For $1,000,000.00, why wouldn't UFC fighters leave en masse for the PFL?

[Danespina]

WSOF/PFL was not and is not owned by the UFC, nor is there any such concept under the law as "basically owning" something. Furthermore, the WSOF didn't act like a farm league for the UFC. As a matter of fact for all five years of its existence, very few fighters came over from WSOF to the UFC. There are other MMA promotions that have served as de facto feeder leagues in recent years, most notably the RFA & LFC who merged to create the LFA which does indeed send a lot of fighters to the UFC and even licenses the Octagon trademark for it's cage.

True. Only when WSOF took a hiatus to transform into PFL did their champions start coming to the UFC.

I'm seeing Moraes got paid $180,000 in his last WSOF fight which is very good, and more than his UFC debut.

 

[Limit Smasher]

WSOF/PFL was not and is not owned by the UFC, nor is there any such concept under the law as "basically owning" something. Furthermore, the WSOF didn't act like a farm league for the UFC. As a matter of fact for all five years of its existence, relatively few fighters came over from WSOF to the UFC, such as high profile champions like Justin Gaethje and Marlon Moraes, and only after a long stint that ended as the first iteration of the WSOF was wrapping up. There are other MMA promotions that have served as de facto feeder leagues in recent years, most notably the RFA & LFC who merged to create the LFA which does indeed send a lot of fighters to the UFC and even licenses the Octagon trademark for it's cage.

Keep telling yourself that, noob.

WSOF is and always has been under direct control by the UFC. It's a feeder league they can poach talent from. They also send over guys with name value who didn't do so well in the UFC as a way to keep them out of Bellator.

If you can't see this then I'm sorry, but you're a fucking idiot.

 

[null]

Keep telling yourself that, noob.

WSOF is and always has been under direct control by the UFC. It's a feeder league they can poach talent from. They also send over guys with name value who didn't do so well in the UFC as a way to keep them out of Bellator.

If you can't see this then I'm sorry, but you're a fucking idiot.

You must really be embarrassed to make such inaccurate statements and then double down when you were dressed down with the facts and shown for the clown that you are.

 

[Limit Smasher]

You must really be embarrassed to make such inaccurate statements and then double down when you were dressed down with the facts and shown for the clown that you are.

What facts?

 

[skylolow]

The key is if they can keep this going and that is why low/mid level guys aren't going to exit the UFC in masses. Plus the ceiling is much higher in the UFC and believe it or not mid level guys can make good money in the UFC.

When Ariel asked them point blank how they going to make money on this format they beat around that bush pretty good. They basically said the investors are all expecting to lose money but hopefully will lead to greener pastures down the road. As usual after the first year or two they'll see very quickly that the hill is probably to steep to climb to ever see a payout and will abandon funding.

The only way this is sustainable on any level is if NBC is paying them at least 10 million a year for the product and they aren't right now. But if they can get some traction I could see someone or even NBC paying out a yearly fee of around 10 to 20 million to broadcast it. It's cheap live sports programming and a lot of hours over the course of the year it can fill for a network. I will give them this, its a interesting take on the sport of MMA that really hasn't been tried. Personally, I thought the first show came off well. I do think though they'd be better off delaying it by a few hours and pick and choose the fights they air to make it very exciting show for fans watching on TV.

 

[null]

What facts?

The fact that you just made up a lie that the UFC owned WSOF or owns PFL without providing any evidence of the assertion. In fact, their ownership is known with a group of well known investors being the new money into PFL. And the fact that you also clearly don't know what a farm league is considering that the list of fighters that came through the WSOF and who then went to the UFC is insignificant other than a few high profile fighters whose contracts ran out while the list of fighters that came from LFC & RFA as well as the LFA now is huge since those promotions could indeed be considered a farm league unlike WSOF or PFL.

 

[Limit Smasher]

The fact that you just made up a lie that the UFC owned WSOF or owns PFL without providing any evidence of the assertion. In fact, their ownership is known with a group of well known investors being the new money into PFL. And the fact that you also clearly don't know what a farm league is considering that the list of fighters that came through the WSOF and who then went to the UFC is insignificant other than a few high profile fighters whose contracts ran out while the list of fighters that came from LFC & RFA as well as the LFA now is huge since those promotions could indeed be considered a farm league unlike WSOF or PFL.

Still no facts. Just emotion. Fucking idiot confirmed.

 

[null]

Still no facts. Just emotion. Fucking idiot confirmed.

I provided the facts and pointed out your lack of facts. You're beyond embarassing yourself now.

 

[Limit Smasher]

I provided the facts and pointed out your lack of facts. You're beyond embarassing yourself now.

Found some of the information I had been looking for. I'll refer you to this post from 2014.

First of to set things straight. Sig Rogich & Lorenzo Fertitta are long-time friends. In politics, in business, and in public.

Sig Rogich is the CEO of WSOF. He is one of the most influential political players in Nevada. 'Maybe' even more influential as Frank & Lorenzo Fertitta. Rogich has been involved with a number of state & national political campaigns and been an adviser to a number of state & federal administrations. The biw-wig political circles are one thing... for MMA the NSAC is something totally different.

Like the Lorenzo Fertitta & UFC VP Marc Ratner... Sig Rogich is a former Nevada State Athletic Commission member. Actually, he was 'Chairman' of the NSAC and may have been involved in appointing Lorenzo and/or Marc Ratner to the commission.

IMO - This whole WSOF/UFC/Zuffa thing stinks to high heaven. It's hard to keep track of just how many different types of connections there are between the both company's ownership & some of their executives.

Almost more crazy is the convoluted direct involvement of both the UFC & WSOF owners with the Nevada state law enforcement agency that polices them. And then there's all of the NSAC former-executives and legal counsel working for the UFC that it makes the phrase "ripe for corruption" seem appropriate here.

