Do you care about Your health / Natural health products / Supplements ?

TS-

KK and I, along with a FEW others that frequent this board have been fighting CODEX for years.
Trust me when I say that you are speaking on deaf ears.

Are you in the business?

I know..I completely agree and understand.

The problem is..the only people who can make a difference are regular Americans. Who just happen to be the ones in denial..

Thanks for your input though, It really means a lot to me that there is other people like me out there fighting Codex and the powers that be.

TinFoil_DB52B2F1-0E7F-A983-F0F9D799A20B06C8.jpg

Just keep living in denial my friend, Denial won't help you. Facts will.
 
Aside from posting on this forum, how exactly are you fighting against CODEX? Are you a politician, a lobbyist, a businessman with clout? Are you a secret agent working in the WHO slowly trying to subvert the iron fist rule of the matrix... er, WTO?
 
Aside from posting on this forum, how exactly are you fighting against CODEX? Are you a politician, a lobbyist, a businessman with clout? Are you a secret agent working in the WHO slowly trying to subvert the iron fist rule of the matrix... er, WTO?

Theres a lot of ways you can fight against it, however you need numbers to truly make a difference. What we need to do is call MP's and government officials and let them know exactly how we feel about it, because NOT ALL of them are corrupt...Some of them can make a serious difference. The other way you can help is by making ordinary people like you or me aware of what is really going on, and encourage them to stand up for their rights and freedoms. It is not too late to stop this, and if we actually worked together instead of argued about it..we could make a difference. I don't know about you, but I like being healthy..I like having the freedom to use natural health products/ nutrition supplements/ and vitamins..

Considering that the nutrition in our food is already going down at a steady pace, I think we would need all of those things to ensure a healthy body and lifestyle..On top of that, many people rely on these things for their very life..and if they were taken away, they would simply have to rely on the dangerous of the pharmaceutical industry.

I'm not going too far into this subject, But all I want people to do is to become aware..and fight for their freedom like so many are. I found that people as of late have been drawn into a bubble or "comfort zone" if you will. When you tell them something that does not correspond with these, they attack you..and say "tin foil hat" remarks. Even though the information they are actually trying to inform you of, is in fact true. If these people actually thought for a second and did some research about it, they would find out many things. If something doesn't appear like it would be true, doesn't mean that it isn't. I myself had to adjust with the reality that there is more going on than meets the eye, and it was a long road.


Awareness guys..It's what we need to do in order to save our rights and freedoms on this planet from certain destruction.

Even if nobody dies, This is still a serious issue..and would result in the loss of personal health freedom for 97% of the planet. The 3% of course being the rich, and powerful. Educate yourself, we all have the knowledge inside of us you just need to bring it out.
 
As for Canada's C-51 bill. I don't imagine it making it very far. Our government is too damn lazy to do anything other than sit on it's ass. I don't see a problem with some regulation towards the snake oil' natural healing companies that promise to cure cancer, aids, et al. But exactly what herbs/supplements are going to be banned. Don't give me the "They'll ban everything, man!" Be specific.

As far as I can see, the only common denominator from all these links that you've posted, is that their all from daft-hippy 'tree hugging' websites.
 
I'll make you a deal TS. If this shit happens within the next ten years, I owe you a beer.
 
I'll make you a deal TS. If this shit happens within the next ten years, I owe you a beer.

Shit I'll buy him a 12-pack if it will put an end to the doomsday threads until then.
 
Shit I'll buy him a 12-pack if it will put an end to the doomsday threads until then.

I would be calling this a dooms day, doom and gloom bs...Because people have been claiming that for thousands of years..But the fact is that there is laws revolving around everything stated in this forum..If everybody was educated about it enough, they would realize that this isn't a joke..or anything like that. I'm legitimately a skeptic, and I know in my heart this is real..It has nothing to do with dooms day, everything to do with taking our rights and freedoms away as citizens.

As for Canada's C-51 bill. I don't imagine it making it very far. Our government is too damn lazy to do anything other than sit on it's ass. I don't see a problem with some regulation towards the snake oil' natural healing companies that promise to cure cancer, aids, et al. But exactly what herbs/supplements are going to be banned. Don't give me the "They'll ban everything, man!" Be specific.

