Do you dislike the mainstream media?

[Hollywood Jack]

This is what I said, "that applies perhaps even more to your loony claims about the Clinton Foundation and Haiti or to Pizzagate or Clinton Body Count CTs, etc." It applies to your loony claims ... or to (other loony claims).



Again, I think it's just you've been trained to hate the Clintons so you're open to believing crazy claims about them. That's normal, and that's why I think most people would do better to blindly trust reputable sources than to apply skepticism where they see fit.

I just wanted to make it clear I didn't believe in the Pizzagate crap, not that I thought you thought that.

Clinton was A LOT better than the presidents who succeeded him and Hillary would have been better than Trump, so not sure how I was trained to hate them. I think we've exhausted this by now.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Clinton was A LOT better than the presidents who succeeded him and Hillary would have been better than Trump, so not sure how I was trained to hate them. I think we've exhausted this by now.

OK, we've exhausted it, but it's baffling to me that you can believe all the stuff you apparently believe about Hillary and still think that she would be acceptable as president. If I thought that about someone close to the presidency, even I thought that on policy she was the better option, I'd be trying to alert law enforcement, Congressional leaders in the other party, etc. I hope you realize that that's a normal response. Politicians are pretty much interchangeable, and there would be no justification for tolerating that kind of thing, and few actually would. I've always just assumed when I see people say that they think Hillary is some kind of corrupt monster that they're just lying to minimize Trump's corruption or for some other political reason.

Also, I'm not sure how anyone could think that Bill was remotely on Obama's level as a president.

 

[lilelvis]

OK, we've exhausted it, but it's baffling to me that you can believe all the stuff you apparently believe about Hillary and still think that she would be acceptable as president. If I thought that about someone close to the presidency, even I thought that on policy she was the better option, I'd be trying to alert law enforcement, Congressional leaders in the other party, etc. I hope you realize that that's a normal response. Politicians are pretty much interchangeable, and there would be no justification for tolerating that kind of thing, and few actually would. I've always just assumed when I see people say that they think Hillary is some kind of corrupt monster that they're just lying to minimize Trump's corruption or for some other political reason.

Also, I'm not sure how anyone could think that Bill was remotely on Obama's level as a president.

I think peoples thoughts about Hillary's corruption predates Trump by quite a bit. Just saying.

 

[SammyPops]

wow at 80% dislike. I wonder if thie is a US thing?

I check out CBC and BBC webistes every morning and try to read the Globe.

 

[all caps]

I've always just assumed when I see people say that they think Hillary is some kind of corrupt monster that they're just lying to minimize Trump's corruption or for some other political reason.

This is probably why you think everyone would be better off blindly trusting media. You seem to think anyone who questions the narrative believes every crazy conspiracy to ever exist.

 

[Quequeg]

Yes, I mostly watch BBC, however they are way more honest then anyone in the Trump administration.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I think peoples thoughts about Hillary's corruption predates Trump by quite a bit. Just saying.

Well, there was a lunatic fringe. Her approval rating was in the mid-60s before the pre-presidential smear campaign started.

This is probably why you think everyone would be better off blindly trusting media. You seem to think anyone who questions the narrative believes every crazy conspiracy to ever exist.

No, I just think that most people don't do as good a job of uncovering news and identifying truth as the MSM, even if they have access to the MSM output. Or to put it another way: MSM > MSM + other sources * your judgment ("your" meaning not necessarily, though probably, you, sniper, but the average person). The judgment factor is obviously key, as the ceiling on the right side of that is way higher than the left side, but the floor is also way lower, and the average and mode are lower.

 

[KeepItRealist]

The John Birch Society at the height of the Cold War would not try to spread the kind of conspiracy theories about Russia the mainstream media in 2018 is helping to promote.

 

[lilelvis]

Well, there was a lunatic fringe. Her approval rating was in the mid-60s before the pre-presidential smear campaign started.



No, I just think that most people don't do as good a job of uncovering news and identifying truth as the MSM, even if they have access to the MSM output. Or to put it another way: MSM > MSM + other sources * your judgment ("your" meaning not necessarily, though probably, you, sniper, but the average person). The judgment factor is obviously key, as the ceiling on the right side of that is way higher than the left side, but the floor is also way lower, and the average and mode are lower.

