Fights/fighters where you suspect loaded gloves

[Bert415]

this might be a dumb thread......

But a thread in the mma section about damaged/ bloody faces had me thinking about loaded gloves in boxing. Boxing has had a super shady history, even in the age of athletic commissions we saw a championship level fighter (margarito) most likely fight many fights with loaded gloves. It had me thinking that if he could get away with it in the modern era then it must have been super easy to get away with in previous years.

Here are some guys I’ve suspected might have been up to some funny business. These are just suspicions.

Julio Cesar Chavez- this guy consistently busted people up In a way I’ve never really seen before. I can think of so many examples of fights where his opponent looked like they had just taken a bat to their face. Look at Rosario and Taylor. The amount of damage his opponents would take in some of his fights just seems out of the ordinary.

Alex Stewart- fought George foreman on foreman’s old man comeback tour, lost the fight but busted up George’s face in a brutal fashion. No doubt in my mind he had loaded gloves in this fight. If you want to see how fucking tough foreman is go watch the end of this fight and how his face looks.

Jack Dempsey- he simply did too much damage to Willard when he won the title. Broken ribs, teeth, eye socket, cheek bone. Willard swore until his death that jack was fighting with loaded gloves for that fight, he had no doubt in his mind. Hard to argue with when you hear about the damage he sustained in such a short fight.

Manny Pacquaio- before the Margarito fight (the irony, I know), Margaritos trainer complained to the commission (sketchy Texas) that Manny was “stacking” the tape on his hands. Stacking is a illegal wrapping technique where you basically make knuckles with the tape. The damage on Margaritos eye was out of the ordinary for a boxing fight. His eye was completely fucked, it ruined his career and he still looks fucked up to this day. You just don’t see that kind of damage from just boxing gloves. He also made Cotto look like he had gone through a blender.

Erik Morales- the damage he put on Pablo Cesar Cano, as a shot old undersized fighter, always made me wonder if something was up In that fight.




(Margarito vs pac)


Cotto vs pac


Cano after morales fight

 

[Philtard]

Thing is with This, is it's pretty much accusing someone of a crime. They check gloves and wraps though nowadays yeah?

 

[Bert415]

Thing is with This, is it's pretty much accusing someone of a crime. They check gloves and wraps though nowadays yeah?

Yeah. It has to have happened many times in boxing history though. I don’t think it’s reallt a thing anymore because of commissions, but Margarito most likely got away with it many times while fighting under US commissions.

 

[Seano]

All the fights where the guy I picked lost.

 

[BluntTrauma21]

I know I'll get shit for this but I'm not convinced that Margs loaded his gloves against Cotto. Sorry I just don't think there's enough evidence to say he did it b/c Cotto took terrible punishment. That was a tough style fight for Cotto and they both put brutal beatings on each other that night.

I'm not saying that Margarito didn't cheat (he very well could have, and there's probably a better chance he did than didn't), but I'm also not 100% convinced that he did, either.

Dempsey never cheated against Willard. The plaster of paris theory has been debunked, Kearns was salty b/c he and Jack left on bad terms and he just made the whole thing up years later. Iirc he actually wrapped or at least gloved Dempsey's hands up in the ring, so that makes the story bullshit to start with since he said he originally did it in the dressing room, I think.

Willard was was old, coming off retirement and fighting an atg who by all accounts was a savage puncher. Plus the details of Willard's injuries were exaggerated to a pretty lengthy extent, iirc, as well.

As for Cano, he is a notorious cutter, has that wet paper skin. He routinely has that scar tissue opened up and it makes it look like he is an extra in a horror movie. Also even an old Morales was miles more talented than Cano will ever be and that beating was bound to happen and look even worse b/c of Cano's tendency to cut and show damage easier than most.

 

[Mug]

I thought it was pretty much agreed margarito had plaster in his gloves in the first cotto fight
Jack dempsey seemed to devastating damage to people with relatively weak looking punches for today standards
I dont think pac ever did he literally punched margarito in the face hundreds of times
I cant remember the name right now but the worst case was an irish american im sure getting his head pounded in by someone with plaster of paris

 

[Prefect]

I thought it was pretty much agreed margarito had plaster in his gloves in the first cotto fight
Jack dempsey seemed to devastating damage to people with relatively weak looking punches for today standards
I dont think pac ever did he literally punched margarito in the face hundreds of times
I cant remember the name right now but the worst case was an irish american im sure getting his head pounded in by someone with plaster of paris

billy collins

 

[george14]

Pacquiao is one of the last guys I’d suspect. He landed at will on guys. The cuts shouldn't be too surprising when he is landing like 500 punches.

