Fedor fans and Jones haters reduced to claiming steroid use disqualifies one from GOAT status.

[Scyther]

We all know Jones is the undisputed GOAT of the sport and because the haters can't point to flaws in his record so they try to point to the so-called fact that he used steroids but let's look at the facts.

The Lance Armstrong gambit
One method the haters will use in an attempt to discredit Jones is what I call the Lance Armstrong gambit. The argument goes something like this:

"Lance Armstrong was busted for roids and his legacy is tainted, so that means Jones' legacy is tainted as well."

However, the fact is Jones did NOT test positive for steroids he tested positive for estrogen blockers. So does testing positive for estrogen blockers disqualify someone from GOAT status or is it steroids. If it's steroids then the haters need a new talking point because Jones didn't test positive for steroids.

To add to that if one does even a bit of research they'd realize that many of the top riders in the Tour de France were later busted themselves or admitted to using steroids after the fact.

GSP and Fedor were clean
First, GSP. GSP has never tested positive for steroids but that steroid gut didn't just appear recently, and no GSP wasn't just exhaling. GSP has a clean cut appearance but let's not get things confused he's EXTREMELY SUSPECT AT BEST.

To add to that, GSP trains with Greg Jackson and Jon Jones and if you're claiming Jones is a roid cheat what about all of his buddies he trains with, what about Greg Jackson?

Moving on to Fedor. Fedor fought in Pride where there was NO, and I repeat NO steroid testing whatsoever. It was a complete free-for-all.

To add to that PRIDE was run by the Yakuza and when the UFC bought PRIDE they found out that all of their contracts were illegal and got royally screwed over. Hendo (who used TRT legally) said that PRIDE had no steroid testing and that all but a few of the fighters would be banned if they did. Videos time stamped.





So we're supposed to believe Fedor was clean all through PRIDE with no roid testing? Fedor took on all of these suspect roid users but cried for emergency steroid testing when Ubereem was walking around, yet in all his years in PRIDE he never ONCE asked for steroid testing. I wonder why.

It really is weird how some of these PRIDE fighters got "old" overnight.

 

[BringBackTRTforFairness]

This sport like most is riddled with PED usage.

Some get caught some dont.

All we can do is go by the evidence.

Estrogen blockers for Jones + super low T levels -= obvious cheat to all thos ethat ar enot r tarded. This also means he is likely cheating now to beat Cormier etc because you cant just get your T levels back to normal after doing PEDS for a while, and without at least normal T levels you cant compete in MMA at the highest level

Fedor NOTHING

The kettle bell Fedor is just Fedor with a pump he never looked like that in his prime in pride when he fought, he looks the same now as he always has with very minor muscle loss due to ageing, same with Nog




JONE JONES = CHEATER = LEGACY AND ACHIEVEMENTS DONT COUNT FOR ANYTHING DUE TO THIS

FEDOR = GOAT, BEAT UP LOADS OF PED USERS WO USING HIMSELF, NOT TO MENTION BEATING UP MANY UFC CHAMPS, OTHER TALENTS, AND PEOPLE MUCH LARGER THAN HIMSELF

JON JONES IS A STEROID USING CAN A SUPER CAN IF YOU LIKE

 

[DeathByCaranos]

It's banned for a reason. It creates an unfair advantage and if you truly are the best why do you need it.

 

[MyEnglishIsPeperoni]

who da fooook cares. even dana could be your GOAT

 

[TerraRayzing]

Meh, everyone does steroids and I don't get the hatred. Hell, I'll watch roided Wand every day over a boring, clean athlete. Retards act like they have a stake in the company or something.
Yes, Jones is the GOAT till now.

 

[trolldum]

Jones can't be the GOAT because he only fight smaller fighters.

 

[loisestrad]

I don't think PED disqualifies someone for being in contention for GOAT (well, at least not if you aren't caught time and time again).

But you can't compare Fedor and Jones in this regard by simply stating that Pride didn't test, and PED's were in effect legal. The problem by using isn't the fact that you're using, but the fact that you're cheating. Even if Fedor did use, he wasn't cheating. Therein lies the difference between him and, say, Jones.

 

[Fedorer13]

If you think anyone is reading that wall of text then you're an idiot.

Jones roided up to win in a smaller division.
Fedor didn't juice and dominated a bigger division.

Fedor goat. Have a nice day.

 

[MyEnglishIsPeperoni]

this white fat guy is my GOAT

 

[Karelinator]

I don't really give a damn about all that Jones steroid use 'disqualifying him'.

But let's be serious, only reason Jones would be taking aromatisation inhibitors and estrogen receptor modulators is to treat himself after using steroids.

Clinging to 'he didn't test positive for steroids' is just silly.

 

[Meaningful Gregory]

This sport like most is riddled with PED usage.

Some get caught some dont.

All we can do is go by the evidence.

