Do you think USA war crimes during the Iraq war are overlooked? Is it all over?

[Voodoo_Child906]

You asked about people killed after a conviction that may have been wrong.

You didnt ask about a judgment and an appeal prior to (to which i say fuck it). We have the capacity to do better investigating and spend more time in court to be doubly sure. Stop appointing and hiring stupid and lazy lawyers and judges and councilmen. Stop allowing the lowest of barrel police and detectives. Problems will diminish greatly.

There are appeals After judgement as well. We can improve everything like you said but we could still be wrong and an innocent man could be killed without an appeals process. Why would you want to get rid of that and kill them right away?

 

[Badger67]

There are appeals After judgement as well. We can improve everything like you said but we could still be wrong and an innocent man could be killed without an appeals process. Why would you want to get rid of that and kill them right away?

Ever see the amount of taxpayer money wasted on inmates in general, and those who are waiting 20 to 50 years to die? Plus the appeal processes. Such a waste. And we have nobody but ourselves to blame for hiring inept professionals.

Sorry, but i have no sympathies for rapists, pedophiles, serial killers or hardcore murderers.

The rest are welcome to appeal, or sit in jail and hopefully be rehabilitated. But for the lowest of low, no mercy. Id be willing to allow a labor for life option, however where their community benefits from their highly supervised toil.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Ever see the amount of taxpayer money wasted on inmates in general, and those who are waiting 20 to 50 years to die? Plus the appeal processes. Such a waste. And we have nobody but ourselves to blame for hiring inept professionals.

Sorry, but i have no sympathies for rapists, pedophiles, serial killers or hardcore murderers.

The rest are welcome to appeal, or sit in jail and hopefully be rehabilitated. But for the lowest of low, no mercy. Id be willing to allow a labor for life option, however where their community benefits from their highly supervised toil.

Do you have sympathy for those who were wrongly convicted of those hardcore crimes? If there's no appeal process for them then they die immediately.

 

[Badger67]

Do you have sympathy for those who were wrongly convicted of those hardcore crimes? If there's no appeal process for them then they die immediately.

Yes, but we will never be perfect and ive always believed id rather 99 legit convicted die with 1 innocent die than allowing appeals and misprocesses and loopholes allowing the guilty to go free and reign in society once more and get better at their crimes.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Yes, but we will never be perfect and ive always believed id rather 99 legit convicted die with 1 innocent die than allowing appeals and misprocesses and loopholes allowing the guilty to go free and reign in society once more and get better at their crimes.

I disagree but thanks for your honesty.

 

[ironfist05]

I don't think you're going to find the intensity of "war crimes" - for the sake of argument you're interested in an international court trying US soldiers for abusing some criminals (some maybe not) in prison camps? You're aware our conflict with uniformed soldiers was less than a month? I believe we did internally punish many soldiers for violations to the UCMJ. There were multiple sources citing the number of investigations and sentencing. You essentially said don't use war as an excuse but, really war. We're you there? I personally took photos of Iraqis who were tortured and murdered in droves due to sectarian violence and I'll assure you those culprits went unpunished.

If you're sincerely interested in this then go for it.

I think you'd be surprised. America bombed the shit out of Cambodia and Laos for years, killing probably at least hundreds of thousands (the estimates the government officially puts out are laughably low). Maybe they weren't cutting peoples heads off with katanas, but hte death tolls were no less signficant. I'm sorry to hear that you took those photographs and I'd love to see those who committed sectarian based war crimes tried, but that seems unlikely as we can't really identify everybody who did that. We can do it with the US and should hold them to justice. The fact that hte invasion of Iraq was only a month doesn't really matter; the Rape of Nanking lasted around that time, and while the Rape of Nanking was clearly worse, it's pretty clear that not enough American soldiers or generals have been held to standard (I'm glad that a few were, but clearly not enough). So no, war is not an excuse.

This is more whataboutism than a concrete case for why we shouldn't hold American soldiers and generals to justice.

 

[Stoic1]

If you really want to see the depths of the United States hypocrisy on war crimes I would like for you to read a bit on Unit 731 at the end of the war.

 

[helltoupee]

You don't get it, the "compelling evidence" concerning WMD's was based on the Intel they got from Al-Libi. The CIA, Powell, Rumsfeld, Cheney and W all believed it and it was bullshit the entire time.

That was just an excuse.

Read the Downing Street Memo.

Read "Rebuilding America's Defenses" by the PNAC.

Before they even took office, the neocons were looking for any excuse possible to go into the Middle East.

 

[Badger67]

I disagree but thanks for your honesty.

Im glad we can disagree in a civil manner.