 

[Mario040481]

Apologies for bumping an old thread. I was watching Foreman vs Stewart earlier today and saw these claims made in the comment section and I had never actually heard them before. and then Google led me here. I shall add my two cents, although late, and worth no more, and possibly less, than anyone else's there. The cause for this being the names of fighters brought up by the OP.
Margarito: I was watching Cotto vs Clottey last week for the first time since it occured and Cotto comes into the fight without his longtime trainer, and even longer time uncle (lol) Evangelista Cotto, as there'd been a blow up between the two men, resulting in cinder blocks taking flight and landing in Porches, post breaking through windows. Anyhow, a sideline to this fight is that it occured after the Margarito fight and seeing how Cotto would react if this fight went the wrong way was a question on the minds of many. Lampley brings up how during the fighter meetings held the day previous, when Cotto is asked about the glove controversy, and is given the chance to throw blame on Evangelista for not making sure to have a member of team Cotto present during the hand wrapping, a LONG ESTABLISHED tradition in the sport, and a fact that I didn't remember ever being mentioned at the time, they remark on Cotto's character as he didn't bite when given the chance to throw that blame, instead saying that it was the fault of Team Cotto as a whole. Kinda remarkable honestly. So, in answer to a different post here I would say that, no, the loaded gloves in THIS SPECIFIC fight has never been proven whatsoever. The circumstantial evidence on the other hand is such that I don't think anyone feels as though accusations are unjust. I think it would be more surprising to learn tomorrow of evidence unequivocally proving Margarito innocent in the first Cotto fight then guilty.
Chavez Sr: Chavez Sr busted up a TON of opponents. Chavez Sr had more than a 100 professional fights, and plenty of men, in his title fights and in his frequent non-title defenses, left the ring looking like lynching victims. I think it important that as he had this 100+ fights, and then the fact that it is the tradition as I already mentioned that the hand wrapping is to be watched by a representative of each team, that is a whole hell of a lot of times to get caught doing something wrong if one were doing so. He'd been destroying men like that from the onset, so I would think that during handwrapping the opponents representative would be extremely attentive to the job being done on JCC's wraps. Most certainly the representative of Meldrick Taylor's team in the rematch would have been on high alert we'd have to surmise. Taylor didn't leave the rematch looking like the zombie that I think scared the shit outta Richard Steele and caused him to stop the fight outta fear of being bitten. He left the fight after getting KO'd 4 rds earlier and looked like another 4 rds of pounding would've resulted in the same walking dead like appearance.
Jack Dempsey: Dude, this is one of the biggest misinformation campaigns out there. There is an interview/article done by a reporter who spoke with Willard two or three days after the fight, meeting or running into him as Willard was just beginning his drive home, and the description of Willard's physical appearance isn't even close to that o what lore has him looking like. I think it says that outside of a swollen cheek there was no evidence of the beating he did tke. Also, this fight had the gloves put on in the ring if I remember correctly. Water was poured over the finished wrapping job and it is thought that this would have caused the wraps to have shrunk up and tightened but not to do anything o the sort that loading them would have supposedly done. There is also an article from "The Ring" done shortly after Kearns BS in Sports Illustrated came out. The team of Cleveland "Big Cat" Williams, attempt to see if the story told by Keans is viable, and the article states that the plaster wouldn't set in the gloves, and became a crumbly mess. Williams is quoted to say something along the lines of "this stuff wouldn't do anyone any good."
Erik Morales: Like someone else said, Cano was a cutter and he just wasn't anywhere near ready for a fighter like Morales, even at the end of Morales' career. Morales could punch, he wan't Tyson by any means, but he could punch and he could place the punches perfectly on Cano that night. It was a recipe for facial disaster. Just like in Marcos Maidana fight previous, Cano was finding Erik easy to hit. He couldn't miss for the first few rds, but also like the other fight, when Morales got warmed up and dialed in, Cano who was still throwing like he was at the start was getting tagged and countered repeatedly and cleanly and then it wasn't long before he was a swollen mess, and I think it was that more than any cuts or anything that ruined his evening.

 

[SandisLL]

Actually hard damage might be done even by nobody and without anything loaded.
Once for example, a guy applied block as counter attack and executed throw ( in drill ). No gloves or hand wrappings on.
Another guy get damaged clavicular bone, shoulder joint and tendons, pretty impressive concussion ( on the mats ) in less than 1,5 second.

_
Most amazing that I had seen was prolonged time between rounds (<45>) not high level bouts so nothing matters….
Forgetting about groin kicks...

Or most amazing, when a guy that had been throwed 3 times instead of loss by 1:3 won fight… I especially loved Turkish Open karate judgement<45>….

 

[SandisLL]

Cuts...
There more depends from glove's surface, striking angles etc, etc I think.
And actually yes, deep cuts till bone are doable even by person that is lighter than opponent and isn't able to KO this guy.