As far as I can see, the only common denominator from all these links that you've posted, is that their all from daft-hippy 'tree hugging' websites.

People like you are the reason we haven't been able to stop what the FDA and the government is doing.
 
Cory_Pilfold, after reading some of the C-51 bill, I gotta say I don't find too much wrong with it. In fact it could clean up some of these bullshit "natural health" stores...

For example the part of prohibiting food/therapeutic products: C-51

5. Foods


Deception, etc.



5. (1) No person shall manufacture, process, label, package, sell, import for sale or advertise a food in a manner that is false, misleading or deceptive or is likely to create an erroneous impression regarding its character, value, quantity, composition, merit, safety or origin.

.
.
.

Therapeutic Products

No clinical trial without authorization



10. No person shall conduct a clinical trial in respect of a therapeutic product that does not have a market authorization unless they are authorized by a clinical trial authorization to do so.

Conducting controlled activity


13. No person shall conduct a controlled activity unless they are authorized by an establishment licence to do so.

Deception, etc.


14. No person shall manufacture, process, label, package, sell, import for sale or advertise a therapeutic product in a manner that is false, misleading or deceptive or is likely to create an erroneous impression regarding its benefits, risks, conditions of use, quality, quantity, composition, design, construction, performance, origin or authorization status.

I fail to see the part where it says 60-80% of supplements will be banned. What I see is the placement of accountability on part of the supplement/herbal manufacturers. Something that is missing in industry. Furthermore, if it keeps places like this: Preventing AIDS - curing aids - HIV+, How to cure Aids ? HIV+,How to Prevent aids? away from the public. I see no problem with that.

And quite frankly, It seems that the only people really concerned about this bill are the supplement manufacturers and alternative medicine vendors that sell questionable products and services.

GAMMAOCAPS(051007003509).jpg
 
Cory_Pilfold, after reading some of the C-51 bill, I gotta say I don't find too much wrong with it. In fact it could clean up some of these bullshit "natural health" stores...

And quite frankly, It seems that the only people really concerned about this bill are the supplement manufacturers and alternative medicine vendors that sell questionable products and services.

GAMMAOCAPS(051007003509).jpg

Those bullshit "natural health" stores? Sir, those stores are highly regarded around here and I don't think many here think of them as bullshit.

And quite frankly, supplement manufacturers and alternative medicine vendors can sell whatever they want to here, maybe not China, but they can here in the United States.

Which is the point, you can buy or sell whatever the fuck you want to in this country, at least for the time being. I don't need big money telling me what to put in my body. I'm thoroughly educated enough to do that for myself, and if need be, my loved ones.

The TS's point, I think, is to inform everyone that you may not have the right to buy what YOU think is best for you. Scary to think of that option being taken away.
 
Cory_Pilfold, after reading some of the C-51 bill, I gotta say I don't find too much wrong with it. In fact it could clean up some of these bullshit "natural health" stores...

For example the part of prohibiting food/therapeutic products: C-51



I fail to see the part where it says 60-80% of supplements will be banned. What I see is the placement of accountability on part of the supplement/herbal manufacturers. Something that is missing in industry. Furthermore, if it keeps places like this: Preventing AIDS - curing aids - HIV+, How to cure Aids ? HIV+,How to Prevent aids? away from the public. I see no problem with that.

And quite frankly, It seems that the only people really concerned about this bill are the supplement manufacturers and alternative medicine vendors that sell questionable products and services.

GAMMAOCAPS(051007003509).jpg
good job using wikipedia to get your information, Funny seeing as this is exactly what the government is trying to get us to believe in regards to this law. When it is a bold faced lie.

The Official Stop C-51 Website - Your Freedom And Health Are At Risk!

Or go to google and type in bill c-51 dangers..Infact, Look up anything beyond wikipedia and you will find some pretty sick things about it. Including Natural health products / supplements / vitamins being criminalized to the same extent that crack and heroin is.