The 2012 race, right?

 

[TheComebackKid]

I just wanted to make it clear I didn't believe in the Pizzagate crap, not that I thought you thought that.

Clinton was A LOT better than the presidents who succeeded him and Hillary would have been better than Trump, so not sure how I was trained to hate them. I think we've exhausted this by now.

Curious, how so?

 

[Senzo Tanaka]

Cable news/news for profit changed everything. It was the original form of click bait. Come up with the most sensational stories to get the most views to bring in the most advertising dollars. You almost never heard good news on the news at that point.

I try to stick to only reading news and only on sites that offer no opinion and just give the news stories. Sites like Reuters, AP and NPR. You do see the occasional opinion pop in there but it's infinitely better than something like CNN, Fox, etc.

If I want opinions and debate, I will go to sites or watch shows that debate the news. If I want to just know the news, just give me the news. No bias. X happened. That's all I care about. I'll form my own opinion.

 

[Quequeg]

Bring back the Fairness doctrine, which the R's shitcanned .

 

[sweede]

Great points. As for your question, I couldn't say based on observation (big country!), but here's a story on some polling results:

https://www.axios.com/trump-effect-...ews-9c1bbf70-0054-41dd-b506-0869bb10f08c.html

To some extent, it's a partisan issue, though the numbers would look bad for Democrats if there weren't Republicans to contrast with. IMO, the single biggest problem in American politics today is that the vast majority of voters in one party simply reject information that they don't like if it comes from non-partisan sources. There's a right and left in every country and at all times, but why is the American right so unhinged? I think it's because of the existence of an alternative-reality media structure and a lack of trust in real news. You knew before the Trump investigation started, any findings of impropriety would be dismissed and the investigating team would be accused of being biased or criminal. You know that any media finding that contradicts Trump's claims will be accused of lying. If GOP policy doesn't have the promised effect, Fox or Breitbart will say it did and anyone who looks at the issue honestly will be accused of bias. Etc. That gives politicians license to push the envelope on corruption and dishonesty.

The argument that they make is that the mainstream media (large, general-audience media companies) is biased left so they are needed to balance it. The problem is that the MSM is already trying to be balanced (so much so that they skew right to head off accusations). So bias on a grand scale is right, I think. Look up what percentage of Americans don't believe the findings of climate scientists or think that regressive tax cuts grow the economy, not to mention how many believe crazy conspiracy theories about left-leaning politicians (as of Aug. 2016, about three-quarters of Republicans doubted that Obama was born in America, and God only knows how many believe that Clinton was using her charitable foundation to steal money, not to mention even crazier theories).

It is quite remarkable. Here I´m thinking about USA as the single greatest influence for the majority of the western world. Coca cola, jeans, super markets, fast food, black friday, halloween, cars, english words in our language etc etc. It´s unreal to think about it. Sure we have our cultures and can boast with history and buildings that are dating back longer than yours, and as my history teacher once said "you have to know the past to know your identity". So what went wrong? Why this trust issues? It can´t just be political?

- 92% of Republicans think media intentionally reports fake news
- Most people say they can spot a fake piece of news

When I read through Axios article, I was imagining Russia and what people Really think of their domestic news, and I´m very much convinced that if the russian average joe could answer anonymously, the numbers would be the same as the republicans. And in this case, a Putin and company telling them a story, because they can and they rule the media. And it´s incredible that you as a democracy have this FOX channel openly republican and they are still airing. Don´t you have any institutions dealing with abuse of monopoly and fair game in general? You did that to Microsoft once in a time when Explorer was the alpha browser. It feels like one of those strange times when I change channels on my TV, and suddenly the GOD channel is on display and it is always the same old man with glasses preaching. The signal is not always there, but if feels like they are hacking the system and trying to catch the dumb with this.

It´s exhausting to read through your depressing text, and will it ever be better? I´m thinking of Sisyphos.

 

[Only Here for Attachments]

Yes, all mainstream media. Fox News isn't any better than MSNBC when you really get down to it.

