Evolution will no longer be taught in Turkish schools

[SouthoftheAndes]

Reading current News and recalling News from the early 00s , I get the distinct impression that Kuridsh identity is the major issue for Kurds.

He (Erdogan) gave them some carrots to win their votes and ascend to power. His quote from many years ago on Democrasy being a train , shows his true colors. Now that he is in power, he doesn't need to give the Kurds as big a carrot . You can't deny that there has been a huge falling out between him and the Kurds. At the end of the day how is Turkish Pan-Islamism going to reconcile itself with Kurdish identity. Islamism sees no borders and eshews ethnic nationalism (in theory atleast). Do you think he is really going to allow the Kurds to attain more power and autonomy over their affairs? Erdogan is nostalgic for the Ottoman empire days, so how is he going to go along with Kurdish aspirations since Kurdish self-identity will clash with Turkish hegemony.

Yes Pak is run by the security appratus but the day to day life where minorities are kidnapped by Muslims and where they are accused of blasphemy is under the jurisdiction of the civilian government that is officially running the country. I am not saying the Military is opposed to Sunni extremist groups and Islamism, because it was Zia after all who really started down the path of Islamist chavinist thinking. What I am saying is that even the civilian government supports it or is indifferent. So be it Military dictatorship or Civilian, it doesn't matter. A military dictatorship that genuinely wants to protect minorities can do a better job of it than a civilian government.

Yes Sisi has killed more than Mursi but Sisi has moved against the Jihadis too . Mursi's tyranny would have been disenfranchising Copts steadly through laws and turning a blind eye to Muslim thugs bullying them. With Sisi, as long as you don't cross him, he will keep the lid on Islamists.

Pakistan is insane in so many ways.

Officially for instance being stoned to death is not a practiced form of capital punishment (despite it being in law by the books) by the 'Federal' government but yet it happens quite often in this 'civilian' government jurisdictions. In which case very often someone is friends or knows someone who knows someone who is in the security services.

Some crazy stuff goes on in these extrajudicial cases.

Belief in a theistic god is blind faith . Theory of Evolution isn't blind faith.

When it has been shown that Creationism is bunk and by extension a good deal of theistic religions, some supporters of said religions move the goal-posts to now claim God directed evolution.

Belief in God may be viewed as 'blind faith' I can acknowledge it certainly is a leap of faith.

However, the case that evolution and God can go together is not at all false.

So I don't see the issue there all you are doing is combining facts with a leap of faith (in God).

 

[Islam Imamate]

Erdogan is also a Turkish Nationalist , not like the Kemalists and the secular Military but nonetheless a Turkish nationalist. He wants to recapture as much as possible of the glory days when Turks ruled vast swaths of the region. Now infamous, is the below picture of him descending the flight of stairs flaked by men in Ottoman period warrior attire.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/12/abbas-erdogan-16-warriors-turkish-presidential-palace


" Turkey’s New Maps Are Reclaiming the Ottoman Empire"
"Erdogan’s aggressive nationalism is now spilling over Turkey’s borders, grabbing land in Greece and Iraq."

http://foreignpolicy.com/2016/10/23...tionalists-want-ottoman-borders-iraq-erdogan/

One can push Pan-Islamic or Islamic hegemony and still be an ethnonationalist. The Saudis are a perfect example of this, because they use Salafism/Wahhabism to increase Saudi power and influence.

Kurds can like more Islamist hegemony and still push for Kurdish self-interest. They are going to clash with Erdogan's Turkish Islamism

I never said that the AKP's Islamism is mutually exclusive to Turkish nationalism, just that its still nonetheless less antagonistic to the Kurdish identity than the old Kemalist Turkish nationalism and that this difference was manifested in policies as the old military establishment resorted to extra-judicial killings while the AKP expanded Kurdish rights initially.

I am saying that between the Civilian government and the Military/ISI junta , the later is far better positioned to safeguard minorities. Neither one cares. Whichever one shows a genuine interest in protecting minorities is the one the West should support. I do prefer a civilian government for every nation, but democrasy in the Muslim world can end up being majoritarian tyranny. With Egypt, for the short term atleast, it looks like Sisi is better for the Copts than Mursi would have been.

