Faber VS Barao stoppage

[agibmxmma]

Did Rampage not get his ass beat twice by Wandy before fighting him a third time and finally winning? Fans were excited and def wanted to see that fight, regardless of the first two fights between them! Fighters make fights, reality is.. Faber is a fan and company favorite! He will fight a 3rd time vs Barao eventually, sooner over later more then likely. I also see the fight vs Edgar happening in the near future too (been asking for this fight for 3yrs).

 

[campbecc]

Faber said, "I grabbed his leg and was giving a thumbs up, what more could I have done?" he could of scrambled to get out of that bad spot and fought back.

that might have looked better but it actually would have been a mistake tactically (baring a bad stoppage) and put him at risk. he was in a defensive position so he was just holding on waiting to recover while Barao was doing nothing but using up energy throwing awkward arm punches off of Fabers glove.

Barao was doing no damage and he knew it, that's why Barao was looking up at the ref hoping he would stop it instead of trying to stop Faber himself.

 

[chinarice]

It IS a worse position... and yet BJ STILL kept trying to fight back. You don't stop fights because guys are in bad positions. You stop fights when they stop trying to get OUT of bad positions and stop fighting back.

I can't believe this thread is still alive, but what I really can't believe is how you, specifically, keep building up straw men and then knocking them down.

It doesn't matter if you're hurt or not. It doesn't matter if you're covering or not. If you don't want to fight anymore, then the fight's over. This isn't a frickin' "mandingo" fight.

Standing in the corner with your back turned could be looked at as intelligently defending... but it's NOT fighting. Do it and the fight gets stopped.

Hiding behind the ref could REALLY be looked at as intelligently defending... but it's NOT fighting. Do it and the fight gets stopped.

Kissing the mat and covering your ears, by your definition, is intelligently defending... but it's STILL NOT fighting. Do it and the fight gets STOPPED.

What in hell does that have to do with being stuck in crucifix and trying to work your way out?

"But, but, but... thumb up!" Faber might as well have stuck his thumb up his @ss for all the tactical good it was doing him.

It's a fight. You wanna keep fighting? Simple solution: KEEP FIGHTING.

How was BJ fighting back? By eating punches with his mouth?

All my arguments are legit arguments. I keep breaking down strawman arguments.

But. but.but faber would have lost anyway

but but but Barao hurt him a few times so that's why you stop it, when the guy is longer landing meaningful offense.

Inconsistent reffing is inconsistent. There are many fights that illustrate the inconsistencies.

If you don't like my outlook on the fight, we can agree to disagree because yeah, I disagree with you.

"Kissing the mat and covering his ears" is not what Uriah was doing, when the fight was stopped.

If you can't even give facts about what happened, please don't try to discuss it with me.

His head was not on the canvas, when the fight was stopped.

I consider Uriah's defense pretty intelligent but you think getting back to his feet, while not fully recovered, is somehow intelligent to you....

 

[Underworld]

Nothing worse then fucking up a main event, you guys keep telling yourselves how fucking great he is. BJM shits on him, always has.

 

[soohrednaB]

13 unanswered shots -- most of which hit his arm / glove

Without moving ? So I guess improving position from your belly to your knees is not moving ?

Yes, he got dropped. Yes, he flopped onto his belly because he was too dazed to complete a shot. However, he was blocking shots aimed at his head, with his other arm trapped beneath Barao.

I can see how the stoppage is justified, but it was still bad. A less jumpy ref would have assessed the situation more completely -- one who would have seen Faber was not out, and understood to try to improve position even further would have meant exposing himself to damage. If Faber was truly that out of it, Barao could have absolutely wrecked him with knees to the ribs.

13 shots without moving, AFTER he slowly based up to his knees....

....and only seconds after getting dropped face-first. It was the right call, and there's no good reason to be dissatisfied with the end result. Urijah was getting outclassed, and beaten down. It's the referee's job to save him from getting unnecessarily hurt. Holding your hand up to your ear, while turtled and not moving is going to get you stopped--especially after getting rocked repeatedly on the feet.

Faber was defending about as well as Marquardt did after Anderson rocked him. I didn't hear any of you sadists crying early stoppage back then. How many times have we seen half-conscious fighters continue trying to wrestle more effectively than Urijah was in that instance?

I'd take this kind of finish 1000 times over something like Warren v Curran. Given time to reflect, I honestly can't think of an early stop that still bothers me even half as much as a late one.

 

[StotheQ]

wicked lame.