 

[revoltub]

I think people forget that the margarito thing comes from the mosley fight...not the cotto fight.

 

[eternaldarkness]

Actually hard damage might be done even by nobody and without anything loaded.
Once for example, a guy applied block as counter attack and executed throw ( in drill ). No gloves or hand wrappings on.
Another guy get damaged clavicular bone, shoulder joint and tendons, pretty impressive concussion ( on the mats ) in less than 1,5 second.

_
Most amazing that I had seen was prolonged time between rounds (<45>) not high level bouts so nothing matters….
Forgetting about groin kicks...

Or most amazing, when a guy that had been throwed 3 times instead of loss by 1:3 won fight… I especially loved Turkish Open karate judgement<45>….

The worst I have seen is a fighter get dropped with a jumping switch kick, get about twenty seconds to recover (He couldn't make the ten count, he was up but out on his feet) and the get knocked out cold with the exact same technique when the fight was restarted.

 

[Buddy Revell]

I'll never not believe that Margarito was cheating against Cotto, Cintron, and a bunch of others. I can actually even pinpoint the fight after which i think he started cheating. I remember watching Margarito going life and death against a very good but not so tough Daniel Santos over 12+ rounds. And he actually didn't dish out much damage in those fights. Then all of a sudden he shows up against Cintron and them guys and is smashing their faces up. Very suspicious.

Pacquiao is the total opposite. He's a speed freak with 7 inch wrists. Makes sense that he can bang. And the fact that he's only busting welterweights up and not KO'ing them makes me less suspicious.

 

[revoltub]

I'll never not believe that Margarito was cheating against Cotto, Cintron, and a bunch of others. I can actually even pinpoint the fight after which i think he started cheating. I remember watching Margarito going life and death against a very good but not so tough Daniel Santos over 12+ rounds. And he actually didn't dish out much damage in those fights. Then all of a sudden he shows up against Cintron and them guys and is smashing their faces up. Very suspicious.

Pacquiao is the total opposite. He's a speed freak with 7 inch wrists. Makes sense that he can bang. And the fact that he's only busting welterweights up and not KO'ing them makes me less suspicious.

8 not seven

 

[Cole train]

I prefer barbed wire aka the stinger

 

[Mr2urbo]

I know I'll get shit for this but I'm not convinced that Margs loaded his gloves against Cotto. Sorry I just don't think there's enough evidence to say he did it b/c Cotto took terrible punishment. That was a tough style fight for Cotto and they both put brutal beatings on each other that night.

I'm not saying that Margarito didn't cheat (he very well could have, and there's probably a better chance he did than didn't), but I'm also not 100% convinced that he did, either.

Dempsey never cheated against Willard. The plaster of paris theory has been debunked, Kearns was salty b/c he and Jack left on bad terms and he just made the whole thing up years later. Iirc he actually wrapped or at least gloved Dempsey's hands up in the ring, so that makes the story bullshit to start with since he said he originally did it in the dressing room, I think.

Willard was was old, coming off retirement and fighting an atg who by all accounts was a savage puncher. Plus the details of Willard's injuries were exaggerated to a pretty lengthy extent, iirc, as well.

As for Cano, he is a notorious cutter, has that wet paper skin. He routinely has that scar tissue opened up and it makes it look like he is an extra in a horror movie. Also even an old Morales was miles more talented than Cano will ever be and that beating was bound to happen and look even worse b/c of Cano's tendency to cut and show damage easier than most.

There was a post here by a member that explained Marg’s loaded glove fiasco and it made sense, used plaster from previous fights are commonly used but it Nazim Richardson who cried foul play, even before the Trinidad-Hopkins, Nazim always had a reputation pulling stunts like this, and its not a knock on Cotto but stylistically Marg was all wrong for him then ad in the wrong game plan he employed he was doomed.

 

[Mendacious]

I think people forget that the margarito thing comes from the mosley fight...not the cotto fight.

Yes... and it was proven he attempted to cheat and considering Cotto never got battered like that before or after, even against Manny, it’s a very safe assumption he cheated against Cotto.

 

[Seano]

Yes... and it was proven he attempted to cheat and considering Cotto never got battered like that before or after, even against Manny, it’s a very safe assumption he cheated against Cotto.

Cotto got battered quite a bit. One of my favorite fighters but thats what made his fights exciting. Honestly, the second fight was starting to look a little like the first when it was stopped.

 

[Mendacious]

Cotto got battered quite a bit. One of my favorite fighters but thats what made his fights exciting. Honestly, the second fight was starting to look a little like the first when it was stopped.

I’m talking about the damage done to his face and the fact that he took a knee - have you seen any fights like that? Miguel is a tough SOB, letting himself be counted out suggests something wasn’t right that night