Down Under Leg Attacks - Craig Jones DVD/ ON Demand

[Coconutwater]

Guy's - These DVD sale sites will negotiate. Kesting has always been super fair with me. I got a $197 set for $77. Tell him you want the dvd but can't pay, $197 (example.) He might give you the sale price, or, at least a discount, 20%? Give it a shot. It's a buyer's market!

I hear Rickson's dvd will be $250?!! Not sure about the content, or, how many disc's. Jan / Feb, 2018 release.

Much respect to Rickson, but why do I get the feeling the first 2 out of 5 dvd’s will be his upa version, his defense against rear headlock and the concept of leverage by pitching your weight forward on your lead leg while someone tries to back you up... followed by the keep your arms raised in fake submissive position like your praying but really your arms are ready to deflect...

Yeah... I don’t think I’d ever buy a Rickson DVD unless he throws in some deep stuff, but other champs already do and probably better.

 

[cjd]

I wouldnt lke 50/50 to be playing footies these days...

Honestly - I feel like the 50/50 has a bunch of unique properties that make it pretty different from the "modern" footlock positions - it's much easier to enter 50/50 than it is to get to, say, the 411, and the methods of escaping are rather different, not to mention that you have to constantly be watching your own feet. So much of the modern footlock game is centered around not using the 50/50 that I think a 50/50 specialist (eg Ryan Hall) would have a huge advantage going there against a modern leglocker.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

Honestly - I feel like the 50/50 has a bunch of unique properties that make it pretty different from the "modern" footlock positions - it's much easier to enter 50/50 than it is to get to, say, the 411, and the methods of escaping are rather different, not to mention that you have to constantly be watching your own feet. So much of the modern footlock game is centered around not using the 50/50 that I think a 50/50 specialist (eg Ryan Hall) would have a huge advantage going there against a modern leglocker.

The thing about 411 is that your feet are mostly safe, 50/50 you are in constant danger, it is much easier to access, but the danger of going there is too high...

 

[cjd]

The thing about 411 is that your feet are mostly safe, 50/50 you are in constant danger, it is much easier to access, but the danger of going there is too high...

I'm aware.

But if you are better at 50/50 than the other person... your feet really aren't.

The current generation of leglockers hasn't spent much time working on 50/50.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

 

[BJJ_Rage]

I'm aware.

But if you are better at 50/50 than the other person... your feet really aren't.

The current generation of leglockers hasn't spent much time working on 50/50.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

I do, and your right, in Ryan’s case, but that doesn’t mean the position is better, it just means Ryan’s deep knowledge of the position will make him prevail more times than not in a position where both people have their feet open to attack. 411 neglates the counter attack...

 

[yetanother]

The current generation of leglockers hasn't spent much time working on 50/50.

Gordon tapped Keenan from 50/50

 

[cjd]

I do, and your right, in Ryan’s case, but that doesn’t mean the position is better, it just means Ryan’s deep knowledge of the position will make him prevail more times than not in a position where both people have their feet open to attack. 411 neglates the counter attack...

Right. I wasn't arguing that 50/50 is a better position than 411. It obviously isn't. But I would say that, in many ways, the 50/50 (with heel hooks) is becoming a bit of a lost art as people are deliberately avoiding it in the current metagame. I suspect sooner or later we will see some people using the 50/50 as a backdoor to beat better leglockers. If you can't keep someone off your legs, it's much easier to force 50/50 than it is to outright escape. And if that's your jam...

Gordon tapped Keenan from 50/50

Fair enough.

 

[rmongler]

I do, and your right, in Ryan’s case, but that doesn’t mean the position is better, it just means Ryan’s deep knowledge of the position will make him prevail more times than not in a position where both people have their feet open to attack. 411 neglates the counter attack...

I think the point is, if you can get 50/50 from anywhere, and you can stop other people from getting their favorite leg entanglements by going to the 50/50, and you specialize in the 50/50, well, then it just a numbers game at that point, and your dice are loaded.

 

[cjd]

I think the point is, if you can get 50/50 from anywhere, and you can stop other people from getting their favorite leg entanglements by going to the 50/50, and you specialize in the 50/50, well, then it just a numbers game at that point, and your dice are loaded.

:high five emoji:

 

[trustdoesntrust]

Right. I wasn't arguing that 50/50 is a better position than 411. It obviously isn't. But I would say that, in many ways, the 50/50 (with heel hooks) is becoming a bit of a lost art as people are deliberately avoiding it in the current metagame. I suspect sooner or later we will see some people using the 50/50 as a backdoor to beat better leglockers. If you can't keep someone off your legs, it's much easier to force 50/50 than it is to outright escape. And if that's your jam...
.

50/50 is just a much better position in the gi than no-gi since the gi offers far more positional opportunities. For example, Buchecha-style inverted kneebars, stepovers to "unfair 50/50," and 50/50 back takes, are just not going to work well without having the gi as leverage. Plus, the constant threat of being heel hooked short-circuits many of your attacks. Felipe Pena was able to control Gordon Ryan from 50/50 in their ADCC match, but his superiority in the position only really enabled him to funnel Gordon into other leg entanglements.