You just gotta ask why Rogich would throw a big chunk of his cash in the ring to compete for assess in seats in Las Vegas, for TV viewers, for established & up'n'coming fighters, and a whole lot more... with guys he's connected to in so many ways.

One of possibilities some might say could be something called collusion. Another possibility some might say is that the new organization could be a front for the big power in the industry. If that's the case it sure would keep the federal government business regulators from coming sniffing around again after the FTC investigation of the Strikeforce purchase.

Exactly how is an organization that is getting like 200K tv viewers, and maybe a few hundred for a live gate, paying out the second biggest purses over Bellator which get up to 5X or 10X the viewers and their parent company also owns the TV networks they're on???

It's obvious that WSOF is a 'pay to play' infomercial format on NCB Sports. If it wasn't, the show would have been cancelled or the Network goes out of business. Simple as that.

These guys are losing money with no foreseeable way with their business model to ever to change this. So who benefits from all this???




http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sig_Rogich
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Ratner
http://www.fightopinion.com/2013/12/04/bellator-wsof-ufc-mma/

http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/zuffa-and-wsof-conspiracy.2718889/#post-94223249

Again, you've provided nothing but your emotion.

 

[null]

Found some of the information I had been looking for. I'll refer you to this post from 2014.



http://forums.sherdog.com/threads/zuffa-and-wsof-conspiracy.2718889/#post-94223249

Again, you've provided nothing but your emotion.

Congratulations, you just provided evidence that the UFC did not own WSOF, but that the CEO was close friends with the previous owners of the UFC. Shocking indeed that two influential businessmen who live in the same state and work in the same industry would know each other and many people in common.

 

[Limit Smasher]

Congratulations, you just provided evidence that the UFC did not own WSOF, but that the CEO was close friends with the previous owners of the UFC. Shocking indeed that two influential businessmen who live in the same state and work in the same industry would know each other and many people in common.

I never said they officially owned them. But they've been in collusion this whole time. Run along now.

 

[Danespina]

I don't really remember WSOF giving up talent to the UFC till they stopped producing shows to rebrand themselves as the PFL. Josh Burkman is the one guy I remember signing over in 2014, but besides that Moraes, Gaethje, Branch, all the big champions stayed in WSOF for 4-5 years till the end.

 

[Limit Smasher]

And his "evidence" to support his bullshit is one fucking anonymous post years ago on Sherdog! Oh boy, the avalanche of "proof"!

Everything I quoted is true. You can go ahead and ignore the obvious and continue burying your head in the sand if you like.

It's almost like you Worldwide guys are so desperate to believe that there's legit competition out there besides Bellator (which isn't either).

UFC has been working side by side with WSOF since the start.

 

[skylolow]

As far as I know on this UFC/WSOF deal is they ran in the same circles. I do know that I've heard a manager or two say that WSOF is very open to letting a guy go the UFC if the UFC offers them a contract. Which lets face it, for most of these orgs it is what they should be allowing the fighters to do.

Beyond that I think everything is just tinfoil hat shit.

 

[Wicked_1]

If they see those fighters actually get paid the million, they may not re-sign the contracts than bind them to the ufc when the current ones run out. It's new, so we shall see.

 

[FKA]

Last Thursdays PFL event did around 115,000 viewers......OUCH.

Don't see them lasting very long with anemic numbers like this.

 

[Evangelion]

Because of lying one fighter per division gets the million.

It's also a million dollars for 6 fights. Many Ufc champs make millions per fight and even the lower paid ones are making 300 or 400k per fight.

Covington just made 380,000 and it was just for the title.

It's crazy how uneducated some people are about the UFC's pay.

 

[Danespina]

Because of lying one fighter per division gets the million.

It's also a million dollars for 6 fights. Many Ufc champs make millions per fight and even the lower paid ones are making 300 or 400k per fight.

Covington just made 380,000 and it was just for the title.

It's crazy how uneducated some people are about the UFC's pay.

You're talking UFC champs though. Most UFC guys have to work for years climbing very difficult opposition till they capture a title and can start making a million dollars per year. Possible. But very, very difficult.

PFL is 12 mid-tier fighters per division, winner gets 1 million at the end of 6 months. That's still a great opportunity and a much more realistic path for most. Especially when considering PFL fighters are also getting paid a standard show/win purse which is negotiated separately, and when playoff bonuses (of 50k, 100k, and 200k) go out to all fighters who make the playoffs. It's not bad.

 

[skylolow]

Last Thursdays PFL event did around 115,000 viewers......OUCH.

Don't see them lasting very long with anemic numbers like this.

That isn't good.

Can't say I was expecting much but you'd think 200K would at least be reasonable.

Then again off the top of my head I can't even think of what channel NBCsports is. I know around where it is but no the exact channel.

I watched Facebook and NBCsports portion thought the show wasn't bad.Overall I like the fights better on Facebook than NBC portion of the card.

I think they should really think about delaying it a few hours and pick a choose what fights we see. Use two fights with name value like a Jake Shields to draw us in and promote the event but the rest of the matches should be hand picked. I think they could really gave the TV audience a pretty exciting card top to bottom. I highly doubt anyone would cry over a two hour delay or whatever.

 

[Danespina]

I think they should really think about delaying it a few hours and pick a choose what fights we see. Use two fights with name value like a Jake Shields to draw us in and promote the event but the rest of the matches should be hand picked. I think they could really gave the TV audience a pretty exciting card top to bottom. I highly doubt anyone would cry over a two hour delay or whatever.

Not bad but I prefer live because you can then see the point system developing over night, with the commentators reminding us throughout each fight how many 1st round finishes there were or whatever. If you mixed and matched the order you could start running into continuity errors, or the commentators would need to seclude the fights from one another.