Terrible stoppage

 

[shonuf]

Nothing worse then fucking up a main event, you guys keep telling yourselves how fucking great he is. BJM shits on him, always has.

agreed.

 

[chinarice]

13 shots without moving, AFTER he slowly based up to his knees....

....and only seconds after getting dropped face-first. It was the right call, and there's no good reason to be dissatisfied with the end result. Urijah was getting outclassed, and beaten down. It's the referee's job to save him from getting unnecessarily hurt. Holding your hand up to your ear, while turtled and not moving is going to get you stopped--especially after getting rocked repeatedly on the feet.

Faber was defending about as well as Marquardt did after Anderson rocked him. I didn't hear any of you sadists crying early stoppage back then. How many times have we seen half-conscious fighters continue trying to wrestle more effectively than Urijah was in that instance?

I'd take this kind of finish 1000 times over something like Warren v Curran. Given time to reflect, I honestly can't think of an early stop that still bothers me even half as much as a late one.

Funny thing being, the guy in your sig would not have stopped that fight.

Rosenthal > Herb Dean.

 

[NoBiasJustMMA]

Had Faber had his head buried into the mat, covering up, I would probably agree.

He was coherent enough to motion toward the ref he was ok and the replays show all of Barao's shots are hitting Faber in the hand/arm.

He wasn't just going to jump back to his feet because he was obviously still hurt. Getting back to your feet, while not being fully recovered, is not bright at all and would have just led to him getting hit more.

I think Uriah was doing the right thing, to getting his bearings back. Herb wasn't paying close enough attention, IMO and definitely let Barao affect his decision.

BJM let BJ Penn get his face smashed by Matt Hughes, while being crucifixed (Much worse position) and was there for much longer, without improving position and taking shots flush to the face.

Refs are very inconsistent and this fight outlined the inconsistencies.

So if a guy is burying his head while getting punched but has a leg you let it go? The only difference was he had Barao's leg, he didn't do anything with it though.

The difference between those two instances is that BJ was moving and trying to get out of that position but couldn't, the ref stopped it when he realized BJ couldn't get out of the position and was just going to take punches. Faber didn't move to try and get out of the position he was in which is why it was stopped, he was no longer intelligently defending himself.

 

[chinarice]

So if a guy is burying his head while getting punched but has a leg you let it go? The only difference was he had Barao's leg, he didn't do anything with it though.

The difference between those two instances is that BJ was moving and trying to get out of that position but couldn't, the ref stopped it when he realized BJ couldn't get out of the position and was just going to take punches. Faber didn't move to try and get out of the position he was in which is why it was stopped, he was no longer intelligently defending himself.

Barao was not even hitting Faber in the face.

Hughes was mashing BJ's face.

Inconsistencies.

Depending on which ref was in there, the fight would have went on longer. That is the true issue, at hand.

I think BJM an Rosenthal would let that fight go on.

I believe he was intelligently defending. You bury your head so you don't get your head destroyed with punches. You think he was just going to sit in that position, if Barao was hitting him in the face with punches? I doubt it but he wasn't, so he had no reason to move out of the position and had time to gather his bearings, before moving from the position.

That doesn't mean it's not intelligent. Again, Uriah motioned he was fine to continue, so IMO the ref has no right to say otherwise.

Ah well, we see things differently, I guess. I definitely think the fight was stopped early.

 

[jeremyemilio]

How was BJ fighting back? By eating punches with his mouth?

All my arguments are legit arguments. I keep breaking down strawman arguments.

But. but.but faber would have lost anyway

but but but Barao hurt him a few times so that's why you stop it, when the guy is longer landing meaningful offense.

Inconsistent reffing is inconsistent. There are many fights that illustrate the inconsistencies.

If you don't like my outlook on the fight, we can agree to disagree because yeah, I disagree with you.

"Kissing the mat and covering his ears" is not what Uriah was doing, when the fight was stopped.

If you can't even give facts about what happened, please don't try to discuss it with me.

His head was not on the canvas, when the fight was stopped.

I consider Uriah's defense pretty intelligent but you think getting back to his feet, while not fully recovered, is somehow intelligent to you....

These are the very definition of the kind of straw man arguments that you continue to build up and then knock down. I haven't made ANY of these arguments.

How bout we try once more, and if you don't have an answer we can leave it there, and if you DO have an answer, at least you might give me something to think about.

In case you've forgotten, here are my arguments:

In a prize fight, you can't just stop fighting or stop trying to fight or the fight gets stopped. That's true in boxing as well as MMA.

Here's the analogy. You tell me what's wrong with it: If you turn your back to your opponent in a boxing match and refuse to face him and fight, the fight will be stopped.