 

[helltoupee]

I think you'd be surprised. America bombed the shit out of Cambodia and Laos for years, killing probably at least hundreds of thousands (the estimates the government officially puts out are laughably low). Maybe they weren't cutting peoples heads off with katanas, but hte death tolls were no less signficant. I'm sorry to hear that you took those photographs and I'd love to see those who committed sectarian based war crimes tried, but that seems unlikely as we can't really identify everybody who did that. We can do it with the US and should hold them to justice. The fact that hte invasion of Iraq was only a month doesn't really matter; the Rape of Nanking lasted around that time, and while the Rape of Nanking was clearly worse, it's pretty clear that not enough American soldiers or generals have been held to standard (I'm glad that a few were, but clearly not enough). So no, war is not an excuse.

This is more whataboutism than a concrete case for why we shouldn't hold American soldiers and generals to justice.

Don't forget that the bombing of Cambodia also paved the way for Pol Pot.

 

[ironfist05]

Don't forget that the bombing of Cambodia also paved the way for Pol Pot.

yes, as did the removal of lon nol. In fact, they interviewed a bunch of ex-Khmer Rouge guys (foot soldiers, not hte higher ups) and found that they were basically illiterate with next to no knowledge of communism, but thye pretty much all hated America for bombing eastern cambodia.

 

[Phr3121]

Huh. That's like you attacking your neighbor to your left because the neighbor to your right shot your dog

What in the holy name of fuck does 9/11 have to do with the Iraq war?

You guys are missing the point. Agreed, Iraq and Afghanistan were different, but the concept of fighting in a war is the same. Both Iraq and Afghanistan had individuals killing Americans. I don't agree with the Iraqi invasion, but once in, the fighting and killing was the same as in Afghanistan. We are talking about 'war crimes'. Treatment of 'prisoners', or 'terrorists', apply equally in both countries. I shed no tears for the prisoners of either country who were involved with the killing of Americans.

 

[Throwin Bombs]

I find the thought of rules or guidelines for war to be hilarious when the point of the conflict is to inflict the ultimate consequence, death, on your opponent.

Most of what was described was absolutely nothing except maybe the sodomy so no I don't care.

 

[Prime Rib]

Im glad we can disagree in a civil manner.

One of you needs to be tortured ASAP.

 

[tramendous]

I mean, logically, we could have invaded Indonesia to end several genocides, but nobody called for that or even cared.

And even that is underselling it since the US supported the murderous regime of indonesia. They also supported Saddam when he was killing Iranians like a good attack dog.

 

[woodguyatl]

From who are you hearing that? Definitely not true especially with the younger population. I kid u not, you'd be surprised at how they view things

I live in OC, California. I worked years in Garden Grove(look it up). I worked with hundreds of Viet Immigrants. You'd be surprised at their feelings towards their own government and China

Is Viet preferred of Vietnamese?

 

[Sauron]

I love the US as a country, but it gets away with murder - literally. None of the guys who lied to the world have been held accountable. Hell, the same guys (John Bolton etc) who argued for the Iraq war are coming back into power like 1000's of US soldiers, and 100's of 1000's of Iraqi's didn't die because of their lies.

So when the US gets up on its high horse about Russia I just think: you opened the door to all of this.

 

[DoomPatrol]

Operation Red Wings: 19 Americans killed for the freedom of 3 Taliban nationals in Afghanistan in 2005.

Operation Red Wing: 19 Americans killed because Navy SEALs fucked up a mission and got caught by fucking farmers. Don't blame the fact on them not murdering unarmed civilians. They got caught and suffered the consequences. That's rule number one of deep recon. Don't get caught.


Marcus' team flew in and landed so close that the entire valley knew they were in the area somewhere.

 

[Brazilian HKD]

I love the US as a country, but it gets away with murder - literally. None of the guys who lied to the world have been held accountable. Hell, the same guys (John Bolton etc) who argued for the Iraq war are coming back into power like 1000's of US soldiers, and 100's of 1000's of Iraqi's didn't die because of their lies.

So when the US gets up on its high horse about Russia I just think: you opened the door to all of this.

As someone who loves this country. Yeah, there is a need for a moral retrospective. From using tractors to bury Iraqi soldiers alive, to torture prisoners, to drone entire families and teach torture methods to dictatorships,
The American Government needs to be hold accountable. I find it disgusting that the right claims these things to be justifiable, while the left is freaking defending institutions like the CIA and FBI who did a lot of shit in other countries.
Be it Reagan with the Contras, Bushes with Iraq, Clintons with the bombing of a hospital and the fall of Lybia, or Obama with the extra judicial drone executions, I laugh when a partizan hack tries to defend any of these actions.

 

[Phr3121]

Operation Red Wing: 19 Americans killed because Navy SEALs fucked up a mission and got caught by fucking farmers. Don't blame the fact on them not murdering unarmed civilians. They got caught and suffered the consequences. That's rule number one of deep recon. Don't get caught.

Right, and you of course never made a mistake as a Marine. Only a POG would even think or write that. They could have shot the 3 civilians. Would that have been the right thing to do? 16 Americans were killed trying to rescue the original 4, but I'm beginning to think you don't know how that process works. "You place your life in another man's hands, he places his life in yours."