People like you are the reason that these people get away with what they are doing, uneducated and think they know. When In reality, They have no clue what is being cooked up in regards to their lives..Please, Look beyond wikipedia for your information..there is some very scary facts about this bill that you obviously are unaware about.


This bill has everything to do with codex alimentarius..

I suggest you educate yourself my friend.

Those bullshit "natural health" stores? Sir, those stores are highly regarded around here and I don't think many here think of them as bullshit.

And quite frankly, supplement manufacturers and alternative medicine vendors can sell whatever they want to here, maybe not China, but they can here in the United States.

Which is the point, you can buy or sell whatever the fuck you want to in this country, at least for the time being. I don't need big money telling me what to put in my body. I'm thoroughly educated enough to do that for myself, and if need be, my loved ones.

The TS's point, I think, is to inform everyone that you may not have the right to buy what YOU think is best for you. Scary to think of that option being taken away.

It's his choice whether he wants to be ignorant or not, But like you said..It's scary to think what might happen if our freedom and rights to stay healthy were taken away..in the manner they are right now.

IMO and many other peoples opinion..A lot of government information being released about this bill that has little to no truth in it, in regards to what is actually being planned.


The Official Stop C-51 Website - Your Freedom And Health Are At Risk!

read everything on this website and tell me you are all for this bill..( not you chad)


I think the fact that people are actually for this bill, show how much control the government has over majority of the population. In the eyes of majority of americans and Canadians, If the government says it..It must be true, No matter how much information and proof there is tthat says other wise.

I do however, think that is changing..and will continue to change. People are becoming more aware, and It is our job as citizens to make sure that people are truly aware of what is going on behind closed curtains.

If liberty means anything, It means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.
 
Chad, I gotta disagree with you here. What the Canadian bill C-51 is meant to do is regulate an unregulated industry. The companies that sell vitamins and protien won't run into problems unless they sell false/misleading products. Case in point, http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f15/no-nitric-oxide-scam-395555/#post10007994

Here's an interesting take on the so called "Health Freedom" (quackwatch.com) you believe in:
"Health Freedom"

William T. Jarvis, Ph.D.

Stephen Barrett, M.D.​

If quacks can't win by playing according to the rules, they try to change them by switching from the scientific to the political arena. In science, a medical claim is treated as false until proven beyond a reasonable doubt. But in politics, a medical claim may be accepted until proven false or harmful. This is why proponents of laetrile, chiropractic, orthomolecular psychiatry, chelation therapy and the like, take their case to legislators rather than scientific groups.

Quacks use the concept of "health freedom" to divert attention away from themselves and toward victims of disease with whom we are naturally sympathetic. "These poor folks should have the freedom to choose whatever treatments they want,"
cry the quacks -- with crocodile tears. They want us to overlook two things. First, no one wants to be cheated, especially in matters of life and health. Victims of disease do not demand quack treatments because they want to exercise their "rights," but because they have been deceived into thinking that they offer hope. Second, the laws against worthless nostrums are not directed against the victims of disease but at the promoters who attempt to exploit them.
Any threat to freedom strikes deeply into American cultural values. But we must also realize that complete freedom is appropriate only in a society in which everyone is perfectly trustworthy -- and no such society exists. Experience has taught us that quackery can even lead people to poison themselves, their children and their friends.

Consumer protection laws have been passed to protect desperately ill people who are vulnerable. These laws simply require that products and services offered in the health marketplace be both safe and effective. If only safety were required, any produce or service that would not kill you on the spot could be hawked to the gullible. To weaken protection, quackery's proponents seek laws to shield their activities and force insurance companies to pay for them.

Some people claim we have too much government regulation. But the issue should be one of quality not quantity. Good regulatory laws are very important. Our opposition should be to bad regulations that stifle our economy or cramp our lifestyles unnecessarily. Consumer protection laws should be preserved.

Unfortunately, some politicians seem oblivious to these basic principles and expound the "health freedom" concept as though they are doing their constituents a favor. In reality, "health freedom" constitutes a hunting license for quackery, with open season declared on the sick, the frightened, the alienated, and the desperate. It represents a return to the law of the jungle in which the strong feed upon the weak.
 
good job using wikipedia to get your information, Funny seeing as this is exactly what the government is trying to get us to believe in regards to this law. When it is a bold faced lie.

