Conor VS Prime BJ Penn

[yookfarb]

It's the WWE effect. It creates dreamers and attracts kids and dumb people. Most Conor's fans are fans of this persona first and fighting abilities last. If Conor wasn't a flashy loud mouth no one would care.

Conor's hand technique got exposed. Well, not to me, since i already knew he had nothing to offer boxing wise. His grappling skills are basic. His cardio is weak as fuck. His chin is suspect. His heart is only there if he is winning. He has a bully mentality. Once things don't go his way he turns into a very different person.

He is a good fighter, but he is far from being an all-time great. His record is nothing that impressive. And i know he is a two division champion, but when you actually look at how he got there, instead of simply looking at the title, it's easy to see that his path to achieve that status wasn't that great.

He is a young guy in his prime and already has 3 losses in his record. Didn't look great against a much smaller Chad Mendes that wasn't even properly prepared. Got finished by Nate Diaz, a guy with 10 losses in his record. Beating Eddie Alvarez doesn't place you in the all-time great list. Beating Aldo was a great accomplishment. But that's pretty much the only thing that sets him apart.

And let's not forget flash KO'ing someone doesn't make you better than that person. Matt Serra KO'd GSP. JDS KO'd Cain. Shit happens. I come from a soccer culture. Sometimes a bad team beats the best team of them all. So what? Does that make the bad team the champion? No, it earns them 3 points in the national league. You need more than 3 points to be the champion. Unfortunely, in MMA all you need to do is to beat the champion. One fight is all it takes, if the UFC gives you good opportunities to climb the rankings.

The best fighter is the one that year after year, for years, beats the crap out of everyone. That shows consistency. José Aldo beat everyone they put in front of him for 10 years. He proved over and over and over and over and over again that he was the best. Let's see Conor do that.

if prizefighting was like soccer Aldo would be that star who can't stay healthy for the season and stunk up the field in the biggest game of his career

 

[Shinobi]

if prizefighting was like soccer Aldo would be that star who can't stay healthy for the season and stunk up the field in the biggest game of his career

You can't take away the fact that he defended his belt for years. And you can't ignore the fact that Conor didn't. Every champion will tell you that it is harder to keep your belt than to win it. A lot of people have become champion. Not many have kept their championship for years. How many times has Conor defended his belts? Sure, he is good enough to beat champions. But is he good enough to beat everyone, year, after year, for years? That's greatness, my friend. You can't do that, you're not an all-time great.

 

[yookfarb]

You can't take away the fact that he defended his belt for years. And you can't ignore the fact that Conor didn't. Every champion will tell you that it is harder to keep your belt than to win it. A lot of people have become champion. Not many have kept their championship for years. How many times has Conor defended his belts? Sure, he is good enough to beat champions. But is he good enough to beat everyone, year, after year, for years? That's greatness, my friend. You can't do that, you're not an all-time great.

yea a lot of people have become champion even fewer have defended but only a couple of guys have become champion in multiple weight classes

 

[Shinobi]

yea a lot of people have become champion even fewer have defended but only a couple of guys have become champion in multiple weight classes

How many guys have been given the opportunity to fight for the title of the division above without having to go through all the other contenders? You think that's that great of an accomplishment? Do you realize that his LW title equals to ONE FIGHT, right? Just that. He beat ONE GUY, who wasn't even close to be undefeated, and that's what his title means. It means one fight.

 

[yookfarb]

How many guys have been given the opportunity to fight for the title of the division above without having to go through all the other contenders? You think that's that great of an accomplishment? Do you realize that his LW title equals to ONE FIGHT, right? Just that. He beat ONE GUY, who wasn't even close to be undefeated, and that's what his title means. It means one fight.

Aldo could've fought for the LW title against Pettis, Edgar, Benson... talked about it all the time but never actually did

and yea one fight that was a flawless brutal victory against the LW champion

 

[Shinobi]

Aldo could've fought for the LW title against Pettis, Edgar, Benson... talked about it all the time but never actually did

and yea one fight that was a flawless brutal victory against the LW champion

It doesn't matter. Was it one fight or it wasn't? His championship is one fight. That's a fact. It's like a football team winning the championship with just one game in the league. Just one game. Conor only beat Eddie at LW. That's some WWE shit right there.

