Does Demian Maia dislike side control in MMA? Why?

GKY said:
High level guys don't tap to that ankle lock, especially if there is money on the line. Same thing with arm crushes, work great in the gym but less great in competition when the adrenaline is flowing.
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Pain submission then rather than dislocation/break worries then?
I always thought it was cheap, but I looked it up the other day and saw a Kurt Ossiander video on it. It would be interesting to see if somebody with some real horse power cranking on it could do something with it.
Thanks!
 
As far as I know it's called the saturday night ride in wrestling.
 
yetanother said:
What does the IBJJF point system have to do with it?
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I think many BJJ guys will pass to side control then mount instead of mounting directly because it earns them the additional points. In pure grappling it's a good strategy but not optimal for MMA.
 
lts5025 said:
I think many BJJ guys will pass to side control then mount instead of mounting directly because it earns them the additional points. In pure grappling it's a good strategy but not optimal for MMA.
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Passing directly to mount gives you the same amount of points as passing to side control and mounting.
 
yetanother said:
Passing directly to mount gives you the same amount of points as passing to side control and mounting.
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You're right. Shows what I know about competition BJJ.
 
lechien said:
I thought it was pretty self explinatory.

Positional dominance like mount rather side control is rewarded under ibjjf rules

Is there any other martial arts that reward positional dominance?

I thought ts was asking why maia prefer Mount over side control.
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we are talking in a mma fight. there's no way he prefers mount because in ibjff he would get more points for it.
 
BJJ_Rage said:
side control no gi its better to attack than mount, but in mma, you can punch, so mount > side control.
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I'm pretty inexperienced in BJJ so I'm sure more experienced posters will say otherwise, but I find KOB to be the GOAT gnp position, esp on the fence. Mount is definitely better than side for strikes, but I can get so much more force from KOB.
 
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j123 said:
I'm pretty inexperienced. in BJJ so I'm sure more experienced posters will say otherwise, but I find KOB to be the GOAT gnp position, esp on the fence. Mount is definitely better than side for strikes, but I can get so much more force from KOB.
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Knob is not nearly as stable as mount, unless the guy is half out, it's quite hard to keep someone pinned long enough to produce a tko, I'm not saying is not possible, just quite hard, mount is more stable, although it doesn't produce as much damage as knob, it's good enough to hurt your opponent or making turn and take his back
 
My two cents.

Side control is awesome for submissions. But it doesn't keep the opponent down as well as half guard or full mount does. And when you get insanely pumped up and explosive guys in mma, with out the controlling addition of the gi, it can be harder to keep a man on his back in side control. So you gotta hope you tap him out or tko him before he explodes and scrambles to his knees.

Half guard is good for control, because while they might have one of your legs locked up, you have one of their legs locked up as well. Which takes away their ability to scramble to their knees because you can lock down the leg. Mount is great because of the pressure you can put, and if they are able to bump and scramble to their knees, it automatically gives up the back, which is super dangerous.

So yeah, for MMA, full mount and half guard will probably be preferred over side control. However, if you're in half guard, you're gonna have to stay a bit more active, cause you can get stood up here. It's super rare to ever get stood up in side control, and pretty much never happens in full mount.

Things to thinks about. Control, vs submission attacks, vs fighting within the rules.
 
rmongler said:
Half-guard yes, full mount no.
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you didn't really keep reading did you? I wrote that the guy on bottom can bump and scramble to his knees when mounted, but his back is given up almost instantly. So he hasn't really escaped has he. He can get flatten out, then mounted again, etc.
 
BJJ NINJA said:
you didn't really keep reading did you? I wrote that the guy on bottom can bump and scramble to his knees when mounted, but his back is given up almost instantly. So he hasn't really escaped has he. He can get flatten out, then mounted again, etc.
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When someone is mounting someone, though they are past the legs, their weight is still 'loaded' on top of the opponent, and hence vulnerable to getting their base disrupted. As opposed to side mount, where you are in space, and free to adjust stance or drive to increase pressure.

Elbow escapes are much higher percentage than most side control escapes.





 
lts5025 said:
I think many BJJ guys will pass to side control then mount instead of mounting directly because it earns them the additional points. In pure grappling it's a good strategy but not optimal for MMA.
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It doesn't get you additional points. Pass to side control first (3) then go to mount (4) gets the same as directly passing to mount (3+4). Its just easier to pass to side control, there's more pathways to the side and easier to control the upper body
 
BJJ Scout has a good tutorial - but really does not answer your question as to why he does not side mount.

As someone in the thread said - his destination does not include going to side (pass to mount and or back control).
 
AW9000+ said:
Beginner BJJ question here. I've heard that there are more submissions possible in side control but when I watch Demian Maia's UFC fights, I rarely see him go to side control to strike and/or attempt submissions and seems to just want to work towards mount.

Is this because at higher levels it's harder to pull off submissions in side control, or it's easier to escape, or just a preference?
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Why go to side control, when you can establish 3/4 mount then force your opponent to roll over and take his back.

Eddie Bravo does some good breakdowns on it on the Joe Rogans fight companion. If I was sherdog savvy I would upload it.

@Bubblun hit it on the button

Bubblun said:
Maia always goes from the half guard straight to mount.

Force half guard ---> go to 3/4 mount ----> punch the opponent in the face, he will usually give the full mount himself -----> try an arm triangle or punch him, if he turns take the back -----> if you have the back put him in the body triangle and try to choke him, if he doesn't give his neck and the round is almost ended try an hail mary armbar.

That's Maia game in a nutshell.
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What I've also noticed about Maia is that he doesnt like to risk taking the armbar from mount. Like in fight with Yakolev the Polish guy he stayed in mount. didnt go for an armbar and i think had a hard time finishing because yakolev wasnt giving his back (from memory)

Maia does what Maia do :D
 
rmongler said:
When someone is mounting someone, though they are past the legs, their weight is still 'loaded' on top of the opponent, and hence vulnerable to getting their base disrupted. As opposed to side mount, where you are in space, and free to adjust stance or drive to increase pressure.

Elbow escapes are much higher percentage than most side control escapes.





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This is why you have to move to high mount or s mount right away, take away the hips. When your weight is on the upper torso, good luck trying to elbow escape or get those heel hooks.
 
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