CHOCOLATITO = HYPE JOB | Page 4

Discussion in 'Boxing Discussion' started by Robbie Corleone, Sep 11, 2017.

  1. moosaev Blue Belt

    moosaev
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    Mexican and British top level fighters have the advantage of fan bases who understand loyalty. Ricky Burns is shot to hell and he'd still get half of Scotland coming out for his next doomed title fight.
     
    #61
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  2. moosaev Blue Belt

    moosaev
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    I remember this fight. I'd never seen a visibly smaller guy walk down the bigger man (who's also a P4P type fighter) quite like that before. IT was very impressive.
     
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  3. Hagler Man of wealth and taste

    Hagler
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    Well, he may have trouble making 115, but sticking for a year or two around will do more for his legacy than quickly getting a belt at 118.
     
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  4. senri The belt that resides inside you

    senri
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    I can see that new unripened flesh has arrived in the boxing forum.
     
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  5. moosaev Blue Belt

    moosaev
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    how do you prefer the flesh?
     
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  6. senri The belt that resides inside you

    senri
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    Tender, moist, and marbeled after gorged with marinated juices.
     
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  7. KantoTerror Silver Belt

    KantoTerror
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    I knew with Chocolate's style it's just a matter of time until he faces a heavy puncher who will manage to eat his punches and chug along....and he won't able to take what he can dish...just another Arguello-Pryor...
     
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  8. chiefwiggum Black Belt

    chiefwiggum
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    I always loved his fights. As he moved up his opponents could take what he gave and he had a hard time taking it back.

    Fun fighter . Very good career.
     
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  9. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    Inoue is good, no need to worry about him. But what's the topic about, have you read the thread title?

    Gonzalez went out on a duck. Such a shame.

    And following the loss he's considering retiring. That only adds weight to why he may have avoided the Inoue unification in the first place. He couldn't handle the idea of losing.
     
    #69
  10. Dr. Will White Belt

    Dr. Will
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    Roman Gonzalez was not a hype job. He is an all-time great in the lowest weight classes. As people only judge Gonzalez's recent performances, they would be baffled that this same boxer actually beat Juan Francisco Estrada who was impressive last Saturday night.
    He bit off more than he could chew at this weight class and should've moved back down if he was able.
     
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  11. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    Great flyweight and light-flyweight.

    Overrated and protected Super flyweight. It is what it is.

    He fought competition of his generation or older (like 36yr old Edgar Sosa; or 30yr old Soto, Solado, Vargas while Roman was 24) but avoided anyone from the newer generation (basically anyone 5 years younger). His title wins are against people a generation older than him, but he denied the young blood that same shot.
     
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  12. Dr. Will White Belt

    Dr. Will
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    Surely he can't be 'overrated' at Super Flyweight when he had only recently ventured into Super Flyweight? I'm not sure I understand what you mean by 'protected' as he was actually fighting dangerous, high-risk low reward fighters like Sor Rungvisai and fought an excellent Carlos Cuadras, and beat Cuadras despite giving up all advantages to Cuadras.

    Does he even need to be good at Super Flyweight? We didn't have the same demands for Jung Koo-Chang who stayed at Light Flyweight his whole career and ended up a great fighter in his own right, so why for Gonzalez?

    The names you listed are not even the best wins on his resume but they were decent wins as they added to the breadth of his resume. Sometimes great fighters don't have great names on their resume.
    He wasn't bad at Super Flyweight objectively speaking. After all, Roman Gonzalez was robbed against Sor Rungvisai in the first fight, he also beat Carlos Cuadras - remembering that he just wasn't as good at that weight.
     
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  13. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    Read my post. All are of them were his generation age-wise. He went out of his way to deny Naoya Inoue a unification match to take Srisaket Sor Rungvisai. Fortunately or unfortunately, it backfired on him.

    The names I listed were the ones grossly older than him, the rest were around his age. He avoided people younger, like Inoue. Even claimed they couldn't afford him, as if the Thais really dropped big bucks right. Inoue tried for a year to get him to fight.
     
    #73
  14. Dr. Will White Belt

    Dr. Will
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    I had to do a bit of research and it appears Roman Gonzalez was getting greedy for bigger paychecks as he debuted with HBO. He turned down Inoue because Inoue didn't offer him a good purse - whether this is true or not is something beyond my reach.
    He did earn $600,000 for the rematch against Sor Rungvisai, that's huge for a fighter so small up against an obscure fighter.

    I agree I think his resume is lacking a multitude of very top names. Sosa and Viloria were not in their definitive primes.

    He has some other good fighters on his resume such as Takayama who went on to win a world title a few times afterward, Yaegashi was an underrated fighter who never came back from the loss to Chocolatito despite winning and defending the world title a few times. There is also the P4P boxer Juan Francisco Estrada who looks better than his fellow Mexican and highly lauded Canelo Alvarez.

    As far as I can see, he did fight the best other than Inoue and maybe Ruenroeng who I've read should've lost to Ioka.

    Despite all of this, still a better resume than the great Finito Lopez.

    Age is a very grey area in combat sports. Some people are done at different ages.
     
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  15. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    I'm very proud of your response, and for looking into it deeply.

    Gonzalez wasn't a bad guy, he was a great fighter coming up. He had age on his side alongside his talent. But as you noted, he got greedy, while HBO and some spectators began overrating him and protecting him.

    I'm getting flack for this, but mark my word a year or two from now. Everyone will have figured it out, that in his final years he deliberately avoided fighting against the youth. The Inoue duck shall not be forgotten. He has a better resume than a LOT of guys in his weight range, true, but most of those guys weren't called p4p #1.
     
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  16. cuban23 Black Belt

    cuban23
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    I don't believe he had the skills to be ranked no.1 P4P. That spot is reserved for the select few. In the last decade only 3 fighters have been ranked no.1 P4P by Ring Magazine : Manny, Floyd, Andre Ward. But I do think he deserved to be ranked in the top 10. How high in the top 10 is up for debate. He clearly beat some quality fighters and has moved up to win a belt in 4 weight classes. His style and his tactics just weren't enough against bigger and stronger fighters.

    What I also noticed, and found disturbing, is people relishing the demise of his career. He was a great and humble champion who will be a HOFer when his career is done. Watching his family cry as he lay unconscious was tough to watch. I found that classless by HBO to immediately cut to his wife after he gets knocked out.
     
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  17. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    Can't really fault HBO here, they want what's best for TV. And a reaction like that is considered priceless.

    A lot of the hate, is just a reaction. HBO and Ring overdid it with their marketing, and hence, why people are labeling him a hypejob. Look how people laughed at Conor and Rousey, two fighters who were touted as being larger-than-life, that they could even beat Floyd.

    Then compare that to the mass reaction to Horn and Pacquiao. The vast majority of people came to Pac's defense. Even now its Horn and Arum who gets shit.
     
    #77
  18. cuban23 Black Belt

    cuban23
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    The difference is Conor and Ronda deserved it. Roman did not.
     
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  19. Sakuraba7 Brown Belt

    Sakuraba7
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    Equal and opposite reaction.

    Had he lost to Inoue, people would give him his props for losing to the younger guy, someone 6 years younger. But he took and lost to Srisaket who is just 1 year younger. It would be a "passing of the torch" for him, and you and everyone else here would be pointing it out (age gap). Instead, its just me pointing it out.
     
    #79
  20. Sunfish Martinez Belt

    Sunfish
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    Are people saying chocolatito hasn't had an extremely good career? If anyone in here genuinely believes he is either p4p1 and if he isn't that makes him a hype job, fuck off back to the heavies and listen to the wise words of uncle roger.
     
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