As far as Aldo, my point stands. He defended his belt for years. Conor didn't. It's true that Aldo didn't move up to fight at LW, but it's also true that Conor is considerably bigger than Aldo. Look at the size difference between Conor and many of his FW opponents. It's just fucking massive. Him moving up to LW is really not that big of a deal.

And once again: Conor's championship is one fight. Everytime you repeat that he is a two time weight division champion, just remember that. And remember also him fighting a guy that wasn't properly prepared and was much, much shorter than him and still took him down several times and GNP'd him pretty hard. That alone tells you how beatable he is. That and his other losses, of course.

Not saying he is not a great fighter. But an all time great? Nahhh. I guarantee you: If Conor starts defending his belt consistently he will lose very soon. He just doesn't have the skill set to beat everyone. A decent sized good, strong wrestler, with solid striking and BJJ will give him a lot of problems and probably beat him. He is not a guy that you will see defending his belt for years. He doesn't have it in him.

 

[yookfarb]

It doesn't matter. Was it one fight or it wasn't? His championship is one fight. That's a fact. It's like a football team winning the championship with just one game in the league. Just one game. Conor only beat Eddie at LW. That's some WWE shit right there.

As far as Aldo, my point stands. He defended his belt for years. Conor didn't. It's true that Aldo didn't move up to fight at LW, but it's also true that Conor is considerably bigger than Aldo. Look at the size difference between Conor and many of his FW opponents. It's just fucking massive. Him moving up to LW is really not that big of a deal.

And once again: Conor's championship is one fight. Everytime you repeat that he is a two time weight division champion, just remember that. And remember also him fighting a guy that wasn't properly prepared and was much, much shorter than him and still took him down several times and GNP'd him pretty hard. That alone tells you how beatable he is. That and his other losses, of course.

Not saying he is not a great fighter. But an all time great? Nahhh. I guarantee you: If Conor starts defending his belt consistently he will lose very soon. He just doesn't have the skill set to beat everyone. A decent sized good, strong wrestler, with solid striking and BJJ will give him a lot of problems and probably beat him. He is not a guy that you will see defending his belt for years. He doesn't have it in him.

Aldo never had the skillset to deal with a great striker. That same really short guy that took Conor down a few times took Aldo through 5 brutal rounds of hell, knocked him down and badly hurt.

And seriously stop comparing prizefighting to soccer... fighters are judged by their greatest fights not how many times they defended their belts or how long they were ranked in the top 10, when ppl talk about Muhammad Ali they bring up the rumble in the jungle and when ppl talk about Jose Aldo years from now they will bring up 13 seconds first every time

 

[Shinobi]

Aldo never had the skillset to deal with a great striker. That same really short guy that took Conor down a few times took Aldo through 5 brutal rounds of hell, knocked him down and badly hurt.

And seriously stop comparing prizefighting to soccer... fighters are judged by their greatest fights not how many times they defended their belts or how long they were ranked in the top 10, when ppl talk about Muhammad Ali they bring up the rumble in the jungle and when ppl talk about Jose Aldo years from now they will bring up 13 seconds first every time

Chad Mendes never knocked down Aldo. Aldo knocked him down a bunch of times. That Chad Mendes was a much better fighter and in much better shape than the one Conor fought, and was never one single moment of that fight where he dominated Aldo in the same way he was able to dominate Conor.

And i disagree with you. No matter how you twist it, in all sports we can see the worst team beating the better team. The team who wins a specific game isn't always the best team overall. That's why we have a championship, so we can assess how consistent a team is with its performance. That's the only way to really know which is the best, because every team can have one bad night. If you were to judge them just based on one performance, you wouldn't really know which is the best team.

Same with fighting. There is a lot more value in going through all the contenders than simply winning one fight and becoming champion. And we have very strong evidence that winning the title doesn't make you the best. We also have strong evidence that KO'ing one person doesn't make you better than that person. In the rematch you can lose. That's why consistent dominance is very important. Otherwise, it's just a bad night for one guy.

 

[RandomUser12]

Yes, big Conor guy here but BJ is a stylistic nightmare for Conor. A competent striker with a granite chin and a great ground base to boot. I think BJ breaks him down and busts Conor up like he did to Sherk.