Estrogen blockers for Jones + super low T levels -= obvious cheat to all thos ethat ar enot r tarded. This also means he is likely cheating now to beat Cormier etc because you cant just get your T levels back to normal after doing PEDS for a while, and without at least normal T levels you cant compete in MMA at the highest level

Fedor NOTHING

The kettle bell Fedor is just Fedor with a pump he never looked like that in his prime in pride when he fought, he looks the same now as he always has with very minor muscle loss due to ageing, same with Nog




JONE JONES = CHEATER = LEGACY AND ACHIEVEMENTS DONT COUNT FOR ANYTHING DUE TO THIS

FEDOR = GOAT, BEAT UP LOADS OF PED USERS WO USING HIMSELF, NOT TO MENTION BEATING UP MANY UFC CHAMPS, OTHER TALENTS, AND PEOPLE MUCH LARGER THAN HIMSELF

JON JONES IS A STEROID USING CAN A SUPER CAN IF YOU LIKE

If one gets away with steriods THEY'RE ALL ON STERIODS.

Fedor definitely did steriods. There isn't a Ruski fighter on planet earth that isn't juicing.

 

[Scyther]

It's banned for a reason. It creates an unfair advantage and if you truly are the best why do you need it.

Did you even read the post or just comment, I went over all why this isn't true.

 

[Scyther]

I don't really give a damn about all that Jones steroid use 'disqualifying him'.

But let's be serious, only reason Jones would be taking aromatisation inhibitors and estrogen receptor modulators is to treat himself after using steroids.

Clinging to 'he didn't test positive for steroids' is just silly.

I totally agree, it's obvious he was using. The point of the thread was debunking the dumb arguments put forth by Jones haters and Fedor fans.

 

[MMonk]

I am a fan of both Legends.

Still Jones got caught with illegal shit.

Fedor was not, despite being tested in US ( remember Barnett fight fell apart,
because Barnett was caught on juice?).

 

[Paynebringer]

We all know Jones is the undisputed GOAT of the sport and because the haters can't point to flaws in his record so they try to point to the so-called fact that he used steroids but let's look at the facts.

This is not a fact, maybe an alternative fact or speculation, but not fact.

 

[thobra]

Nah. That does not affect his legacy in any way.
I would expect everyone to do steroids at the time it was "legal" or "ok" to do them in between fights. You don't have 40 year olds walking around with 6-packs and looking like 20 year olds in real life without steroids.

Even Fedor probably used something...but what is interesting with Fedor is that he actually did olympic drug testing when competing in Pride (an org where some claim steroids were encouraged). So one should think he used at least much less than his opponents, and was still so strong and dominant.

 

[HIMBOB]

PEDs in prime = no GOAT for you.

 

[Vision]

Nah. That does not affect his legacy in any way.
I would expect everyone to do steroids at the time it was "legal" or "ok" to do them in between fights. You don't have 40 year olds walking around with 6-packs and looking like 20 year olds in real life without steroids.

Even Fedor probably used something...but what is interesting with Fedor is that he actually did olympic drug testing when competing in Pride (an org where some claim steroids were encouraged). So one should think he used at least much less than his opponents, and was still so strong and dominant.

A few points to consider:
1. I see older people, older than 40 even, walking around with six-packs although they don't look like 20-year-olds facially. Usually they are people who train year-round at the gym and outdoors (jogging). Older triathletes, joggers, and rock climbers have no problem with having six-packs because they are usually concerned with their nutrition as well as training really hard. Fedor was documented for training damn hard.
2. I'm as big a Fedor fan as anyone, but his "Olympic" drug testing falls under suspicion when you consider headlines in recent years regarding Russia and the State-run Olympic doping scandal which has tarnished its image in international athletics.

 

[Deleted member 525721]

I'd like to add that Jon wouldn't even be in consideration if Fedor wasn't "exposed" once he became old and broken down. While they both had around the same amount of fights at age 30, Fedor was facing guys like Arona 4 fights into his career, whereas Jones didn't hit real competition until his 10th fight (Hammil).

Fedor was fighting at a more frequent pace later in his career than Jones, whereas Jones was always getting long gaps between fights for recovery as he was approaching 30 due to legal issues, failing drug tests, etc.

Also, give Jones 6 more years to see if he gets "exposed" as he is a deteriorating fighter facing tough competition as he's getting closer to 40 rather than comparing him now in his prime just at 30 to a fighter who has been a shell of himself since his war torn mid 30s.

Oh, there's one other reason where Jones is out, he cheated. That's right he cheated. In a sport where recovery and explosiveness and conditioning are nearly everything because skill, training methods and experience are basically a wash at the higher levels, recovery, explosiveness and conditioning are the deciding factors - Jones cheated to increase his. The piss poor excuse that Fedor wasn't caught is just that - piss poor. It's like saying everyone on Earth is "also" guilty of murder because they haven't been caught. No one says Hank Aaron probably used like Bonds but he "didn't get caught" because they would look like a moron. Calling a guy always accused of being "fat" and who looks nearly identical through a two decade long career a cheater who didn't get caught is just weak.

I won't even get into the fact that Jones has been accused of having more of a reach/size advantage over skill (not that he isn't skilled) whereas Fedor was a "fat" smaller heavyweight who routinely fought men much larger than him.

 

[Repsac]

I'm a long-time Fedor fan and I consider Jones GOAT now.