The Official Stop C-51 Website - Your Freedom And Health Are At Risk!

Or go to google and type in bill c-51 dangers..Infact, Look up anything beyond wikipedia and you will find some pretty sick things about it. Including Natural health products / supplements / vitamins being criminalized to the same extent that crack and heroin is.

First of all, I used the links you posted on the thread. The 'Stop C-51' website had a link to the bill. I used quotes from that bill (post #30) and so far in reading it I have yet to find the part where it says that health products will become the new heroin.

Where are you getting these doomsday ideas of yours? Find me the direct article in the C-51 bill. Link is here ==> C-51
 
First of all, I used the links you posted on the thread. The 'Stop C-51' website had a link to the bill. I used quotes from that bill (post #30) and so far in reading it I have yet to find the part where it says that health products will become the new heroin.

Where are you getting these doomsday ideas of yours? Find me the direct article in the C-51 bill. Link is here ==> C-51

Sorry, But you seem to me to be the type of person that believes whatever he reads..even if it's the only resource he has uncovered. Read this

Eliminates the Ability of our Elected Officials to Protect Us
Section 30(7) of Bill C-51

1. Bypassing our elected official
 
seize and detain for any time anything connected to the Act and
Regulations, such as your products and equipment. This is a significant
change. Currently, an inspector can only seize if he/she “believes on
NHPPA Draft Discussion Paper
reasonable grounds” the article is connected to a violation of the Act or
Regulations. Now an inspector can seize all of your property without
the pre-condition that he/she believes it is connected to a violation of
the Act.



The addition of “for any time” is also a change. Previously articles could
only be held for such time “as may be necessary” and in connection with a
violation. So for example, if your property was seized for a labelling
problem and you printed correct labels, the property should be released.
Now the property can be held for any time and for any reason. This raises a
question as to why such new broad and sweeping seizure powers are
necessary?
Keep in mind that Health Canada always has access to the search warrant
provisions found in the Criminal Code. These provisions have been used
by Health Canada and seem to work adequately for other federal regulatory
bodies. What is going to occur that requires seizure without a warrant,
without any reason, without reporting back to a Court or Justice, and
without any time constraints?
 enter on and pass through or over private property without any liability and
without the owner of the property having the right to object;
 charge the owner for storage of seized property. Now not only can Health
Canada seize property for any length of time, but the new s. 23.3 gives
them the right to charge you for the moving and storage. I am aware of
one company that has had product seized for 5 years. Under this new
provision they would be liable for ongoing storage costs. This is
unprecedented. Usually the government can only seize private property for
violations and it is very unusual for their to be fees for the storage of what
is then considered to be evidence;
 if inspectors believe on reasonable grounds the seized property could be
injurious to human health they can dispose of it at the expense of the
owner or direct the owner to dispose of it. Currently inspectors have to
either obtain the owner’s consent or apply to a Court to have product
destroyed. This protects the property owner by ensuring that an impartial
Judge will make the decision. It is difficult to understand why it is in
anyone’s interest to take away the current safeguards;
 property is immediately forfeited after 60 days unless an owner is
identified. No application to a Court is necessary. I find this interesting as
I was involved in a case in which product was seized but for prosecution purposes Health Canada was going to have difficulty proving ownership.
Now if in doubt Health Canada can simply seize enough of your property
that you will go bankrupt if you do not claim it and hence solve the proof of
ownership issue. It is highly unusual for their to be forfeiture without a
Court order. The costs of destruction can be charged to the owner or
person entitled to possession

Inspectors are given apparently unlimited powers to
direct your actions and do “anything” for even the
slightest suspected violation of the Act or Regulations
 
