldn't have came out orthodox. Leonard himself said that had a lot to do with Hagler losing the early rounds.

 

[Hagler]

The one sure thing about how this fight should be scored is that the 118-110 guy had no business judging professional boxing.

The last few times I watched it, I scored it a draw or Leonard by 1 with an even round (can't remember which one).

A huge win for Leonard anyway.

 

[randomg1t]

i thought leonard won it pretty clearly, to be honest. yeah, he was backing up the whole fight, but he made hagler miss all night and he was landing some really sharp shots on him. that body head combo with the left was a thing of beauty, and he just kept digging it in.

what were those two guys' chins made of, btw? diamonds? marvin got hit with some bullets and didn't even flinch, and he landed some bombs on leonard, who took them like they were nothing. incredible durability shown by both guys.

 

[DannyNL]

I often wonder how this would have turned out if

A) Hagler didn't come out orthodox for the first few rounds.
B) Hagler didn't agree to a 12 rounder and it was 15 rounds instead.

 

[Seano]

The one sure thing about how this fight should be scored is that the 118-110 guy had no business judging professional boxing.

The last few times I watched it, I scored it a draw or Leonard by 1 with an even round (can't remember which one).

A huge win for Leonard anyway.

If I remember correctly, that judge wasn't even supposed to be one of the judges that night. The story was , the original judge was british and because of Haglers experiences with that part of the world, he requested a different judge. The judge who scored it 118-110 was the one that replaced the judge Hagler complained about.

 

[Hagler]

That's pretty much what I had in mind. Another bad decision by Hagler's people, after giving away the choice of gloves and ring size for the bigger purse. I think the 118-110 guy never judged an elite fight again. I also read that the British ref that stayed home that night said later he scored the fight for Hagler. How ironic.