Civil War was about Slavery. Video inside

[Captain Davis]

I have to hand it to you, you are killing it in this thread and your posts are solid. You've certainly done a lot more research than I have. Good stuff.

The Civil War is a passion of mine and I still have a ton more to learn, but I'm completely intrigued by it.

I am blown away by the sheer bravery and conviction of the soldiers on both sides.

I have favorites on both sides

When it's all said and done, I believe the Confederacy had every right to secede and Lincoln completely overstepped his boundaries, but I believe we are better off as a nation that the Union won.

 

[DoomPatrol]

Can anyone who says it was about States rights and not just slavery actually name any other rights being infringed that are worth going to war and fracturing the nation over?

And why do the states admit it's about slavery in their own letters of secession?

 

[Captain Davis]

Right? Here's Alexander Stephens, Confederate VP, in his well loved (by the Southern rebel states) Cornerstone speech.

Our new government is founded upon exactly [this] idea; its foundations are laid, its corner-stone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery subordination to the superior race, is his natural and normal condition. This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth.

Wasn't about slavery at all........

Did you catch Lincoln's views on the negro?

I don't think anyone is arguing that slavery wasn't the bottom line. But there were many factors that were in play surrounding it.

We all know what the Ordinances of Secession said, but you have to know what the motivations behind those words were. You have to understand the history from the early 1800's until that point and all of the political juggling of that time period.

You also have to understand the ideological beliefs of the Republican Party as opposed to the Democrats and the flailing Whigs.

On the surface it seems obvious, but you must get into the weeds to see that it wasn't obvious at all.

 

[djacobox372]

What i'm saying is that its easy to sweep the civil war to be about nothing but slavery. That way you don't have to have an intellectual discussion about the arguments pro/con with the confederacy. minimizing the conflict to 'only slavery' rewrites history and doesn't provide a full context for both sides of the war but as we have seen with the massive censorship raids recently, many don't want dialogue, they want conformity

Tearing down history and rewriting the conflict...

You obviously haven't read the letters of secession. State by state, slavery and the failure of the north to enforce the fugitive slave act are the only issues brought up.

Read please: https://www.civilwar.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

The rewriting of history happened after the south lost the war and they tried like hell to make it more about southern heritage and "states rights."

We're restoring history to the original version of events, not rewriting it.

Obviously your a victim of that effort to rewrite history, it's unfortunate that so many people have been duped into tying their regional pride to symbols of slavers. I know that people love these symbols (statues and flags) for reasons that do not relate to slavery, but only because the history they were taught was rewritten and glossed over. It's not a coincidence that these monuments took 40 years to start appearing, that's how long it takes for a society to forget the truth.

 

[hillelslovak87]

Did you catch Lincoln's views on the negro?

I don't think anyone is arguing that slavery wasn't the bottom line. But there were many factors that were in play surrounding it.

We all know what the Ordinances of Secession said, but you have to know what the motivations behind those words were. You have to understand the history from the early 1800's until that point and all of the political juggling of that time period.

You also have to understand the ideological beliefs of the Republican Party as opposed to the Democrats and the flailing Whigs.

On the surface it seems obvious, but you must get into the weeds to see that it wasn't obvious at all.

Yes I did. His views were appallingly shitty, and yet, he fought to ensure people could not own other people, a gigantic rubicon for our nation. Stating that slavery in an injustice to be borne no more, and saying that it is your divinely inspired cornerstone of your nation are distinct sentiments.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

I'm not rehashing this here, but I'll leave this...

Without slavery, there would have been no Civil War

But not one soldier picked up a rifle in 1861 to free any slave.

This is porabbaly about as close as yo can get to this .

I like it. No, the war wasn't only about slavery, but if you don't think it was a war about slavery, you're missing the whole point. And the abolition of slavery was by far the most profound and long lasting effect of the war.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

You obviously haven't read the letters of secession. State by state, slavery and the failure of the north to enforce the fugitive slave act are the only issues brought up.

Read please: https://www.civilwar.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

The rewriting of history happened after the south lost the war and they tried like hell to make it more about southern heritage and "states rights."

We're restoring history to the original version of events, not rewriting it.

Obviously your a victim of that effort to rewrite history, it's unfortunate that so many people have been duped into tying their regional pride to symbols of slavers. I know that people love these symbols (statues and flags) for reasons that do not relate to slavery, but only because the history they were taught was rewritten and glossed over. It's not a coincidence that these monuments took 40 years to start appearing, that's how long it takes for a society to forget the truth.