There are two types of offences under the Act: indictable offences and summary
conviction offences. Indictable offences are considered more serious than
summary conviction offences.
The current penalties are:
 for summary conviction offences a fine of up to $500 and/or imprisonment
of up to 3 months for a first offence, and a fine of up to $1,000 and/or up to
6 months incarceration for subsequent offences, and
 for indictable offences a fine of up to $5,000 and/or imprisonment for up to
3 years.
The new penalties are:
 for summary conviction offences a fine of up to $250,000 and/or
imprisonment of up to 6 months for a first offence, and a fine of up to
$500,000 and/or up to 18 months of incarceration for subsequent offences,
and
 For indictable offences a fine of up to $5,000,000 and/or imprisonment of
up to 2 years.
This is not a doubling or tripling of fines. In the case of indictable offences the
fine is increased by a multiple of 1000 times. In the case of summary conviction
offences the fine is increased by a multiple of 500 times.
This raises the question as to why it is necessary to raise the primary penalty
by multiples of 500 and 1000. This is probably unprecedented in Canadian
history.




Please note that in all of my years defending companies in Court, I have never
seen Health Canada charge only one offence. In one case there were 73
charges. Under ten would be an exception. So when considering whether a
company could survive sentencing, do not calculate a single fine for a single
offence. Rather assume multiple fines for multiple offences.
These are penalties that few manufacturers or natural health practitioners could
survive. Small and medium manufacturers along with natural health
practitioners now face bankruptcy for violations of the Act or Regulations.
Directors and officers of corporations are now also personally responsible for
violations of the Act and Regulations and so are also facing personal
bankruptcy if there is any violation of the Act or Regulations.
Need for input
This draft document is admittedly only a cursory consideration of Bill C-51.
However, because the Bill presents significant changes that may be extremely
damaging to the NHP industry, we felt that it was necessary to prepare an initial
discussion document to get the various stakeholders aware of the issues presented
by the Bill.
It is essential that stakeholders and stakeholder groups take the time to examine
Bill C-51 and to draw their own conclusions.




Bill C-51 Will:
Allow Government agents to:
-Enter private property without a warrant Section 23 (4)
-Confiscate your property at their discretion, at your cost Section 23.3 a
-Dispose of your property at their discretion, at your cost Section 23.3 c
-Seize your bank accounts without a warrant Section 23 (2) (d)
-Charge you for shipping and storage of your property Section 23.3a-b
-Store your property Indefinitely without paying you for damages Section 23 (2) (d)
-Levy fines of up to $5,000,000.00 / 2 years in jail per offence. Section 31.1

Introduce new legislation that will:
-Allow laws to be created in Canada, behind closed doors, with the assistance of foreign governments, industrial and trade organizations Section 30.7
-Allow "Crack house style" of enforcement on natural health providers Section 23.1
-Allow enforcement to be considered on more than 70% of Canadians who use NHP's Health Canada Reference
-Allow the minister, based on opinion, to shut down research without any scientific reason or evidence of risk or harm Section 18.5
-Allow the minister, based on opinion, to allow or disallow market authorizations for Natural Health Products Section 18.7 (1)
 
Sorry, But you seem to me to be the type of person that believes whatever he reads..even if it's the only resource he has uncovered. Read this

Eliminates the Ability of our Elected Officials to Protect Us
Section 30(7) of Bill C-51

1. Bypassing our elected official
 
Alright, I checked out Section 30(7) of Bill C-51 and all I got was this



Uhh... nothing about bypassing our elected officials. Now Section 31 of Bill C-51 deals with offenses which you talk about in your following posts. But what you omit to mention is that the bill is geared towards regulating the vendors and manufacturers of these so called 'health products' not the users. So as long as the vendors and manufacturers are selling legit products for legitimate purposes, everything is kosher. For example, selling garlic will not be banned. Garlic is a food. If you read section 5.1 to 7 on the bill you will see that as long as it's sold as food and not bottled in a shiny container by some company and advertised that it can cure cancer, there will be no problem.

wtf is wrong with you ? Everything that I just copy pasted was all from the stopc51.com site. and FROM the fucking bill..how about reading it bro?

I'm from canada, I know exactly what is going on in my own country..and there is a ton of people that are fucking PISSED about this. I suggest you quit talking now, because clearly from south korea..your word means little to nothing, as you have not educated yourself enough to know right from wrong..let alone how to read.
 
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