But that goes back to my earlier point. They're better positioned to do so because they are the coercive apparatus of the state and they determine what is and isn't enforced. It has nothing to do with the military being a more moral institution or anything and more often than not that reality translates into a very repressive government.

Mursi, if he wasn't deposed, would have kept filling government positions with Brotherhood members and Islamist thugs would have been more embolden to attack Copts. Assad is a thug but the Christian minorities support him or atleast do not oppose him. Yes Sisi will not allow any opposition and goes after non-Islamists too but between him and Mursi, my perception is that he is better for the Copts than Mursi would have been. Now having said that I think the US should not support him, and should force him to respect human rights.

Can you blame Morsi for filling government posts with Islamists? They won the elections and the Mubarak era appointees needed to be ejected. What's the point of getting rid of a dictator if his entire administration is left in place?

And anyway Sisi might be better in the short term in some ways for Copts but he's preventing Egypt from developing the sort of civil society that would protect its minorities from majoritarian tyranny and that, combined with his many other sins, makes him the worse option for Egypt.

 

[SouthoftheAndes]

Yeah Turkey is SUPER progressive.

"I really want to attend a college or univercity in Turkey!" Said nobody...ever.

Turkey is like that ugly chick who looks semi decent when standing next to extremely ugly chicks.

They are doing great out of all the other muslim centric countries on this planet...but that's not a high bar to hit.

If I was a Muslim i'd love to study in Turkey.

Typically girls study abroad at places cause they want to be 'cultured' and experiences and guys do it cause they want to get laid and get drunk/high abroad and see cool stuff and get laid. Getting laid in Turkey isn't so easy as say compared to say some western countries.

And looking back if I had been in College during Turkey's more secular years and was studying Turkish I would of definitely have wanted to be in Turkey. Or even if I wasne't doing Turkish and had no intention of learning the language it would still be a cool experience for say a few months.

 

[Islam Imamate]

If I was a Muslim i'd love to study in Turkey.

Typically girls study abroad at places cause they want to be 'cultured' and experiences and guys do it cause they want to get laid and get drunk/high abroad and see cool stuff and get laid. Getting laid in Turkey isn't so easy as say compared to say some western countries.

And looking back if I had been in College during Turkey's more secular years and was studying Turkish I would of definitely have wanted to be in Turkey. Or even if I wasne't doing Turkish and had no intention of learning the language it would still be a cool experience for say a few months.

Same here, Turkey looks like a cool place. I think I'll save my pilgrimage to the mausoleums of the sultanas until after all this shit cools down a bit though...

 

[ShinkanPo]

Sam here, Turkey looks like a cool place. I think I'll save my pilgrimage to the mausoleums of the sultanas until after all this shit cools down a bit though...

I love mausoleums would be cool to see Turkish Islamic style mauseleums I really hope ISIS don't get to it first and just blew it up, those fuckers don't like huge Tombs and memorials!

 

[Prutfis]

Someone mentioned evolution and TheDunningKrugerKid is already going full retard on page 1. And room temp IQ Shitskater has chimed in. Fantastic.

 

[LatFlare]

This is the least of their problems.

 

[ShinkanPo]

Someone mentioned evolution and TheDunningKrugerKid is already going full retard on page 1. And room temp IQ Shitskater has chimed in. Fantastic.

Yeah he always gets into this evolution debates and people always gets suckered into a pseudo intelectual pissing contest.

 

[BVG]

If I was a Muslim i'd love to study in Turkey.

Typically girls study abroad at places cause they want to be 'cultured' and experiences and guys do it cause they want to get laid and get drunk/high abroad and see cool stuff and get laid. Getting laid in Turkey isn't so easy as say compared to say some western countries.

And looking back if I had been in College during Turkey's more secular years and was studying Turkish I would of definitely have wanted to be in Turkey. Or even if I wasne't doing Turkish and had no intention of learning the language it would still be a cool experience for say a few months.

https://www.timeshighereducation.co...gth/25/sort_by/rank/sort_order/asc/cols/stats

Nope.

All the top ranked schools are either in the UK or the United States and down the list it's all non muslim places.

That's not by accident.