Discussion in 'Sports Bar' started by Tramero, Jul 2, 2018.
If he plays well and shows that he is healthy he will likely be gone next season for a max deal.
This is why the way the run the cap in Basketball is bullshit.
I want to see the Hampton 5 go forever or untill an actual challenger emerges.
No, they wouldn't. Pre-Durant, yes. Post Durant, fuck no.
You do realize that Harden and CP3 just took then 7 games in a series Harden didn't even perform very well. But prime Jordan and Pippen can't do that? Does not compute.
Clint Capela is pretty good too and Eric Gordon can shoot pretty damn well himself. Gordon is just a scorer on any other team but on this squad he'd the perfect 6th man.
You do realize that KD is a better scorer than MJ right? He has a more complete scoring game.NOBODY on that Bulls team is slowing him down. Draymond and Klay would make Jordan going midrange a living hell.
Oh boy lol. Durant is not a better scorer than MJ, not at all. Also Jordan, Pippen, Rodman are in the top 10-15 defensive players of all time. With those guys taking turns on KD, switching everything he would be taken out of the game. Steph getting bumped around and closed out on by MJ would reduce his effectiveness. The Bulls have 3pt shooting and can play small ball. Bulls easy.
Durant has a better shot than Jordan and kills him from the 3. Don't even bother talking basketball if you can't see that. MJ is a better defender. That's why you'd take him over Durant. These teams are predicated on better offense because nobody is stopping their top guys, only slowing them down. The Bulls aren't slowing down Durant, let alone the perimeter.
And MJ has a better mid range game, post game, drive and finish, and the killer mentality. KD is a great scorer tho, just not MJ.
That's where you're wrong. They are absolutely slowing down Durant. That's where the mental edge comes in. Hard nose defense, getting in his chest, bumping him, switching...Durant would become passive and unsure. And who is stopping the Bulls offense?
No, MJ doesnt have a better post game, drive, or finish. He doesn't have the length to. Midrange is arguable but after 15 feet it's all KD. This Killer Mentality myth needs to die. So many dudes in history have it. Larry Bird, LeBron James, Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, Dirk Nowitzki, Isiah Thomas the list goes on. That's all Jordan fans have, if this bullshit mystique about him. He's one of the best and arguably the best to ever play the game.
Nobody slows down Durant, if Jordan tries he will kill himself through the game just like LeBron does trying to do everything on the court. Jordan was NEVER close to being as responsible as a guy like LeBron and I have no reason to think Jordan could keep up at any point. The Bulls aren't gonna do shit at switching because they don't have the perimeter defenders to stop the Warriors. Without KD they can slow the game down. With KD it's shooting ducks in a barrel. They don't have the length or the athleticism to keep up with their starting 5.
I don't think you've seen Michael Jordan actually play...
Exactly. Many great players have had that mentality and it shows. KD doesn't have it tho and that also shows. Hence why he needed to join a 73 win team with 3 other all stars to actually win.
So you claim all Jordan fans have is mystique but then you turn around and call him the best ever? Which is it? And mindset is not a mystique...its a major part of the game. Did you see Lebron meltdown after regulation in game 1? That was due to mindset and lack of mental strength. KD is similar...lacks mental strength and fortitude.
Actually Jordan had about 3 or 4 seasons where he had a greater statistical output, ie responsibility, than Lebron's best year. Lebron has never had a season as great as 32/8/8...or 37/4/5...or 35/6/6...and so on. Go ahead...look it up.
You do realize the shortest person on the Bull starting lineup is 6'6, right? Lol. Harper, Jordan, Pippen, and Rodman are nothing but length and athleticism. They can all guard KD and make him work for everything. And they can all switch every player on Golden State as well.
Did you even know who the 96' Bulls are? lol
I haven't seen Jordan play? I know his limitations in todays game.
KD doesn thave a killer instinct? Go back to 2017 when he said fuck you to the Cavs and shit all over them. He is a killer. Just because he didnt repeat that performance (still finals MVP lol) doesn't mean he doesn't have it. He literally one man teamed 2017 in the finals.
Yes, you can be one of the best of all time and people blow so much smoke up their ass they aren't realistic with what he was. Larry Bird was a great player, clutch,. hard worker, great jumper, great court vision, gritty defender. Arguably one of if not the the best of all time but isn't considered top 5 anymore by most.
Which are what? It's not the mid range. It's not driving and finishing(easier to do in today's league). It's not defense. Its not athleticism. What exactly are his limitations in today's game?
KD is a killer when he's under no pressure and is playing on an all star team where all of the onus and pressure isn't on him.
Steph Curry averaged close to a triple double on 26ppg. Draymond averaged a double double. Play put up 16ppg. And Iggy guarded LeBron. But he "one man teamed it"?