 

[Jack V Savage]

It´s exhausting to read through your depressing text, and will it ever be better? I´m thinking of Sisyphos.

Man, I don't know. I used to think that we'd hit bottom soon and people would realize it. But the problem is that the lack of trust itself keeps people ignorant. Almost immediately after we recovered from the worst financial collapse in more than half a century, we started back with the deregulation stuff that led us there in the first place. Almost immediately after we fixed our debt situation, we blew it up again. The lack of trust in unbiased information prevents us from learning from the past. It's a lock that roughly 30% of the population will never accept the findings of the Trump investigation because they'll just write it off as being lies, and they'll have alternative media sources that back them up. Information pollution/distrust of sources that aren't openly biased in the direction of the consumer is the biggest challenge facing our country today, but I have no idea how to cure it.

 

[all caps]

It is quite remarkable. Here I´m thinking about USA as the single greatest influence for the majority of the western world. Coca cola, jeans, super markets, fast food, black friday, halloween, cars, english words in our language etc etc. It´s unreal to think about it. Sure we have our cultures and can boast with history and buildings that are dating back longer than yours, and as my history teacher once said "you have to know the past to know your identity". So what went wrong? Why this trust issues? It can´t just be political?

- 92% of Republicans think media intentionally reports fake news
- Most people say they can spot a fake piece of news

When I read through Axios article, I was imagining Russia and what people Really think of their domestic news, and I´m very much convinced that if the russian average joe could answer anonymously, the numbers would be the same as the republicans. And in this case, a Putin and company telling them a story, because they can and they rule the media. And it´s incredible that you as a democracy have this FOX channel openly republican and they are still airing. Don´t you have any institutions dealing with abuse of monopoly and fair game in general? You did that to Microsoft once in a time when Explorer was the alpha browser. It feels like one of those strange times when I change channels on my TV, and suddenly the GOD channel is on display and it is always the same old man with glasses preaching. The signal is not always there, but if feels like they are hacking the system and trying to catch the dumb with this.

It´s exhausting to read through your depressing text, and will it ever be better? I´m thinking of Sisyphos.

Fox is in direct competition with the left wing media channels (personally, I think they are all in it together and playing off one another to the detriment of us stupid citizens, but that may be a little too conspiratorial for you) - so for anyone to paint fox as this propaganda outlet while saying the others are nothing but honest truth is a perfect example of political bias.

When a Democrat is president, the news media roles flip. CNN and the other left media sing nothing but praise, while fox is on the attack all day.

You are getting played for a fool by jack, because that's what these people who participate in this partisan bullshit do, they try and convince you that THEY are the real news media and have all the truth.

To be honest, as I said before, all the media plays off each other (ones the good guy, ones the bad guy) and they push worthless stories to keep Americans in the dark (stormy Daniel's, kkk, Obama's birth certificate) so we have no idea what's going on in the world (why are we bombing yemen? Why are we bombing Syria? Why did we destroy iraq?)

 

[tonni]

Most repulsive group of people there is.

Pedophiles?

 

[dormammu]

Do you dislike the mainstream media? Fox News, MSNBC, CNN, I just want to know where normal people stand. I watch Fox News and it makes me cringe. Then I watch CNN and it makes me cringe.

The Daily Show was my #1 news source for like 10 years because Stewart made fun of everyone. Now South Park is my unbiased news outlet.

Anyone that doesnt vote is fake news.

Fox and Cnn both are cringe worthy, its not about the news, but spin and commentary on the news.

 

[Hollywood Jack]

Curious, how so?

Lack of credible evidence. If you don't mind, I'd rather not rehash these arguments, though. I already laid out my opinion in those threads, as did you and others with opposing views.

 

[Jack V Savage]

When a Democrat is president, the news media roles flip. CNN and the other left media sing nothing but praise, while fox is on the attack all day.

You've never actually watched CNN, have you? They're a mainstream media source, and they were very hard on Obama.

You are getting played for a fool by jack, because that's what these people who participate in this partisan bullshit do, they try and convince you that THEY are the real news media and have all the truth.

No, the MSM and specialty media (like Fox) have a fundamentally different business model.