Chael Sonnen : Sambo sucks, Khabib is a wrestler, not a Sambo player...

[RichardN7]

Sure there is. Plenty of honest to goodness folk style American HS/collegiate wrestling in MMA. It's the toughest combat sport on earth & dominates mma for a reason. See Ben Askren. Colby Covington. Woodley, Cormier.

Idk about toughest. I’d say striking is much tougher. Getting thrown around - anyone can handle. Getting beat the fuck up and KOd... not so much.

 

[Blazmo]

Idk about toughest. I’d say striking is much tougher. Getting thrown around - anyone can handle. Getting beat the fuck up and KOd... not so much.

How did the BJJ guys fare?

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Sure there is. Plenty of honest to goodness folk style American HS/collegiate wrestling in MMA. It's the toughest combat sport on earth & dominates mma for a reason. See Ben Askren. Colby Covington. Woodley, Cormier.

Oh man, I must of missed the practices where we learned how to punch. Damn it!

 

[RichardN7]

How did the BJJ guys fare?

In my experience, they did really well in the times we were focusing on BJJ only, or wrestling+ground fighting.
However, in free sparring, not too well. They tend to do well against wrestlers, but strikers like me would stuff their mediocre takedowns and just beat them up.
It seems like out of the triad of skills - striking, wrestling and grappling, you have to pick two to get really good at. A striker needs either sharp jitz or solid defensive wrestling. A wrestler needs good top control to work after taking the opponent down, or good striking to threaten with and interchange takedowns and overhands. A jitz guy needs wrestling to take his opponent down and use his subs, or good enough striking to make the opponent shoot on him and into a submission.
Etc etc.
Wrestlers get talked up a lot, but wrestlers alone are helpless as well. They get tagged on the way in and subbed after a TD.
You have to be rounded.

 

[moreorless87]

Absolutely pure combat sambo is obviously doing to have the disadvantage its working via a system were theres limited ground time. You can see that in Fedor's very early fights like Arona for example where he gives up position being aggressive too much.

 

[moreorless87]

American Folkstyle Wrestling>>>>>everything else.

Theres a reason Nurmawhatever trains at AKA & not some Sambo academy lmfao

Although I would argue AKA are not actually that typical for most US camps, I think they've always shown more of a kind of relentless attack mixing striking and grappling with Cormier and Cain that's actually rather like combat sambo.

Honestly I think if you look at guys like Fedor and Khabib who came from Judo/Wrestling though Combat Sambo to MMA the transition seems much better than Judoka like Akiyama, Karo or Ishii who went more the standard MMA route. The problem for me is that a lot of US based MMA training especially is focused on wrestlers, training a style that works more for your standard freestylish fighter looking to time shoots rather than chaining in clinch work and rather tame controlling groundwork.

 

[ortizgnp]

On a serious note it's kinda fun to see that people still don't know when Lord Chael is being serious or when he's trolling for attention.

He's a wizard.

 

[MMonk]

Chael would absolutely STEAMROLL Khabib.

It will be nice when Fedor steamrolls Chael with leglock or armbar from Sambo!

 

[MMonk]

Sambo does suck for mma. It is mostly judo and with no gi it wont have longevity in real fighting, no matter how skilled you will be figured out eventually. Wrestling will always be effective.

You are wrong.

Sambo is much more powerfull than Judo with much richer technique.
Olympic Judo is a castrated version of real grappling it's like Taekwondo of grappling.

Fedor proved how effective Sambo is.

And Khabib uses blend of wrestling, Sambo and a lot of other grappling styles.

 

[Boomb]

Why does anyone even care about what Chael says?

 

[ssBaldy]

LOL

Chael obviously has not seen the footage of Khabib off his back (which admittedly is rare).

I agree that Khabib uses a wrestling-heavy style, but he doesn't just pull his sub game from 'wrestling', or his arse. Sambo is a LEGIT martial art, and not to be trifled with. Their leg / foot attacks are gnarly.

Khabib is wrestling-heavy with his style, but even there, he uses a lot of trips, throws, and subs that are a combination of traditional wrestling AND Sambo.

What say you here....Is Shael correct that Khabib is using primarily pure wrestling with little Sambo, or is his style a blend of the two grappling styles?

Chael talks out of his ass here.
When I watch Khabib's fights, I see exactly what they taught us at Sambo school, executed flawlessly.

 

[Readybodisready]

You are wrong.

Sambo is much more powerfull than Judo with much richer technique.
Olympic Judo is a castrated version of real grappling it's like Taekwondo of grappling.

Fedor proved how effective Sambo is.

And Khabib uses blend of wrestling, Sambo and a lot of other grappling styles.

I knew Fedor would be brought up, he is actually my example not yours.

Eventually his clinch no-gi takedowns were figured out and two BJJ black belts exposed his lack of defense against the finer techniques of jiu jitsu. Being mounted and laying there "waiting for an opening to explode out". Yeah that worked out well against Silva.

Sambo is no long term skill set for mma it is a waste of time especially the striking.

 

[ithinktheymad]

You are wrong.

Sambo is much more powerfull than Judo with much richer technique.
Olympic Judo is a castrated version of real grappling it's like Taekwondo of grappling.

Fedor proved how effective Sambo is.

And Khabib uses blend of wrestling, Sambo and a lot of other grappling styles.

They need to have special markers on this forum to prove what people trained in otherwise it's too easy to talk out your ass. Even under the umbrella of something like Combat Sambo(vs Sport or Freestyle) there are different ways to play and different eras. Judo in Japan in the 70's is much different than Judo in the States in the 80's and so on. They are not just one monolithic entity, just like BJJ.

 

[RichardN7]

Then why don't strikers dominate MMA?

Woodley, Stipe, TJ, Cody, MM are all as much strikers as they are wrestlers, if not more. Hollogay, Conor, Whittaker... all strikers.
Strikers have made a serious resurgence recently.
Also, I was referring more to the mental toughness which is required in striking. Banging is a much more daunting task than rolling. I can roll for days. Sparring skilled strikers though... not something I always look forward to.

 

[Arm Barbarian]

Hollogay

 

[Ilovepizza]

these comments here


mma/ufc fans

are the worst type of fans

 

[MMACroatia]

American Folkstyle Wrestling>>>>>everything else.

Theres a reason Nurmawhatever trains at AKA & not some Sambo academy lmfao

 

[MMonk]

I knew Fedor would be brought up, he is actually my example not yours.

Eventually his clinch no-gi takedowns were figured out and two BJJ black belts exposed his lack of defense against the finer techniques of jiu jitsu. Being mounted and laying there "waiting for an opening to explode out". Yeah that worked out well against Silva.

Sambo is no long term skill set for mma it is a waste of time especially the striking.

Well, after a lot of fights and injuries he got exposed by two roided up BJJ fighters,
one of them was bigger than Fedor by 50+ pounds.

Sambo has proven itself and keeps being proven by Khabib, Islam, Rustam, Minakov and other
fighters that are coming.

Of course they mix it with wrestling and others, but Werdum and Bigfoot also cross train in
Judo, wrestling, muay thai, boxing, etc.

No pure martial art right now.

And when there were, Taktarov did pretty well.

 

[MMonk]

American Folkstyle Wrestling>>>>>everything else.

Theres a reason Nurmawhatever trains at AKA & not some Sambo academy lmfao

He is primarely trained by his father, who blends wrestling, sambo, etc.

AKA guys also cross train, they are not just wrestlers like Hammer House - Coleman, Randleman.

 

[MadDogMahoney]

MMA in general sucks though, to be fair