Now, under your definition of intelligently defending, turning your back in the corner seems a lot more 'intelligent' than facing a guy who has you trapped in the corner and getting hit in the face. But that's the deal. You wanna fight, you have to try to fight your way out of that position, not turn and cover and stop fighting.

It's the same on the ground, which is why the Brock comparison and the BJ comparison are also straw men.

Which brings us to the second point: Your continued insistence that the reffing in this situation is inconsistent, followed by your giving proof through examples that are not at all consistent with the situation at hand.

If you want to provide proof of this alleged inconsistency, what you need to do is find a fight where a fighter was turtled like Faber was, and as immobile as Faber was, for as long as Faber was, that wasn't stopped. I admit that I can think of one or two (Wiedman v Munoz... but they were horrifically late stoppages.

You keep making the argument that Faber was hurt so he was doing the smart thing just laying there trying to recover, but that's not how fighting works. When the fight is on, you need to fight. You can lay down and recover after the fight. If you are too hurt to fight now, the fight ends. You don't get to take a time out by hiding your face behind the back of your head, where it is illegal to hit you.

Now, don't get me wrong. There is a legit argument to be made if you want to argue that the fight was stopped early. It goes like this:

Faber wasn't just laying there, too hurt to fight. Yes he was hurt, but he was actually fighting by working for a single leg and THAT's why his back was turned, which is perfectly fine in a fight and is the whole reason for the no strikes to the back of the head rule.

Of course, I would probably respond by pointing out that Faber wasn't actually working for anything, and would back that up by pointing out that the arm with which he was supposedly fighting for a single leg was, at the moment of the stoppage, being used to give the thumbs up... which makes it pretty damned difficult to follow through on a takedown...

... but at least I could respect that argument as actually being related to the situation at hand.

 

[chinarice]

These are the very definition of the kind of straw man arguments that you continue to build up and then knock down. I haven't made ANY of these arguments.

How bout we try once more, and if you don't have an answer we can leave it there, and if you DO have an answer, at least you might give me something to think about.

In case you've forgotten, here are my arguments:

In a prize fight, you can't just stop fighting or stop trying to fight or the fight gets stopped. That's true in boxing as well as MMA.

Here's the analogy. You tell me what's wrong with it: If you turn your back to your opponent in a boxing match and refuse to face him and fight, the fight will be stopped.

Now, under your definition of intelligently defending, turning your back in the corner seems a lot more 'intelligent' than facing a guy who has you trapped in the corner and getting hit in the face. But that's the deal. You wanna fight, you have to try to fight your way out of that position, not turn and cover and stop fighting.

It's the same on the ground, which is why the Brock comparison and the BJ comparison are also straw men.

Which brings us to the second point: Your continued insistence that the reffing in this situation is inconsistent, followed by your giving proof through examples that are not at all consistent with the situation at hand.

If you want to provide proof of this alleged inconsistency, what you need to do is find a fight where a fighter was turtled like Faber was, and as immobile as Faber was, for as long as Faber was, that wasn't stopped. I admit that I can think of one or two (Wiedman v Munoz... but they were horrifically late stoppages.

You keep making the argument that Faber was hurt so he was doing the smart thing just laying there trying to recover, but that's not how fighting works. When the fight is on, you need to fight. You can lay down and recover after the fight. If you are too hurt to fight now, the fight ends. You don't get to take a time out by hiding your face behind the back of your head, where it is illegal to hit you.

Now, don't get me wrong. There is a legit argument to be made if you want to argue that the fight was stopped early. It goes like this:

Faber wasn't just laying there, too hurt to fight. Yes he was hurt, but he was actually fighting by working for a single leg and THAT's why his back was turned, which is perfectly fine in a fight and is the whole reason for the no strikes to the back of the head rule.

Of course, I would probably respond by pointing out that Faber wasn't actually working for anything, and would back that up by pointing out that the arm with which he was supposedly fighting for a single leg was, at the moment of the stoppage, being used to give the thumbs up... which makes it pretty damned difficult to follow through on a takedown...

... but at least I could respect that argument as actually being related to the situation at hand.

For a guy that CAN'T BELIEVE THIS THREAD IS STILL GOING, you're sure contributing to making sure that happens.

lol

 

[SherdogJoe]

Stoppage was terrible. Faber was obviously still there.

 

[Charlie Sheen]

It blows my mind to see some of the people that voted "Bad stoppage" on this poll, also voting "Good stoppage" on the Rousey vs. Sara poll.