Awesome point and great link to those sources. Thank you.

 

[*Z*]

The Civil War is a passion of mine and I still have a ton more to learn, but I'm completely intrigued by it.

I am blown away by the sheer bravery and conviction of the soldiers on both sides.

I have favorites on both sides

When it's all said and done, I believe the Confederacy had every right to secede and Lincoln completely overstepped his boundaries, but I believe we are better off as a nation that the Union won.

I have not done a ton of reading on it, but the more I do the more interesting it becomes. There's a lot more to it than just the slavery aspect, which was a big factor but there is a lot more to it. Any suggested sites or books I should check out?

 

[Phr3121]

At the start of 1861, several Southern states seceded to form their own union under the Constitution of the Confederate States. The South seceded largely over economic issues. Heavy-hitting tariffs on manufactured goods protected Northern industries while making Southern costs skyrocket. Meanwhile, 90 percent of the Union’s revenue came from those tariffs and then was spent to help the North.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Going to war to free slaves sounds far more noble than going to war over greed and political power.

At the same time for the South, going to war for "Our way of life" and "States rights" sounds a lot more noble than going to war to preserve their slave-based agrarian economy and society.

 

[GhostZ06]

Can we stop with the fiction that the Civil War was not about slavery.
It was and always will be about slavery.
The main point, is the south was an agriculture economy. They needed slavery in order to keep making money. The rich plantation owners did not want slavery to go away, because it would cut into the bottom line.
The statues belong in a museum, not on public property.

no it was not. it was about more then just one thing.

 

[Captain Davis]

Yes I did. His views were appallingly shitty, and yet, he fought to ensure people could not own other people, a gigantic rubicon for our nation. Stating that slavery in an injustice to be borne no more, and saying that it is your divinely inspired cornerstone of your nation are distinct sentiments.

He fought for money and political power. You read his own words and still believe he gave a shit, lol

This why it is ridiculous to get upset over things brought up in here.

Nobody is going to change their mind. They believe what they believe and that's fine.

I personally enjoy the debate. I certainly can understand other views, I just happen to believe Lincoln was a shrewd politician who did everything he could to satisfy his Republican friends and their interests. He cared nothing about slaves, he and his party just didn't need or want them involved in their business interests moving Westward.

 

[Captain Davis]

I have not done a ton of reading on it, but the more I do the more interesting it becomes. There's a lot more to it than just the slavery aspect, which was a big factor but there is a lot more to it. Any suggested sites or books I should check out?

I'm at work on a costruction site, lol

Shoot me a pm.

 

[Captain Davis]

At the same time for the South, going to war for "Our way of life" and "States rights" sounds a lot more noble than going to war to preserve their slave-based agrarian economy and society.

Like I said, there were many things tied to slavery. And the whole 10th Amendment argument that had nothing to do with slavery. The 10th Anendment gave rights to the states for anything not covered in the Constitution. Lincoln and the Republicans believed in the "perpetual union" theory. So that was an issue too.

 

[hillelslovak87]

He fought for money and political power. You read his own words and still believe he gave a shit, lol

This why it is ridiculous to get upset over things brought up in here.

Nobody is going to change their mind. They believe what they believe and that's fine.

I personally enjoy the debate. I certainly can understand other views, I just happen to believe Lincoln was a shrewd politician who did everything he could to satisfy his Republican friends and their interests. He cared nothing about slaves, he and his party just didn't need or want them involved in their business interests moving Westward.

I dont particularly care about the fact that Lincoln never wanted Blacks to be able to be judges or civil servants, or vote, or really be equal. I care about what he did. He changed the system in a way in which even his own horseshit would erode away.

 

[Phr3121]

 

[Pickle Rick]

I find it hilarious that there are deniers and doubters after watching this.
but but im a stranger on the internet so i know the troooof

 

[Captain Davis]

Y'all do realize there are hundreds of these types of videos pro and con on YouTube right?

 

[Captain Davis]

I dont particularly care about the fact that Lincoln never wanted Blacks to be able to be judges or civil servants, or vote, or really be equal. I care about what he did. He changed the system in a way in which even his own horseshit would erode away.

Well, Lincoln really didn't free anyone, the 13th Anendment did. Lincoln never had intentions of freeing the slaves. At the onset of the war no one was fighting to free slaves.

But, we can look at the outcome of all of it and see that good came from it.

 

[*Z*]

This video really muddied the waters for me on this issue, a lot of really good info.