You've made a lot of erroneous statements in this convo. You claimed Chicago had no length when their shortest starting player was 6'6. You claimed Jordan never had as much responsibility as LeBron when in fact he's had MORE than Lebrons best years during the 80s. You claimed KD beat the Cavs by himself when he had a ton of help from literally everyone on his team. You claimed Jordan, Pippen, and Rodman(3 of the best defenders ever) couldnt slow down KD And would die trying. You claimed KD has a better post game and drive/ finish than Jordan when that's the strongest part of his game and what his entire legacy is built on. And then you also claimed all Jordan has is mystique.
That's some terrible analysis my friend.
And yet still better than KD. Comparable scorer and shooter, better passer, better rebounder, better leader, higher IQ.
His limitations are how the scoreboard is burned up in a matter of seconds.
Oh, so now KD is a killer but only when there is no pressure. That makes no sense. It was all on him to win the last 2 finals and he did.
1. They don't have the length of Clay and Draymond on perimeter to interior transition defense. That's not even debatable. They don't have someone with KD's size, skill, and athleticism, not even debatable.
2. No, Jordan didn't. Jordan just tried to brute force his way through the playoffs and kept getting booted out of round 1. LeBron was making it to the finals. Don't play that bullshit with me.
3. You clearly don't know how defense in the NBA works. You can't stop someone like KD. Because he initiates what happens. He gets the fist step. With his speed and length you're ALWAYS behind him. So let's assume they double KD, which is their only shot at slowing him down. Good, now lets have KD kick it to whoever is open at 3. You know who loses this game 10/10 times? The Bulls. They don't have the shooters to keep up with it. So tell me how the fuck they stop KD. Klay and can play Jordan on the outside and Draymond can pick him up on the drive. They can do the same thing with Iguoadola while one of them rests on defense. If you're telling me Scottie Pippen is going to outscore Steph, Klay, Draymond, you're high. Tony Kukoc isn't picking up that slack at any point in his entire career. They are out manned offensively and defensively. Rodman can't control the pace of the game offensively. The only shot they really have at winning is he can out rebound them which isn't hard to believe, but they are still losing in volume. It's incredibly difficult for any team to make up the volume that GS is going to throw out.
4. KD Post game shits on Jordan because of his length, look at the absolute mismatches on the court in this video
5. Jordan is not a comparable scorer, he is OBJECTIVELY behind Durant when it comes to both skills in game and physical gifts. He isn't a better passer, 5.1 to 5.4 APG on their teams. It's pretty comparable. He's also objectively not a better rebounder. KD averages more rebounds. The whole point that the Bulls got Rodman was because of rebounding ability. That's pretty much all that needs to be said on the matter. Better leader? another intangible quality. I don't necessarily disagree either but that's conjecture. He was more outspoken. Better IQ? Again, not measurable other than the fact that Durant plays with more line ups and switches position way more than Jordan. So I'd be inclined to believe he's got more experience and smarter as a result.
Those people are stupid. Who cares if you list Davis at PF, or vice versa? It's a fucking label. It means nothing.
Determining the best Center in the league requires no more than to assess who plays the best at that position (and frankly that is no longer clearly defined the way the game is played in the NBA now). Put "C" instead of "PF" and Davis owns him the same. Switch their X's on the clipboard: Cousins still sucks and can't make the playoffs.
They said the same thing about Kevin Love. Don't shit on these guys like they are Al Jefferson.
I agree with you otherwise.
Oh, did Love make an playoffs appearance as something other than Lebron's backpack that I somehow missed?
Elton Brand >>>> Kevin Love & DeMarcus Cousins
Elton Brand pre-injury wasn't even a top 5 big man in the game. K-Love and Demarcus clearly are.
but Kevin Love, no fucking way. not even close to it.
That's a stupid metric: comparing today's bigs to yesteryear's.
Kevin Love averaged a whopping 15ppg in the playoffs where Lebron carried him to a title, and scored a dizzying 42 total points in that 7-game Finals. Kevin Love did more damage to his legacy with the move to Cleveland, and netting all this postseason activity, including a ring, than if he had stayed in Minnesota and kept us conned that he was a big fish via the optical illusion of the pond. He fed his doubters.
Maybe all these NBA guys chasing titles will start paying closer attention to stuff like this.
I hated Love when he came in, and thought he would be soft, and then I was made to eat crow, or so I thought, when suddenly he was averaging 26 & 13. He looked great for a while. Now he looks confused about where to stand in order to stay out of Lebron's way on the court.
Should have trusted my gut.
Kevin Love won a championship I don't see how that's damaging his legacy.
Kevin love does need touches to get going, he's got good court vision. He's been liable on defense but that's it. When you play as a #3 option or last year #2 obviously things are going to change.
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