Chael and Vitor were on PEDS vs jones

look at Jones' first fight in the UFC, such a skilled guy wow
 
You guys must have forgotten the part where Jones' toe was literally folded sideways, with the bone hanging out.

YES, had Chael survived that round, he would have won, because no doctor would have allowed Jon to answer the bell for round 2.

Not saying he "beat" Jon per se, but he would have been awarded the victory, had the fight continued.

I think Jones could have finished that fight earlier than he did. I think he took him down 3 times and let him up twice. It looked like Jon wanted to prove to everyone that he could smash Sonnen in the wrestling department before he beat him. The toe I don't care about, Jon finished him brutally, that's all anyone remembers.
 
How do “real” fans know he is clean?

They can taste his load is clean, when they're bob knobbin' on their knees, blowing him like it's the last Dick to suck on earth. It's scientific method, just like that Scientology cans BS machine he was lying to. Fuckin' thing probably went 8.0 Reichter scale and everyone took cover thinking a quake was hitting. Nope. Just another Bobes truth.
 
Prime Chuck got destroyed by prime Rampage, smartass (2003, not the 2007 rematch, in case you don't know anything). He also got whooped by Alistair before he got that one punch in. Don't ever mention Chuck Liddell among the LHW greats.

lol! Thanks for proving my point for me! How could I forget... That's right, Chuck flatlined a career HW who's still relevant in a division Jones spent his career ducking.

Inorite? He only fights middleweights.
 
Because they were half his size?

And oddly enough, he almost DID lose against both guys.

TRTtor popped his elbow, and he folded his toe into horror movie status against Shael.
Sure he broke his toe, but remind me if the part of the fight were he was almost losing to Chael? What exactly did Chael do that had him winning?
 
Sure he broke his toe, but remind me if the part of the fight were he was almost losing to Chael? What exactly did Chael do that had him winning?

You're not thinking whole picture here.

HAD Chael survived that round, there's no way doctors would have let Jones answer the 2nd round.

Hence, Sonnen would have won via Dr Stoppage.
 
Better not mention Wanderlei either then. And I don't accept the excuse that him and Chuck fought out of their primes that the Pride-fanboys parrot.

Chuck was on a worse skid when they fought, and never manged to beat anyone again, iirc. Wand had more success after that, which is a logical indication that he had not declined any worse than Chuck (and arguably less) when they fought. Chuck was one of the LHW greats and matched up well with Wand. With Rampage? Not so much.

I would argue that any matchup with fighters out of their prime doesn't matter. It's just not the same fighter, and the outcome does not reflect the skills the fighters had at their prime.

Would I mention Shogun-Chuck? Nope.
Would I mention Rampage-Chuck II? Nope.

What interests me is how Chuck was doing in his prime against proper competition, and sorry, that was not Tito. Rampage never was PRIDE champion, he was always only a contender, and he thoroughly outclassed Chuck, standing, and on the ground, in a 10+ minute fight. Chuck had NOTHING.

Chuck was the champ in what was back then the #2 organisation, and couldn't hang in the #1 organisation. That does not spell "LHW great" to me.
 
The eye test for vitor was so obvious. His shoulder caps alone- lol
 
You're not thinking whole picture here.

HAD Chael survived that round, there's no way doctors would have let Jones answer the 2nd round.

Hence, Sonnen would have won via Dr Stoppage.
Jones beat Chael in his own game. Even the American gangster was surprised that Jones chose to wrestle him ... Very impressive win
 
I think Jones is the LHW GOAT regardless of roids or not, but using wins over two MWs as proof of his GOATness is just silly.
 
I feel like the majority of guys that faced Jon were on peds except for:

- Machida
- Gus
- DC

Of course its still possible that they we're also on PEDS, but I seriously doubt it, especially considering how both DC and Gus have been fighting for years now in the USADA era.
So, seeing as how he struggled BIG TIME with Gus, and had a fairly close contest with DC, its pretty safe to say that PEDS might have been the difference maker in those fights. Jon without his PEDS might have been been finished by Gus and ragdolled by DC. And even better, forget if the contest was fair, what if the roles were reversed, what if clean Jon faced roided Gus and DC? In Brendan Schaubs wise words, he would get absolutely m m m m merkeddddd!!!

So GOAT status:

41386362-rubber-stamp-with-word-declined-inside-vector-illustration.jpg
 
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I love how far Jones has fallen, all his worshipers have left is repeating 'still GOAT' or 'everyone on PEDs'.

Reality a gangly HW that took a lot of steroids and used his frame and size with illegal substance to beat up MWs. Gus and Cormier both nearly beat Juicey Jones, he knew what would've happend without them.
 
Sure he broke his toe, but remind me if the part of the fight were he was almost losing to Chael? What exactly did Chael do that had him winning?

The fight would have been called had Sonnen made it to the end of round 1.
 
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