 

[mataleaos]

That's one spicy move.

This is sort of a fast entry too

 

[DVD review guy]

I suspect Rickson's DVD will be like this,


And, talking about how Jiu-Jitsu sucks now. I would consider buying the DVD if he puts the challenge fight with Yoji Anjo, 1994, on it.

 

[mataleaos]

Right. I wasn't arguing that 50/50 is a better position than 411. It obviously isn't. But I would say that, in many ways, the 50/50 (with heel hooks) is becoming a bit of a lost art as people are deliberately avoiding it in the current metagame. I suspect sooner or later we will see some people using the 50/50 as a backdoor to beat better leglockers. If you can't keep someone off your legs, it's much easier to force 50/50 than it is to outright escape. And if that's your jam...

One 50/50 thing I really like is playing outside ashi, selling out for the heel hook there, and then quickly passing it over to the 50/50 inside heel hook.

It's awesome when it's timed perfectly because they tap almost right away and you're only in the 50 for a split second. if you fuck it up though and miss the heel hook as your transfer the leg across then you're in a 50/50 battle.

I agree that the 50/50 is becoming a lost art.

 

[mataleaos]

Gordon tapped Keenan from 50/50

To be fair it wasn't a straight 5050. He had the 411 and Keenan managed to get his far leg in 50/50. So it was like a 411/5050 hybrid.

time coded for 1:26:34

 

[rmongler]

This is sort of a fast entry too

That butterfly cut under was one of the first pieces of tech Eddie Cummings busted out when he started to blow up those early EBIs.



I haven't seen him compete recently though so i dunno if his game has changed; i do know that Gordon and Gary don't really use that particular wrinkle with much frequency, perhaps because if you don't do it well you are basically putting yourself into a dope mount/smash pass situation (on a purely coincidental note, hip switching off butterfly hooks happens to be one of Gordon's most commonly utilized passing methods).

The x-guard transition is actually nearly identical in terms of formal gross motor movements, the main difference being you have control of the other leg rather than cutting into it from upper body grips, which confounds most 'usual' passing methods.

 

[mataleaos]

That butterfly cut under was one of the first pieces of tech Eddie Cummings busted out when he started to blow up those early EBIs.



I haven't seen him compete recently though so i dunno if his game has changed; i do know that Gordon and Gary don't really use that particular wrinkle with much frequency, perhaps because if you don't do it well you are basically putting yourself into a dope mount/smash pass situation (on a purely coincidental note, hip switching off butterfly hooks happens to be one of Gordon's most commonly utilized passing methods).

The x-guard transition is actually nearly identical in terms of formal gross motor movements, the main difference being you have control of the other leg rather than cutting into it from upper body grips, which confounds most 'usual' passing methods.

At this point I mostly prefer to control the free leg before doing the leg work to get the position. Either from the reverse x guard position like you described there. Or from the top by scooping it up during a back-step entry.

If I don't get the free leg I'm almost preferring to fall towards it anyways. I used to always like falling towards the side of the trapped leg and I still feel that side has the most control. But I roll with some good heel hookers and they hide the heel and are so good at turning away if I don't grab the free leg that I'd rather risk a split second of extra security to grab that far leg and then go back towards the more secure hip if I feel like I need to.

Craig Jones talks about this idea on the final chapter of the 2nd disc of his new set. It's almost like a belly down 4-11/saddle position while you're controlling their free leg too. I've only been playing with it for a little bit but it feels super strong and the extra pressure for the belly down finish on the inside heel hook gets insta-taps.

 

[mataleaos]

I'm aware.

But if you are better at 50/50 than the other person... your feet really aren't.

The current generation of leglockers hasn't spent much time working on 50/50.

Do you see where I'm going with this?

This is a good point.

I rolled with a 50/50 heel hook specialist and he tore me up with inside heel hooks from 50/50. The way he was protecting his feet was way ahead of anything I've ever seen and anytime I thought I was figuring out a good way to separate his feet to go for my heel hook, I realized he was making me split my attention and he had split my own feet for his heel hook.

There's always going to be a place for the 50/50 with heel hooks, even if it's on the periphery these days.

 

[BJJ_Rage]

This is a good point.

I rolled with a 50/50 heel hook specialist and he tore me up with inside heel hooks from 50/50. The way he was protecting his feet was way ahead of anything I've ever seen and anytime I thought I was figuring out a good way to separate his feet to go for my heel hook, I realized he was making me split my attention and he had split my own feet for his heel hook.

There's always going to be a place for the 50/50 with heel hooks, even if it's on the periphery these days.

Were you playing outside hh vs inside hh?

 

[mataleaos]

Were you playing outside hh vs inside hh?

We were both going for inside heel hooks on each other from the classic 5050 position

 

[TheMood]

Did anybody have problems with getting these DVDs? My order was placed on the 20th and I have not received any shipping information. The order status has not updated nine days later. My credit card was charged already as well. I emailed the company two days ago and was told the DVDs would ship first thing in the morning. I have never ordered anything from BJJ Fanatics and this is not a great first shopping experience at this point.